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Parenting

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Original poster

DD reckons we're not strict enough with DS#2

53 replies

OrmIrian · 22/10/2009 11:48

Sorry to bleat about DS#2 again

Last night at my parents there was an incident when DS#2 pushed his sister over and made her drop her lego model so that it smashed. She was very upset (understandably) and had a go at DS#2 - ranted on at him for ages! We were in a bit of a hurry, it was raining and dark so I didn't say much to DS at the time intending to have a proper word later. Once we were in the car I told DS off - made him apologise. However DD cried all the way home.

When i was getting her into bed she had a right strop - told me that I was too soft on DS, that he was horrible, and that I must be stricter with him. She is also convinced that he pretends to do things that he can really do because he's 'lazy'. It's no good my telling her that DS#1 was the same at that age - all she can think of is that she wasn't and that DS#2 should be made to do things. She was very very angry.

Now I can see her POV. He is difficult. And without a doubt his behaviour impacts on all the family. But he is about to be referred to the SENCO as his new teacher has realised there is something not 'right' about his behaviour. And DH and I are run ragged by him and trying to cope with him. Being any 'stricter' would have to involve beating him with a big stick and shoving him in the cellar

How do I deal with this. I can see that she feels shortchanged sometimes and although DS is cute he doesn't give a great deal in terms of affection - it tends to be one-way traffic. When he knocked DD over his first response was 'it wasnt my fault' not that he was sorry for what he's done.

She already tries to 'help' with DS#2 - mainly by bossing him about and shouting at him (which does no good btw). Can we bring her on board in some more positive way.

BTW DS#1 feels similarly - he admits he loses his temper with him (and always apologises afterwards as he knows it makes DS#2 worse) but his life is more outside the house than DD's is. It seems easier for him.

OP posts:

Takver · 23/10/2009 12:15

Good luck . . . I think it does also talk about how to deal with 'unfairness' between siblings - but we only have the one dd so didn't read that bit

saintmaybe · 23/10/2009 12:18

Do you know the senco? Does he/ she seem on the ball? And it might be helpful for your dh to be in on that meeting. Rather than you following it up and him feeling on the edge, even though it might not be road you all end up going down.

Aw, you sound weary. Can you make a date with your dd to do something nice, not nec to chat, but a movie or something? And be nice to yourself.

flashharriet · 23/10/2009 12:20

Saintmaybe's post is spot on. I think it's really hard when you're the parent of both of them but they have such different and conflicting needs. It really does sound like DD just wants to be heard and have a good rant (is there a Kidsnet? ) and I also think everyone will cope better when you have some proper answers as to what DS2's issues are.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Families General parenting

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 12:22

I know her by sight saint and I have chatted to her sometimes in school but never had any dealings with her about my DC. I've heard she is very good and she is certainly pleasant and approachable. If we need to see her about DS#2 DH will be dragged along kicking and screaming if need be!

OP posts:

Takver · 23/10/2009 12:51

Even if the SENCO doesn't feel that your DS has SEN as such, they may be able to help - my DD has an IEP relating to dealing with her behaviour in school, and was referred to the county 'behaviour specialist', can't remember her exact title (who, according to dd, 'just chatted and talked about all the sorts of things that you're always talking about with friends and sharing'). I don't know if it helped her, but things did seem to get a bit better.

Fennel · 23/10/2009 13:24

Even if ds2 doesn't have a SN the techniques to deal with a child with behavioural special needs can be used on "normal" children quite effectively too, I think. you can pick up hints on the SN board. I lurk there as we look after quite a few children with ASD and other challenging behaviours, and run a youth group with several children with particularly challenging behaviour in too, so I am paying a lot of attention to how to deal with these things at the moment.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 14:16

fennel - I will try that. Anything that might make life easier atm.

I have written this to give to DD. I want her to understand. When I talk to her I find it difficult to say everything I want to. Is this OTT or just plain naff.

" I am so sorry for this morning. There was no excuse for my losing my temper and shouting like that. I know how difficult J can be and how hard you find him to deal with. We all do. It?s OK to say how you feel about him ? how angry he makes you but it would be better if you said it to me or dad, not to J. Come and let off steam to me sometimes if you need to. But don?t take it out on him. I think there may be something not quite right about J ? not just his being a bit naughty and stubborn. Hopefully Mrs Ta at school will be able to see whether she thinks there is or not. Anyway, J will carry on being J no matter what name we put to his behaviour.

But the most important thing is that I am afraid you will come to think we don?t love you as much as J because he gets so much time and attention. I just want you to know that that is NOT true. Not at all. You are very much loved and cherished. In fact I couldn?t imagine a daughter I could love and care for more, or be more proud of. You are clever, beautiful, kind, sensible, hard-working, funny, loving. And you have a lovely life ahead of you. Whatever else happens in ours lives please always remember that dad and I love you.

That?s all,

Lots and lots of love

Mum

OP posts:

stealthsquiggle · 23/10/2009 15:12

I think writing her a letter is a good way to deal with it - that way, any time you can find for just you and her can be spent forgetting about it and doing something fun, rather than being all about DS2, IYSWIM.

Plus, hopefully, it will make her feel all grown up and important.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 15:15

Thankyou stealth. DS has been invited to a party at 4 so I can bring him back from riding, DH can take him to the party and then DD and I can have the rest of the afternoon together. And, as you say, not waste in on DS-related angst.

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flashharriet · 23/10/2009 15:20

Gosh that's a lovely letter OrmIrian

fluffles · 23/10/2009 15:26

awww.. that's lovely.

i like the way you've invited her to let off steam to you.

when i was 10 my only brother was only 3 and in behaving like a typical 3yo he was probably as annoying to me as your DS is to your DD. my problem was that my parents NEVER let me say how annoying he was. ever. i had to bottle it up as they gave me a row if i was mean about him. i hated that. i think it's great that you've invited her to let of steam to you and that you'll empathise with her if she does.

good luck.

truthisinthewine · 23/10/2009 15:45

Sorry no advice but what a lovely letter. Made me cry.

dittany · 23/10/2009 15:56

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 16:01

If you think it neccessary dittany I think the spirit of the apology is enough surely.

Do you think either of them would appreciate being late for school?

OP posts:

dittany · 23/10/2009 16:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

saintmaybe · 23/10/2009 16:18

I think it's a lovely letter, orm.

It makes it really clear that you're open to talking about it with her, and that nothing's off-limits.

I might not put the specifics about 'something not quite right' in writing, though, just in case he ever were to seee it. You can say that to her face to face.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 16:20

Yes. Perhaps it would be OK to be late once or twice if I honestly though that it would only be once or twice. DS had a habit of not 'learning his lesson' after once or twice. I wish he did. All our lives would be better. The whole problem with DS is that he doesn't learn. This is an ongoing situation that we all have to deal with.

And I do think that a general apology is enough. I express how I feel about her. If I am going to be explicit about every part of the incident I should I make DD apologise for kicking her brother. And then make her brother apologies for messing up her toys.

Do you honestly think the tone of the letter is not sufficiently sorry or loving?

OP posts:

dittany · 23/10/2009 16:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

stealthsquiggle · 23/10/2009 16:27

I think it is fine. As you say - if you apologise, she has to, DS2 has to - the general "I was out of order, I'm sorry, let's move on" sentiment of the letter is clear.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 16:32

dittany - I don't mind her telling her brother off for doing things that she doesn't like. I do mind her saying 'I hate you J, I just really really hate you'. Would you class that as acceptable self-expression towards a younger sibling? And yes, to a certain extent she is going to have to put up with it, just as we do. What can we do dittany that we aren't? Please spend some time with my boy and tell me because I am at the end of my rope.

OP posts:

Original poster

OrmIrian · 23/10/2009 16:34

THanks stealth. I thought it was OK too.

OP posts:

dittany · 23/10/2009 16:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Takver · 23/10/2009 17:48

I thought your letter was lovely.

My dd also wouldn't learn from the experience of being late - she would hate being late, she would be utterly regretful at having caused it - but she still wouldn't be any quicker / different the next time (the same is absolutely true of activities that she loves to go to, and waits for all week, not just school).

Fennel · 23/10/2009 18:24

I have done that kicking a child who's just kicked another to show them how it feels too, just once. I don't think that's the worst thing a parent can do, though perhaps it's not ideal, it's not something I would feel too bad about.

letter is nice.

I know my dd2 (8) finds it very unfair when we tell her off and other children seem to get away with worse behaviour, but I do keep explaining to her that they aren't actually getting away with it. That it may seem like that but actually Child A (boy with appalling behaviour in her class, we babysit him sometimes, when we can't wriggle out of it) is never invited to parties or people's houses or trusted to go out alone and so it may seem that adults are too soft on him but he does actually miss out because of his behaviour. and so on, Child B (boy who rocks gently under tables rather than join in) isn't actually getting away with not joining in with things that other children have to do, he's being dealt with but after the event.

That all sounds quite long-winded but dd2 does get it, though we have to keep reminding her, that good behaviour in the end IS rewarded in various ways, and bad behaviour DOES mean the child misses out. It takes lots of talking to remind her of this. but it sounds relevant for Orm's dd.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 24/10/2009 10:26

WHen I got home DD came and gave me a big tight hug. Didn't say a word. She didn't see the letter till she went to bed and then she gave me another huge hun and said sorry. Which wasn't quite what was expected, but hey. I said sorry too and we are looking forward to a nice afternoon.

OP posts:

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