'Chinese Prefolds' vs. Fitted / 'Shaped' Nappies

[hub2dee]

Hi all,

Was hoping for some experienced advice...

I've been e-mailing Erica at Simons Custom Cloth about her nappies and wraps - to learn more about how they're made and whether they might be good for our new (first) baby. Love the fabrics, prints, customisation options, design etc. etc. Gallery here.

She mentioned that although her nappies would give excellent containment for breastfed explosive poo, that for economy, it might be as wise to consider Chinese Prefolds (or 'Diaper Service Quality' as they're called in the States which are basically an elaboration on the flat Terry / muslin, but with much improved absorbency because they are 4 layered to the sides and 8 layered in the middle... you just fold them to make a rectangle, spread out the top if you need to, and pop into a wrap of some description.

I get the impressions loads of people use this, particularly in the States, as they're so effective and cheap - about $25 for twelve -that's just over a quid each ! 'Bummi Super Whisper Wrap' was suggested as a great, basic wrap too.

So.... I am specifically wondering if there are any experienced cloth users who have used 'Chinese Prefolds' (which isn't the same thing as a Terry done with a 'Chinese' origami fold, but in the same spirit IYSWIM), and fitted nappies (Tots Bots, Motherease, kissaluvs etc. etc. etc.)... do the prefolds leak more and give so much more grief that the more expensive fitted nappies are really worth it, or is it essentially all marketing elaboration (aside from cuteness factor - which I can still achieve with a wicked wrap ) ?

[Magscat]

Hi Hub. Hope you're not feeling too overwhelmed with info cos I'm going to add more. I bought pre-folds from www.yummies.biz They are based in Brighton and are very freindly - a normal working Mum of at least 2 who is only too happy to offer advice as well as sell all the pre-folds and wraps you need (and other bits & pieces). I also bought Pro-wraps from Yummies. These are pretty basic - no fancy patterns -but they have lasted through 3 kids and are very efficient, easy to wash and my kids have never had nappy rash. They are a good shape & pretty effective at preventing leaks.

I haven't found the wet cotton of pre-folds to be a problem and when it came to potty training I think it helps because they recognise they are wet sooner. (NB. I do change them every couple of hours though so I don't know if you can go longer with other nappies).

Definately check out Eco Babes & Nappy Lady websites and think about getting a trial pack of a few different types or maybe contacting the Women's Environmental Network - they run the Real Nappy Network and can tell you what's available in your area: www.wen.org.uk/nappies/

Good luck and good on you for going cotton

PS - If you want a really good safe bleach try Ecover laundry bleach (available in Morrisons, Sainsburys, Tescos etc..)

[hub2dee]

Hmmm... interesting, Magscat. The prefolds they sell look pretty much like the American ones. I'm sure there's a handful of varieties on the same theme. It's also a 4X8X4 prefold.

Good news that you never ran into problems with them. Did you use them on the infamous 'breastfed explosive poos' (seems to be the universal test) ?

I looked at the WEN site several times over the last month, especially as it is nappy week soonish... but I've never really been able to fathom out anything sensible in terms of useful events in London, but will look again. Not sure the Real Nappy Network is still publicy active (please correct me if I'm wrong) - whenever I come across their home page it's just a placeholder message (again, correct me if I'm wrong).

Thanks again for the info.

[giraffeski]

Message withdrawn

[giraffeski]

Message withdrawn

[eidsvold]

I used my terries/muslins and just origami folded them with the fleece liner... at first it took me a little while to get the fold right - but in no time I was doing it in my sleep. Good thing is now she is bigger - terries are being kite folded. Have just had a load of prefolds arrive with some baby clothes from the UK. Will use the prefolds when dd2 is older and the poo is firmer.

Use plastic pilchers - like little pants rather than wraps. I can get the terry quite tight around her legs - no leaks...

The origami/chinese fold is good - one pin in the middle - when little .... then nippas with the kite fold.

Have never used fitted nappies.

[eidsvold]

and yes - my dd2 - is the queen of explosive poos........

[hub2dee]

Thanks for the input, eidsvold.

Hope the clothes look great and fit nicely ! Don't know what you're taste / budget / age range your looking at is, but My Puku had a sale on a little while back with a few cute, simple clothes available.

(Are you in NZ or have I got that wrong ? Hope the clothes I'm pointing to don't come from there !!!!!)

[chipmonkey]

I'm with starlover on the Fuzzi-bunz. I know you could use a fleece liner with the prefolds but with the fuzzi-bunz {and the Minki} the nappy itself is completely enclosed. The fuzzi-bunz are soooo thin, nearly like a disposable and the inside is so soft, its gorgeous! If you're trying Minkis get the Slinky minki, I found the standard one very bulky. You're better off I think getting one or two of each to start before getting a whole "birth-to-potty" pack. I am now going to order more Fuzzi-bunz. If I had gone with the cheapest, it would be Bambino Mio. If I had gone with what's popular, it would have been Tots Bots but now I've tried a few, I've been able to make my own decision. I have found www.ragbags.co.uk to be an excellent site for variety and the layout is easy to navigate.

[bobbybob]

I use an excellent wrap called NIX NAP which a lady in Northland NZ makes for under a fiver a time. Try a google.

You still need some sort of prefold (I use a normal nappy folded up, but my ds is 2)

I have never had a leak and they wash and dry quickly.

Bet she'll post to the UK.

[eidsvold]

I am in Aus hub2dee - well asked my wonderful mil to send some clothes that we had stored at their place prior to our move out/back here and she sent the unisex bag - some great clothes for a friend who is due to have a babe in the next little while and some baby gros for dd2 but forget to tell mil about the bag of wonderful girls clothes that dd1 had and are also packed up at her house ( silly me!)

[giraffeski]

Message withdrawn

[Magscat]

Hi again Hub. Yes, I used the pre-folds with breast fed, explosive poo babies. I don't think it's the nappy itself that makes the difference but the wrap. If it's a good fitting wrap, it shouldn't be a problem with whatever kind of nappy you have. (Providing you wash them a couple of times first to increase the absorbancy).

Re. Real Nappy Network/WEN. I'm not sure how active they are. I'm in Bradford and we had a demo of real nappies at the standard NHS Parentcraft class. I think it was organsied by Real Nappy Network but the woman who did it has links to NCT as well. The last NCT Nearly New Sale I went to had a stall with loads of different nappy types so you could see/handle them all. So, NCT might be worth a try too.

Our local Mothercare & Tescos do Kooshies trial packs and Woolworths does Cotton Bottoms trial Packs. Probably not as cheap as on the Net though. Sorry I can't compare with the fleecy types for you- never used them.

[hub2dee]

Ta all.

Magscat, thanks for highlighting that it is the wrap that really is the 'key bit' in determing explosive containment. Again, it appears obvious when you say it, but I'd always assumed it was really down to the absorbant nappy bit, IYSWIM... I appreciate the nappy is supposed to prevent the brown stuff from reaching the wrap, but where the nappy fails, and poo / wee leaks lead to bedding / clothes changing... you're right... it's the wrap that's not doing its job.

Hmmm.... will have more thinky.... thanks.

[Maisiemog]

Hi hub, just thought I'd tell you about my experiences, just in case your head hasn't exploded yet, with all the info.
I have just about all of the prefolds, Junior Joy - nappy lady sells them, they are like Indian prefolds, they are quite soft and fine. Bambino Mio, very thick cotton, good absorbancy, Cotton Bottoms - very soft cotton, quite good absorbancy, more sizes so easier to find a good fit. I also have chinese prefolds, they are very thick and are made of a different material from the other prefolds: cotton gauze as opposed to twill. They are good for absorbancy, go hard and I have found they wear out quicker than the twill prefolds.
I have practically every type of nappy and recommend getting a few fitteds, for speed and showing off, and big towellingy ones for nighttime. I would say get a few different types designs - I mean you don't have a wardrobe containing identical copies of one outfit yawn!
UK Nappy makers
I would say even if you get fitteds, also get a load of prefolds - they are cheap, easy to put on and look cute in a clean cottony way.
If you use them on a bf baby (I did) I recommend using a nappy nippa, done up tightly with the breastfed fold - you will become an expert at keeping that poo in. .
I have only used Bummi Super Whisper wrap with patterns, it has worked for me, with no leaks. The secret is absolutely no exposed bits of nappy - or it will leak. Other people here can tell you other good types of wrap.
The beauty of prefolds is that they are versatile, you can have them super slim or boost a little or a lot. I have some of the kushies flannette boosters (Tesco) for days and two terry (tots) and three hemp (hempresto) boosters for night.
Prefolds and Terries are about the only nappies that are slim enough to allow you to fasten the poppers on the bottom of your babies clothing. Doesn't sound much, but you might want your baby to look posh sometimes, without a big bit of wrap sticking out, or going onto the next size and having empty legs on the babygro.
They also dry over night. You will use them to mop up baby spit up, wipe faces, as a seat/bed cover/ to put on one of those changing thingies in the ladies etc...
The only nappy I don't recommend from my point of view is stuffable/pocket. I have tried all of them and they and haven't found them reliable enough - unless stuffed with a lot of cloth and constantly monitored. I find by the time you have enough stuffing in them so they work well - they are enormous, which seems to defeat the purpose of a onepiece nappy.
I recommend getting nappies/prefolds from ebay, as cheaper and already washed. This means you won't have to wash new ones three times before use and you should pick them up for around £1 each or less.
I got a birth to potty pack of Cotton Bottoms for eighty pounds - and got money back from the council upon production of a receipt. Cool!
A consideration when ordering from the US is that prefolds are quite heavy and the US postage will eat up some of the money you are saving with the low dollar. Have done this myself.
But those US nappies are well cute.
Finally, look at UKparents (do a google), they have a massive second hand selection on the nappies for sale forum.

[Maisiemog]

PS those Simon's custom cloth nappies are sooo lovely. I've got some US wahm nappies and they are so well made and gorgeous.

[sweetkitty]

my fuzzis arrived this morning I now have butter, milk, lilac and pink ones, they are so so cute!

[hub2dee]

@ sweetkitty.

Hiya Maisiemog. Deliciously long, informative post. Lovely.

Yep, the SCC nappies and wraps look fab. Their prints and wool swatches rock. And the owner, Erica, has been patient and helpful.

Interesting that you've used several varieties of prefold, and that you prefer the Bambino Mio... I seem to remember reading so many 'poo failiure' stories about Bambino Mios though. Maybe people were doing something wrong, or not doing them up tight enough ?

I have US family coming over regularly so there wouldn't be postage charges etc.

I presume from your experience, your first choice for pre-folds would be Bambino Mios, right ?

Out of interest, if you ignore the cost for a second, and just focus on ease of use, ability to retain breastfed poo, cuteness, durability, would you go for a 24 X prefold in wrap or say 12 - 18 fitted nappies (like Erica et al make) ? (Or do you stick with 'buy a mix, it's good for your soul' ) - this would be for a (possibly chubby) newborn.

[starlover]

sweetkitty my new fuzzi's arrived this morning too!
have red, periwinkle, sage, baby blue, and turquoise.
Have already got a bug print one and one that is aqua outside and butter inside!
Found the plain white fleece inner to be softer than the coloured fleece though

[giraffeski]

Message withdrawn

[starlover]

giraffeski is right! also, if you're lazy like me you may find you need more.
A newborn will probably need changing around 8 times a day. So, technically you would want at least 16, assuming you're going to do a wash every day.

[Maisiemog]

Hi Hub, I have all the prefolds, but originally bought a birth to potty Cotton Bottoms from Ebay for £80. I like Cotton Bottoms for their softness and sizings and they easily last three hours between a change. Bambino Mio seem quite thick in comparison, but I don't like them more though. Their small size would drown a little baby and their large wouldn't nippa round a baby over 20lbs.
I don't know what to say, I do actually like prefolds for all the reasons I said. I also like fitted nappies for the cuteness and the ease of operation.
If you use 10 - 12 nappies a day on newborn which is the guideline I read somewhere, then you are washing every night if you buy 18 fitteds.You would only have 6 - 8 left for the next day, which would take you until the next night then no nappies. That's why it's nice to have your prefolds. You can eke out your fitteds and still only have to wash every other day, and have DRY nappies ready to go.
The other thing is dirty prefolds tend to take up slightly less room in your nappy bucket, so you can hold off washing just because you ran out of space in the bucket.
Then you will still be able to have clean clothes for yourself and your little smelly one.
I don't know what to say, what about buying 15 fitted and 10 small prefolds? You can use the same wraps on both (I would say buy 4 or 5 good wraps)
I'm all confused now, so I'm off for my dins.

[giraffeski]

Message withdrawn

[hub2dee]

giraffeski: I'm definitely running with two buckets. I think we have the same 'sod it do it later' approach perhaps ? LOL.

Maisiemog - the prefolds in the States are as cheap as muslin cloths over here, so it's no great shakes to buy two or even three dozen, if money is not super-tight. It makes newborn changing a breeze, and allows washing every 2 - 3 days no problem (we've got good washing and drying machines).... especially if my US relatives are in a good mood and happy to lose a small, light suitcase of their baggage allowance ... Unused / excess can either be sold here or on ebay IMO, probably for close to cost and they can be used in household / car cleaning, changing mat covers, burp cloths etc.

Regardless of whether we go for pre-folds or fitteds, at least one variable is fixed: a few nice wraps..... now, whether to get off the shelf or custom delicious....

[starlover]

hub2dee... are you definitely against stuffables?

[hub2dee]

No. Everything in the universe is a possible. Must admit haven't routinely noticed people raving about them, but no, I have no particular affiliation to any nappy party.

I guess if I buy half the world's supply of Chinese prefolds, som stuffables would make sense to try at least...