Feel hurt by my 11 year old

[StunningandBrave40]

My daughter is 11. She’s bright as a button. Kind, funny, sparky, but recently we’re seeing some moods etc. Nothing out of the ordinary. She has some big changes coming up. Secondary school etc. I try to pick my battles.

She is an adored child, to put it bluntly. Shes the centre of our world (she and her little sister, who is 7). I try to give her some independence and we’ve gradually increased this over the last year to a level we’re both comfortable with. I do find this difficult, to be honest, but I allow and facilitate it anyway because I know I shouldn’t let my anxiety hold her back.

I also have a full time, full on career. I scaled it right back for years when the girls were small, worked part time and even took a step down so that I could be around for them in the early years. I ramped it back up when they went to school and now I’m full time (but work pretty flexibly and can work from home a couple of days each week so I’m still around). Its really busy and sometimes I have to work a bit in the evenings to keep up etc. but I think I have always put the girls first.

11 and I had a row tonight (well, she was rowing, I was trying to calm her down). Over nothing really - basically I really need her to go to after school club with her sister tomorrow (for 40 minutes) and she doesn’t want to.

Well she hit the roof. She said some pretty hurtful things. I don’t trust her, I should never have had children because all I care about is my job. She hates me, her life is crap, she doesn’t want to live here any more and when she was away at Guide Camp she realised how unhappy she was at home. Her friends have much better lives, all we do is nag and moan, hates her sister etc etc.

I tried to get to the root of it but got nowhere. Eventually I left her alone to calm down and now she is asleep. I can’t sleep. I feel awful. It’s so fucking hard, keeping the plates spinning, and clearly I am failing her somewhere.

I don’t really know what to do with this.

Welcome to puberty! Children can be so hurtful at this age but it is really normal. Try not to take it to heart. You really can’t win as a mother - if you didn’t work, she’d find fault with that too. Don’t let up on your boundaries, she needs them. But maybe think if you can build in some nice activities together on the weekends as well.
My DD is now 18 and is genuinely the loveliest girl but she certainly has had her moments over the years…

Yep, puberty. My autistic DD has been this hurtful since the age of 7, daily, and since puberty it’s off the scales (she’s now 14). Regardless of autism they really know how to put the boot in and make you feel about an inch tall and second guessing yourself about everything you do as a parent. There is a point that you do absolutely have to start and continually pull them up on their unreasonable and hurtful behaviour. It’s taken years with mine but now hours afterwards she will calm down and apologise, even recognising and naming the poor behaviour. Not that it prevents her from doing it again. Solidarity, I’ve been told they age out of this but I’ll believe it when I see it

If you are working from home, can she not walk home from school. As I assume in September she will be walking or travelling to her new school. It will get her ready.

You know it’s okay to bite back occasionally don’t you? At the very least there needs to be an apology from her. And NOT from you on this occasion.

I’m so sorry, that’s brutal, kids can be really mean and god they know where to hit you where it hurts.
you’re doing a great job and this sounds like a puberty temper tantrum, though I’m sure that doesn’t make you feel any better.
have a sit down with her today and try and ask her what Monday - Friday would really look like for her? Could she walk home alone and her little sister go to after school club? Sounds like she’s desperate for a bit more freedom and pushing those boundaries.

Agreed. Hormones or not she needs to know that she’s really hurt your feelings.

I’m not working at home today I need to go into the office. I don’t want her letting herself into the house when we’re not there.

Agree with pp but also ‘making work important is about putting you first. I love it and get a lot from it. But just as important is giving you a comfortable home, the things you like, the places we go etc etc’
it’s ok to say you get a strong sense of identity from work but also point out it’s necessary to be financially secure. I think most children can’t make this connection and I’m grateful for the ones who don’t realise how fragile security can be so I don’t mean frighten her. Have a discussion about what she would like to change

but don’t try to get to the bottom or these things when she’s angry. Let it burn out and then have a chat afterwards

It's sounds like you are sensitive about having to put them in childcare and she has pushed that button. Her original gripe is fairly standard. Presumably she was arguing to come home alone. She doesn't have to like it, but she can tolerate it, as it's objectively not a big deal.

The rest of it sounds like she is just lashing out. Let her calm down and talk about it when you both feel calm, but try not to take this on. Just because she says everything is rubbish in an argument, doesn't mean it actually is.

Also is she at an English state school? If so, she is presumably doing SATs this week. The pressure of this may be adding to the emotions.

Puberty . I think from my experience girls are so much worse at this stage and become little horrors . Sorry she's hurt your feelings . She will (eventually) grow out of this kind of behaviour but it may get worse before it gets better .

If she's 11 then presumably she's going to secondary school in a few months. They don't have after school clubs so she could reasonably expect to come home and let herself in if you aren't there. Assuming the walk home from her current school is safe, this would have been a great opportunity to practice ready for September.

This! The way she spoke to you was completely unacceptable. My response to her would be if I hated you I would let you roam the streets after school and not give to hoots what happened to you. But as I love you so much DD I will put you in the care of after school for 40 minutes and pay for the pleasure. If you really hate me working I will quit. We will downsize the house there will be no activities, no fun money.

I would be fuming at her OP

She does need a word about how she has spoken to you, which isn't acceptable.

This independence you allow her is only going to become more of an issue over the next few years however. It's fairly normal for year 6 child to go home on their own to an empty house, not many go to after school club. And in less than 4 months she will be at high school where after school childcare doesn't exist. By that point, she will need to be ready for that level of independence. So why not now? What's your rationale, have you actually explained it to her, or is just a flat no, you're too young and you have to do what I say?

From this sort of age you have to be ready to parent through negotiation on some matters, you're passing the age of them just listening to you because you're the parent. It's really hard.

Do you think you may have been over protective which she sees as restrictive.
Why can't she come home from school and be in the house on her own?
She probably resents being treated like a 7 year old.
She's been there. Done that. Now has moved on to a different stage.
And feels you don't really see her.
You say she is bright. She is in the Guides and has been away to camp so is probably quite sensible and practical.
And won't she be going to secondary school next term?
She will surely be alone in the house then.
Sounds like she is chafing against the reins.

At 11 she is taxxing on to the runway towards take off destination adulthood.
It's adjustment time for everyone.
All the best.

Because it’s all last minute and I need to work, not worry about what’s happening at home. She hasn’t stayed in the house herself before (I’ve given her the opportunity when I’ve done quick things like take her sister to a local club but she has never wanted to). Its unusual that one of us wouldn’t be here after school, it’s just the way it worked out today.

"I don’t want her letting herself into the house when we’re not there"

for the sake of 40 minutes?

You don't trust her @StunningandBrave40 she's not wrong, is she?

Why not?

So have you explained that to her? That you want her to have spent time in the house alone first, before she's allowed to come home alone? Maybe you could offer to do that this weekend if she wants? This is the conversation you need to have with her once she is calmer, along with explaining that she shouldn't speak to you like that. And maybe she will take you up on that or maybe she was just having a hormonal moment.

I agree that you shouldn't back down over today because then her bad behaviour will have been rewarded.
But do allow her to work up to being alone for short times and then a whole after school period.

Never engage in an argument with children. I'tll get you nowhere.
They can be energy sucking little vampires.
When she's in this state, just state your expectations, give reasons and walk away, that's it. If she doesn't comply, give consequences. Nip this in the bud now.
If she says she hates you, say that's fine.
Also, do not allows yourself to be emotionally manipulated by kids, they will disappoint you.
My 16 year old is much better now, but still has her moments.
We are only human. But I continously tell her to be respectful and I also hold myself to account too.
I like this quote I saw. Do not allow your children to behave in a way that makes you later hate them.

There will be many more of these rows to come OP, brace yourself

At our school it would be very unusual for a year 6 to be in after school care as they would all be allowed to let themselves in at home, so I can see why she’s a bit frustrated.
However behaving like that is absolutely not acceptable. I think I must be very lucky as I have a 13 year old who has never spoken to me in that way, or even close.
For me, there would be consequences for her behaviour first and foremost. Then I’d sit and have a chat with her about how to build up to allowing her to let herself in after school.
You say you don’t want to be worrying about what’s happening at home, but realistically what would she be doing in that 40 mins? My 10 year old (year 6) just comes in, gets changed out of her uniform, gets a snack out of the cupboard and puts the TV on!

Ok fair enough probably not the time to try it for the first time. But her reaction to going to childcare shows you how strongly she feels about this. She should have had time at home alone before age 11. When you said she's an 'adored' child do you mean coddled?

There are a couple of things OP.

First is that you could try her coming home on her own - if it’s for 40 minutes then that’s quite a good short time to test it out.

How you pitch it is tricky because it can’t look like her bad behaviour has won her what she wants or else that will be all that happens in the future.

But if it’s really only 40 minutes then it could be worth a try - with rules around what she absolutely must not do.

Alternatively, one of my frequently used phrases was ‘this is not a negotiation darling, I am telling you what is going to happen’. It’s not a choice it’s just what is going to happen.

If she’s calm this morning perhaps you can say ‘do it today and let’s plan how we can give you a bit more freedom in the future.’ And negotiate that instead.

Best of luck, puberty is a swine at times.

This is what my mother always said. She had a very responsible job and worked long hours but the payoff was all the nice things we got to enjoy.

OP, I think it’s fair to say “Please don’t talk to me like that, I don’t talk to you like that do I?” but I appreciate that not all kids will concede that point like mine do!

You’re doing fine. Puberty can be so tough, on everyone involved!