11+ tutoring a con?

[Walksinwild]

I live in an area with grammar schools and almost all the children are tutored if they are going to to sit the entrance exam. Often for more than a year. I've enquired about a tutor for DS to start in Sept but I feel like the whole thing is a con. Since when was some maths practice and completing practice papers not enough? My son is capable but all other parents are telling me to get him tutored because everyone else is. Many tutors get you to sign up for a year at approx £35 a week,so are making lots of cash from worried parents and the whole thing compounds.
Those of you that did it/looked into it. What do you think please? Is tutoring necessary?
Tia

@Pipsquiggle @Emma2803 your comments here are really helpful. We're in the north west, highly populated and very competitive.
@Emma2803 my DC is the same as yours and he really enjoyed a few practice 11plus qs I gave him. I am a secondary school teacher but I don't think this helps really for 11plus.yesterday I was all for us doing it ourselves but then looking at some practice maths papers I think not. There were terms and things on there that DC just didn't know so couldn't answer the qn and how would I know what maths content to teach and the method of how to complete?
Having looked at the verbal, DC would be fine and the non-verbal is not 'theory' but looking for patterns and associations so practice which we could do.
I have been in touch with a tutor. They did 20 years in the classroom at primary, left and done 20odd years 11plus tutoring. Had a good chat and they sound great.
I just can't fathom how once weekly tutoring, for a year is necessary to teach some maths skills and practice some qs, which is why I feel parents are taken advantage off. The maths isn't that tricky from what I've seen but the tutor said they'd teach all yr5 and then what's needed from yr6. But once maths is covered, the tutor would do the same as me, practice papers. But then as it's so important(the comp school isn't great, which again is all part if the system but that's what it is..) I feel we should just get the tutor, we'd still support at home.
Gosh, that got long! Thanks if you made it to the end!

@Level1469 I'm so sorry your DC and you went through that. Some schools are really awful and like you say we want to protect our children. I wish you and your DC all the best x

I agree that children need tutoring, but disagree that they need an external tutor. We found most tutors to be offering poor quality tuition, some were teachers that seemed to believe that the 11+ was similar to SATS, others supervised worksheet/practice paper filling out without much instruction to improve.

i found it much better to tutor my children myself. I could personalise their learning and quickly target their weaker areas. I had to do a lot of research to find out exactly what was required for the exam and the necessary techniques, but it made life much easier for my children as we could fit in the sessions at convenient times for them.

All three of my children achieved super-selective marks, whereas many of their professionally tutored classmates failed because the parents weren’t aware they had been taught incorrect content and techniques.

If a child is borderline then perhaps tuition will make the difference, and it’s generally going to be quite difficult to be sure that they aren’t borderline.

We think / hope that ours won’t need any tutoring when they get to that age and we can probably cover any gaps ourselves but if everyone else is having it done then I can imagine we might want to have some done just in case.

Unfortunately I’ve seen this happen. It’s really hard for the child because they’re squeezed to a level they can’t sustain and the effects seem to last into university, because they’re force fed for that, and beyond.

@GoingForAGallop and that's great that you have that skill set. Many people don't.

One of the valuable insights I got from the pandemic is that I am not a teacher.
I am more like Ann from Amandaland running maths camp - well worth a watch on iPlayer

@GoingForAGallop thank you. Yes, I agree that some tutors will not be good quality and just stick a worksheet in front of them. We have decided we will go with the tutor (who is experienced and I will keep tabs on what is covered) but my husband and I will also be doing prep with DC. My gut feeling is we could do it ourselves but will feel better also having the tutor.

@SomersetbakerThis is why I said upthread you have to be sure it is the right environment for your child. None of mine had tutoring once in (actually that's not true, we've had a physics tutor for the youngest this year for his GCSEs because he had a dire physics teacher in Y8 and Y9)...but if you don't think your child will cope with the pace once in, then I agree, it's really not fair to put a borderline child in that environment.

I personally attended a grammar school and sat the test with no prep as my parents were not in the position to pay for tutoring, and having no formal qualifications themselves, were not able to help me personally. Despite the jump adjusting to the step up between primary and secondary for the first year or two (didn't help I didn't have my dyslexia diagnosis at the time!) it turned out very well. At lot of the friends I made there had tutoring to get in, and often tutored throughout the school period as well. Now I'm in the education sector myself, I see 3 common paths:

1. students that get in with no formal prep, and are okay from the offset
2. students that get in with no formal prep, and need a little boost at the start either from excellent teaching at the school/additional in school provision, or through a year or 2 of tutoring to help adjust
3. students that are tutored to get into the school and the quality of tutoring addresses the 'step up' - teaches them the skills not just the exam - so a quality tutor temporary to reduce the need for intervention in the long run
4. students that are tutored to get into the school, and then require ongoing tutoring throughout their school life, or for a number of years, either due to their ability or not having a quality tutor.

£35ph/week is actually below the average for a 1-1 11+ tutor, but I understand that is a build up over time.

its not a con it’s a necessity for all but the very very brightest, because of the increased competition these days. Where I am, this is partly due to huge numbers of Hong Kong Chinese arrivals (no judgement but they are very well prepared)

I think theoretically the grammar schools would prefer it if the kids didn’t do so much work towards 11+ though as presumably it’s makes it harder these days to differentiate the genuinely bright from the extremely well prepared

There are topics which come up on 11+ which are not always taught in state schools. DS tutor also taught him how to work to time in the exams. You are paying for 1-2-1 tuition.

I didn't tutor for the 11+ and got kids into super selectives and independent schools in London but effectively I was the tutor. I went over maths concepts, did Olympiad problems with them, analysed texts, taught them how to read poetry and fiction. Started with 15 mins a day and built it up. Just 1:1 time with me every single day including holidays and weekends. The aim of all this was obviously the 11+ but I wanted to make sure that in the maths and sciences they had super strong fundamentals and they could apply these concepts, and that in the humanities they also had a really strong base-so for me it wasn't just about the 11+ and the exams. I approached it as a 'these will help them in school' and if they have solid concepts then we can introduce exam technique.

So yes it's possible without tutoring but there are two factors. My children don't mind learning with me, and are not resistant. In fact they both quite enjoy that 1:1 time with me. Two, it is a lot of time to invest, and alongside my full time job I had to make sure I was fully prepared to support them and that I wouldn't resent the time it takes. But for me I enjoy teaching my children, and learning alongside them.

I agree with the person who said I could personalise the learning to my children as well. They learn very differently and have very different interests and also doing it this way put less pressure on them- because I made it about them doing their best and learning more, rather than here is a set of exams you need to crack. I'm also conscious that this approach is not feasible for everyone!

Finally, I continue to offer support in secondary school. DH and I sit down with the kids at the weekends and go over topics taught (humanities and sciences), make sure they keep up language revision in half term and holidays, I taught him how to make notes and revise, and generally I keep track of his progress, and step in when I think he needs help.

I wouldn't say it's a "con" exactly, the tutors usually have good intentions and it probably boosts the children's confidence. Most of them enjoy it. I don't think it makes most children more likely to pass. I tutored for years and lost interest when I realised that, except in a few borderline cases, the tutoring made little to no difference. Either they've got it or they don't.

@PotolKimchi that sounds really lovely. My 7 year old is currently resistint to ME sitting down learning with her. Allthough loves learning at school and she enjoys doing board games with me.... it's been an issue since she was about 3/4 and got upset about crafts, screwed them up and threw them away and I didn't know what to do except avoid the activity, which she really didn't want to leave but restart while upset. That hyperfocus to her detriment and me not always staying calm has turned into me not being able to help with homework.... which she doesn't need to do yet because she gets exceeds expectations without it.... but probably should start soon.