Nearly three year old waking at 5am and overtired by afternoon

[Warmthofthesun]

A few weeks ago, DD (3 in a couple of weeks) started waking really early - I’d say around 5 is the average but there’s half an hour either side of that.

It throws the whole day into chaos as she’s flagging big time by 3pm and is desperate to go to sleep by 5. I normally manage to get her to bed by 630. If she does end up napping she won’t go to sleep until really late and then is still up at the same time the following day.

she has blackout blinds and the only change I can pinpoint is she’s in a toddler bed not a cot.

(Please no advice on gro clocks etc as the problem is her waking up so early not staying in her room. She also absolutely does not go back to sleep in my bed.)

She’d never sleep at 8 if she napped at that time and she doesn’t just nap … around 3/4 seems to be when she starts to crash.

I feel for you. My little one spent the first 3 years waking at 5am. It's only been the past 6 months that he's waking at 6😭 the lighter mornings don't help either 😅

Why are you waiting for her to crash? I think you said she is irritable at noon.

That doesn’t mean she’ll sleep, though.

She’s always been a bit tricky with naps; even as a baby, but she’s always slept well at night so I’ve never been too bothered by that. She started to phase the nap out at around two and a quarter and I would say it had confidently gone by February / march time. At the moment she’s waking so early that she probably could do with one, which wouldn’t be a problem at all and she can go to bed later if she woke up later but since she doesn’t you end up in this horrible pattern of late bedtime, early wake up and naps all over the place which I want to avoid. If she’s going to be up early regardless I’d rather she went to bed early, but ideally I’d like some middle ground!

I thought I had skipped this phase with her … it seems not!

My 3yo has an occasional nap on the school run, particularly if our day has been active.

Have you tried exhausting your 3yo in the morning so they'll have a 30m nap to see them through, then exhausting them in the afternoon e.g. by going to the park after school with a bike ride/scoot there and back? I often take a picnic tea with us and stay in the park until 6pm ish, then scoot home, quick top up bowl of cereal if still hungry, bath story and bed. My eldest gets ready for bed at the same time but is allowed to play quietly or read to themselves in their bedroom (5y) while 3yo just goes straight to bed. 3yo is usually out very quickly on active days like this, by 7:15pm-7:30pm. 5yo falls asleep around 8-830pm. They wake up around 7-730am.

I do wonder if there is some developmental leap around 3-3.5 ish though

It's been very hot.

Could you try a more enclosed sleeping space? Something more like a cot and perhaps the old mattress back?

I don't know how interesting you're being at this hour but you need to be incredibly dull.

If a nap is inevitable I'd have it as early as possible and not longer than half an hour. She is sleeping too early for sure. I wouldn't be put off if she sleeps later and wakes at the same time as she can't do that indefinitely.

How clever of her to wake early and then have a siesta, though. More people should do this.

Have you tried some warm milk when she wakes early? It's a double edged sword but I would be inclined to try it.

Possibly. I’ve wondered if there may be some anxiety she can’t verbalise too, she really has never done this before.

She is a pretty busy girl and we do a lot of activities, partly for her development and partly for my sanity!

She isn’t napping as a rule @Notabarbie , unsure if I’ve been unclear. I do my absolute best to avoid the nap.

Both of mine have gone through this stage at around the same age, always in summer! I bought them in bed with me and kept insisting it’s still sleep time until a certain time, say 6am to start with. I don’t respond to any of their other questions or chats, just cuddle them and keep reiterating it’s still sleep time.

They obviously do still wake the same time for a week or so but after a few days, once they know you mean it and they won’t get to be up and watch tv or anything, they tend to get bored and go back to sleep. Once they’ve started doing this for a while I found they then naturally go longer in their own bed.

I would let her nap and wake on her own, but not be quiet around her. Then stay up late and go to bed late. She will eventually after a few days get back into a healthy sleeping plan. It’s not nice I know but being tired and overtired isn’t either. I was a nanny and it worked then and has worked with my own children too

I can often get her to go back to bed for a bit but it’s hard as she won’t sleep and then comes out after ten minutes: I need a wee, another ten minutes, she wants a drink, etc. I try to get to 6, although it was 545 today when I admitted defeat! She wouldn’t sleep with me, sadly!

Urgh that’s rough, I feel you. I seem to remember letting my son have a 10-15 min power nap in the afternoon to tide him over to bedtime for a while. I can’t remember if it worked though 😂

Thanks. 440 today. FML!

You've probably tried these but see if she'll have a biggish snack just before bed in case she's waking from hunger and a pee right before bed.

You need to take it back to basics. Children have a sleep currency, which is the amount of hours they need to sleep in a 24 hour period. You work this out by counting their sleep time for 7 days then taking an average. Let’s say your daughter is sleeping 6.30-5am without a nap, that means her sleep currency is 10.5 hours, which is bang on normal for her age. Therefore you have 10.5 hours sleep per day that you can offer to her. This is why if you nap her she still wakes up early, because you’ve taken time out of her currency and allocated it to during the day.

If you’ve maximised her sleep space (as dark as possible, quiet or white noise, right temperature) and have a consistent bedtime routine then the only way to get her to sleep later is a later bedtime. You also need to implement changes for at least 7 consecutive days to see if it works so you need to stick with it.

Id do day 1 on a day where you have lots planned but nothing a car journey away so no danger nap territory. Just keep her busy ALL day. Even if she starts flagging just power through. Move bedtime 15-20 minutes later than normal each day until you’re at 60-90 minutes later then stick to it for a week. Don’t give up because she’s not sleeping later or it’s tricky, it takes time to see changes to sleep (think about how long it takes you to adjust from jet lag).

Also think about getting a temporary black out blind and stick it to the window behind your permanent blind, as 5am is sunrise so if light is creeping through that won’t be helping.

good luck!