I know how to be a good mother, I just can?t seem to do it.

[OrangeSpacedust]

I fail at being a mother every day. I mainly subscribe to the AP/UP approach and have such a gentle, hippie, child-centred philosophy, and other people think I?m such a chilled-out mum. But on my own, at times I just can?t seem to stop myself seeing red at ?testing? things that DD (4) does, and I end up shouting, or physically removing her from the situation in a way that, I can?t kid myself, is bordering on the violent. She?s 4 and I?ve never hit her or her 2-year-old sister, and am 99.9% sure I never would. But I reckon some of the stuff I do is just as bad, if not worse.

This morning I physically dragged her along the pavement by the hand for a short way, because she wouldn?t stand up and she wouldn?t walk. Not fast, it didn?t hurt her, but it?s still abusive, right? And carrying her (while also trying to push the buggy) resulted in kicking and screaming. And there seemed to be no reason for her mood at all. I?d spent 15 minutes kindly asking her what was wrong, why she didn?t want to move or go home, distracting her by pointing things out, telling her what we would do when we got home, what we would have for lunch, etc etc. Though I just can?t bring myself to say anything along the lines of:

?If you don?t come now you won?t get any XXX.?
?If you come home now, I?ll give you XXX.?
?I?m going to count to three, then ??

I just can?t say any of that stuff. Yes, it would work in the short term, but IMO it?s just a short cut and I don?t want to use bribes and threats like that. I try and try to think of the right words to say, but I run out eventually, and snap. I know that when I snap, it?s out of frustration at MYSELF for not having the intellectual tools to resolve the situation with words. I don?t think it?s in any way DD?s ?fault?. I know she?s just being a 4-year-old.

It?s as if a little switch flicks in my mind and I go into Authoritarian Mummy mode, because that?s the easiest way to be, in the end. It involves the least thought.

I?m a quiet person, not particularly quick-thinking, and often simply can?t think of things to say to the kids. I just know they?re going to run rings round me when they?re older.

I know there are mothers who never raise their voice at their kids, never get irritable, etc. My own mother was one. Her patience never ran out, and I had an idyllic childhood. And I feel like I fail to be like her and mess up with my own kids all the time.

Any suggestions most gratefully received. TIA.

" I just know they?re going to run rings round me when they?re older.
"

No they won't. I am similar to you and used to get so upset when I felt obliged to shout and break my rules. But by and large the older my DC have got the more reasonable they have become. I listend and explain and so do they. I think the patient gently child-centred approach can pay off but it's hard work on the parents when the DC are young.

And don't go round beleiving that that there such beings as perfect parents. They are a figment of advertisers imaginations. There are good enough parents. OK parents. Parents who do their best. There are no perfect parents. And I bet they when you think back there will bet times when your mum did shout at you, smack you even- mine did and I still feel that my childhood was idyllic.

Oh and I've just seen that your DD is 4! Say no more

Just carry on doing what you are doing, try to count to ten and take a deep breath, accept that everything is going to take longer than you accept, and promise yourself whenever it happens that you will try not to do it again. And say sorry BTW if you think you have been horrible to your DD.

I am glad I found this thread as I feel exactly the same way as you OrangeSpaceDust. I was about to post myself and found yours which expressed everything I was feeling (have had a very bad morning).

OrmIrian, your post has made me feel much much better. Thank you.

My mum was the perfect mum, and my childhood was idyllic too. However, my mum is quite sure she was not remotely perfect (and she believes this- she's not fishing for compliments).

In other words, there's no such thing as the perfect mother (trite but true). I very, very rarely raise my voice at the children - but I do bribe them (if you call it bribery - telling them we'll have a drink/game as soon as we've got home in order to get them moving, and so on).

However, I have also been known to bodily remove them from places if they refuse to budge (this is where the counting to three comes in for me). That said, I did find when DS was four or so and refusing to move that getting the newspaper out and starting to read it annoyed him so much that he started walking again...

All I can say other than that is that small children are very, very hard work, and nobody gets it 'right' all the time.

I try very hard to always stay calm and be a good mum but I'd be lying if I said it always worked . Yes, I've shouted at DCs in public, dragged them out of stores for playing up, etc - but I don't think that makes me a bad mum, just one who is trying her best! Fortunately, it has got easier as they have got older.

Worst thing is that, looking back, the things that really wind me up are the same things I remember doing as a kid - what goes around....

Today I am not being a good mummy. I am tired, I am 35weeks pregnant and my legs hurt with spd. We havnt been out of the house in 6 days as dh has to car to take to his new job and I cant walk very far due to the spd.

I have done no fun crafty activites and cant see me completing any before bedtime. My ds is only 3 but my god the whinging!!!

What I mean to say was dont beat yourself up you sound like a lovely mum, a normal mum who has limits and everyone has those.

Humphrey, glad I'm not alone and that the thread helped! Thanks to PPs too. I know it's unrealistic to want to be a perfect mother, I'm just desperate to learn how to be a bit less volatile. I don't want my kids to be scared in case mummy might snap ... or have any memories of their childhoods at all which involve fear. I do try so so hard not to lose my temper and think I am getting a bit better, which is why this morning really floored me so much. And OrmIrian, no, my mum really really never shouted or hit me.

Thanks for your comments, I do appreciate them.

You remind me a bit of my friend who is super calm, tolerant and abit hippy-dippy tbh - then loses it and feels awful about it. (and has DC of a similar age to yours) But I wonder if perhaps that happens because she's so tolerant and patient - after several hours of that each day she's just had enough and snaps. So maybe what you want is to be a little less easy-going - I don't mean threats but more firm saying no and more using consequences - but it can be done in a positive way eg. things like "well I was planning to make a cake when we got in, but if we don't get home in the next 5 minutes there won't be time, oh well" often get results with my 3yo.

Having said that, I agree with everyone else, losing your rag now and again is entirely normal when they're this age - I've had a horrendous time of late with tantrums and I've screamed, shouted and dramatically burst into tears (yes in front of DS). I've also dragged and manhandled him and felt bad about it but, I do think, if a 3/4yo knows that they can do what the hell they like and you have no comeback, so effectively they can force you to wait in the street indefinitely because they don't feel like walking, that's not practical. They have to know that what you say goes, when it comes to the crunch, and if they refuse to co-operate then tough, you're going to make them. It has to be like that really, or else they would be completely 100% in charge which would be disastrous.

You are expecting WAY too much of yourself! Dragging a child along who doesn't want to walk is NOT abuse! It happens

Sometimes you need to raise your voice or be stern with your kids (every day in fact). You don't need to scream and shout necessarily (although I do quite a lot - when kids are young you can't always control your temper, it is a hard job after all).

I'm sorry but I don't subscribe to this gently gently approach to discipling kids. I have a couple of friends who never really lose their tempers or speak sternly to their kids. They are all (in a voice no different to how they normally speak and sometimes really simpering) "Oh no please don't beat up that little boy, that isn't very nice is it?". And you know what? Their kids are all rude, whinging and out of control brats.

I was AP when my babies were small but they are both past the age of 18 months now and they will do as they are told! Naughty behaviour is not acceptable end of. I still hug them and play with them and am very affectionate in general but they see my angry side when they push me.

I think it is so sad that people can't even discipline their own kids without feeling like they are 'abusing' them. I am not talking about smacking or calling them names but just raising your voice when needs be and yes even shouting.

You may be trying to be the perfect mum but by doing so you may end up with kids who have you wrapped around their little fingers!

As for remembering your Mum as being perfect and patient maybe you are seeing her slightly through rose tinted glasses?

nikki - that is bollocks.

Erm what is?

"You may be trying to be the perfect mum but by doing so you may end up with kids who have you wrapped around their little fingers!
"

That is.

Sorry that is my opinion. No need to be rude.

No. You are quite right. Sorry.

I don't agree with you I'm afraid nikki. In spades.

Fair enough. Why not?

That counting to three is the only thing that works with my ds1. No idea why, but it doesn't work with ds2.

If one of mine won't walk I just try to persuade him for a while then say, 'oh are you staying here, well me and dsx have got to get home for tea, see you then' and walk off slowly, they will soon charge after you.

Thats not abusive is it? Just reverse psychology.

Flibberty, I tried that, thanks ? as a second-last resort. She was left kneeling on the street in inconsolable tears and I knew before I'd walked 20 feet away that it was all wrong. I walked on further, but she showed not the slightest sign of following. And anyway, I don't want her to run after me if she feels it's just a choice between that or being abandoned. There MUST be a better way of doing things! Sometimes I get it right, sometimes I don't. This morning I definitely didn't! Am feeling better now, thanks.

Nikki1978, I don't think it's necessary to be stern and raise your voice with your kids every day ? surely if you have to do it this often, that approach clearly isn't working? ? and the way your friends discipline their kids really sounds like it doesn't have much to do with what I try and do, or the AP approach ... I don't let my kids "get away with things", I get down to their level and explain what they're doing wrong. And I know they're young yet, but they're a long way from being "rude, whinging and out of control brats" ...

Because dealing with a child with persuasion rather than coercion (sp??? ) does not result in a child that wraps the parent round their little finger. Not in the slightest. It leads to a child who eventually is able to make their own judgements and explain them. IME anyway. Don't mistake gentle co-operative parenting with poor parenting.

Hmmm well I think we shall have to agree to disagree

To the OP maybe my approach isn't working btu then neither is yours. Difference is that I am not trying to be perfect nor do I expect my kids to be so. When I say being stern I just mean using a different tone of voice when say my 2 year old has a tantrum. He is of that age and it is to be expected so I don't expect to 'cure' him of it. I just say (sternly, firmly whatever you want to call it) "Calm down" and hold him close.

Either way I wasn't trying to criticise you so don't take it the wrong way. As I said before just offering my opinion. If you don't agree I think it is nicer to ignore it

I do think nikki has a point. I don't think shouting is good, I really try not to and I certainly wouldn't say it happens every day (or not normally - perhaps in the middle of a super-strop phase...)

But I do think there are parents that have decided that any kind of saying no to a child or doing anything at all that might make them upset - such as making them do something they don't want to or carrying through with a consequence - is abusive or must be avoided. That is madness IMO. Smacking, abusive language, shouting in their face, undermining etc - that's abusive. But not things like saying "no, you're getting off the swing now" and removing them if they refuse, even if it does make them cry. Making a child upset is not in itself abuse - sometimes it's necessary. But I know parents who are scared to tell their child to behave, make them let another child have a turn, etc, because they might be upset. And there is a pervasive sense of this that I think is what makes normal parents like the OP feel terrible if they get tough sometimes.

Oh and btw I do a lot of positive, persuasive parenting - explaining, appealing to his better nature, helping him understand other people's needs, using humour and distraction, and often it works well. But sometimes it really doesn't, and I don't think it's so terrible for a child to see that you have reached your limit of how much arsing around you will put up with (which I think is what the OP is describing)

Chars muffle you have said what I was trying to say but far more articulately!

I think I may be coming across as some evil dictator style parent - I am not, honest . I just think softly softly works for some elements of parenting but not all.

My point was to make the OP feel better about losing her temper sometimes rather than trying to just find other ways to be 'perfect', nothing wrong with that in my book!

Have to stick my neck out and agree with you nikki. At the risk of incurring the wrath of others, my friend does the discussion/keeping calm/not raising voice thing. All good stuff if it works, which it doesn't in her case. After her 'discussion/rationalising' etc, her daughter smiles sweetly, says sorry, then happily continues tormenting/slapping whichever child she was tormenting/slapping in the first place, usually mine. Great. I'm not advocating Victorian style parenting here, but I don't think that letting your child see that you are angry is going to cause psychological harm. Kids need discipline, boundaries and consistency, not discussions about why it really isn't the done thing to clout little Jimmy with whatever toy comes to hand. I swear my friend's (3 year old) daughter rolls her eyes when her mum crouches down for a pep talk for the 1000th time that day!

Agreed. To lose the plot a little sometimes is human. I stated that in my first post. We agree on that. But I took serious issue with the assertion that all gentle persuasive parenting leads to badly behaved whiny children.

Don't think she said that though. She said that trying to be the perfect mum (- if that means never losing your rag and always being tolerant of everything, is how I read it) - could have that effect.