Kids and alcohol, a little confused, what is your stance? French mums view points would be welcome.

[MilaMae]

Just picked up the free ELC free mag and am a little shocked.

There is an article in there about talking to children about alcohol that says we should be giving the message that "Children don't drink alcohol" that "some adults drink alcohol,but children never should,there should be no compromise". It says the Health Visitors Association says we shouldn't be saying "Don't do as I do" It gives an example of a mum who only drinks when her children are in bed and if they see her drinking at a wedding she explains it's OK for adults to have a little alcohol on special occasions. It was presented in a way that inferred we should all be going with this approach.

Am I the only one who thinks this a little ermmmm Victorian, completely the wrong way to teach children how to respect alcohol oh and the Nanny State gone mad!!!!!!

I was brought up with wine often present at meals and we were encouraged to try it too. We travelled to France a lot and remember French children had a similar upbringing re wine. When I stayed with my French pen friend we usually were given watered down wine. Now I have children nearly 4 and 5, we often drink wine at meals and I let my dd who is interested dip her finger in to taste it and Baileys at Xmas etc. So am I completely wrong to be doing this??? Do other people?????

Am I right in thinking there isn't a drink problem in France with teenagers many of which would have had a similar upbringing as myself with alcohol ie one that fosters a healthy respect in an open environment. Surely hiding it away makes it glamourous and just something teenagers will be dying to get their hands on.

I'm happy to be corrected here as away my dc are very young so not encountered many teenagers since I was one

Licensing Act 2003 seems to say aged 16 or 17 for wine/beer/etc with a meal.

Oh and MilaMae - I think I gave you wrong info before - the age limit of 5 to give them alcohol at home seems to be a Scottish thing, so you're fine giving your a taste.

sorry - deleted point at end - kids see wine drunk here as part of meal, rather than activity in itw own right - even the apero is served with something to eat.

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thogn showing?

Thong? This always cracks me up - am an Aussie and we show our thongs all the time!

but for you they're flip flops right? (hoping emoticon)

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aah - thong showing!

Yes, but there was vast amount available alcohol and lots and lots of gens. In centre of town and no gated entey or anything. I think in uk would have been disaster.

I remember Guildford on sat night. shudder.

well this getting drunk to excess and falling about vomitting = having a good time thing is quite British. (I know you see Germans doing this on Mallorca as well and other nationalities have problems with alcohol abuse too) It isn't so much a med thing, is it?

I know when I was in Italy staying in a flat with a bunch of students and going out with them, no one was ever drunk. In fact no one ever drank alcohol. They'd go to a club and order coke or orange juice. I expect Italian teenagers DO get drunk sometimes but it is much less of a thing than in the UK. For one thing, they want to look good, and you don't look good with bleary eyes and vomit stains down your front - and they find it a uncool too.

'fete du vin' - could swop fesitval for party. Bordeaux wine party, rather than folksy winesnob bash.

I agree, not sure how much difference it makes either way. I was brought up French-style (my motehr is French), no one in my family drank much, but they did appreciate good wines with meals, we were allowed sips/fingers dipped. I am a recovering alcoholic, my sister doens't much like alcohol, my brother likes good wines but not to excess. So....?!?!

Ooops, sorry, that would be 'I agree with poster several pages back who said they weren't sure how much difference it makes' - forgot to refresh page

I'm not sure it makes any difference to how they handle alcohol when they grow up, however, I do let all of mine have a sip of my wine if they want to (they are 7, 5 and 3).

Although, I think I'm a bit screwed up because I won't let them near coke or fizzy drinks....

Snap GDK.

even teh fizzy drinks thing.

Plenty of French teenagers and students do go out and get raging drunk, at home (when parents are away, obv) and at bars.

Le binge drinking is an increasing problem here, and adult alcoholism is rife. In fact France is near the top of european alchol-related mortality rates.

French adults just drink less publicly, so the problem isn't as visible.

There are lots of alcohol things going on here at the moment, DD1 is at that age where alcohol is the 'done' thing.
So far she hasn't been drinking (that i know of)..but some of her friends are....majority of them drink every weekend, they will go to the cash n carry with their mums and buy their drink for the weekend. Mum stops at home to drink hers..and the groups of teenagers take their treasure to the beach...get hammered..pass out...which then lead to 999 calls..and teenagers being taken away to have stomach pumped!-back to school on monday morning giggling and proud!

IMO parents definately shouldn't be doing this!

Mine have had a sip ofwine/guiness when they asked (atchristmas)..but hated the taste and ran for water afterwards! Hopefully they will stay clear...lol

LTH

so in fact teenagers just arethe same all over and there is no where we can run off to whilst they're going through puberty.

Another plan thwarted!

Mind you the fact they call it Le binge drinking is a statement in itself

quite

In and out picking up dc etc so this will be brief but will be back. Thanks, that is a lot to think about. Cod's article and Castille's info was interesting I had no idea. I'm obviously well out of French youth culture now(well any youth culture if the truth be told).

I see your point Cod I grew up in a wine drinking house and got hammered to at uni on Diamond White (some of that being due to there being little else to buy at the student bar and me being a one pot screamer according to dp). Also lets face it anybody would get hammered on Diamond White, the stuff was pretty potent.

I ttc for 7 years to get my dc and didn't drink at all then or during the pregnancies. Now, I love wine particularly with food but if we're broke(which is often) we go weeks without any. I think I grew up to respect alcohol,yes I had my dancing on table moments at uni but always managed to get myself home in one piece, safe and not covered in sick(always made it to the loo at home),never brawled or got into trouble(other than the obvious police cone on statue's heads) etc etc. Also I was 18-22 and it ended once I started teaching during and after college.

Also I'm fussy about what I drink now don't like vinegar wine would rather hold out for something I actually enjoy than drink for drink self IYKWIM I do wonder if I'm being pretty hypocritical though. Were my student days any different to the 15 and 16 year olds you hear about now????

GGG's post was interesting too have been to a lot of those family festivals in France(love them), last year took my then 3 year old twins, and 2 year old dd to the local villlage one with my parents. Lots of wine drunk openly all generations together,lots of merryment but no trouble,sick or rubbish to clear up the next day,none at all.

Still none the wiser but really don't think hiding alcohol away is the answer.

"a one pot screamer "

Sorry 'too'

I think that people have gone on about the French example too much.

tHe French have different attitudes to WINE not to alcohol in general.ENglish people , well those who tend to worship French culture, seem to think whatever the French do must be wonderful.

My mother(not French) mistakenly thought it was okay to let me drink wine with any meal at which she had bought wine at home from about the age of 14 onwards. I got used to drinking alot of wine and because I was sensible, there was supposedly not a problem. I know that I basically got to like drinking alchol because I was so used to it- I did not seem to get "drunk" s I started drinking more and more. At teenage parties etc I drank more than others.

Fortunately, once into my late twenties ,I had regulated my drinking and whilst not teetotal I really do think that because you cannot tell what your child is going to be like re. alcohol, you should NOT encourage them to drink as a child. It is not physically ealthy. It can be dangerous.

I do not believe in hiding the fact that you drink , but I think you need to be sensible and to make clear that children's bodies physiclly are not able to cope with alcohol yet. I totally disgree with the person who said on here that they gave their 12 year old an alcopop every Friday: WHY DO THAT?????

SOme people say the taste of alcohol at a young age was so disgusting that it worked to put them off alcohol: but the point is, for some children that will not be the case.

You just cannot assume that your children will be the same as you.

I think you need to be honest about alcohol, you need to emphasise the physical dangers for children and the potential accidents that can happen(whether driving/ general poor judgement/ being unable to make ational decisions in difficult situations/ choking on vomit etc etc). YOu need to be especially careful once your children get to be older- the teen years are the crucial ones and I don't think that letting children very young have alcohol is ever a wise move: it just leads to the type of peer pressure that we can all do without: eg. "Why can't I have a beer, x is allowed to haveit with his parents."

Perhaps once children are 12-13, if they express curiosity about what you are drinking, then you might let them taste it, see what they say, then remind them of all the reasons why adults can drink alcohol, but why children should not.

Also, I now wonder, how do I know what will happen if my children visit friends' homes: are those middle-class parents going to be pushing alcohol onto my children ? YOu may say oh no, but it is the peer pressure- if all are drinking in that home, than children may feel they need to conform.