Cosleeping advice- at my wits end 😢

[Bullzeye]

My DD is 9 weeks old. I also have a 3 year old. I chose to cosleep with my eldest due to being a poor sleeper until the age of 3, who still struggles to sleep on his own and now sleeps with Dad. I promised myself this time around things would be different but here we are again, sleep deprived and feeling like a failure.

DD won't ever go in her own sleep space, I've tried everything, white noise, swaddle, dark room, bedtime routine etc. I know I need to cosleep at night for my sanity however how do I get anything done in the evening!? I try to put her down just so I can wash the bottles/have a shower for my bedtime routine and it ends up being hours of trying and failing. Every 10 minutes she will scream wanting to be rocked back to sleep. She ends up being so overtired and each time is more difficult to get her back to sleep.

For context day naps consist of baby wearing and contact naps when my eldest is at nursery.
At night, she won't even sleep beside me. She has to either be on my chest or with her head on my arm. She's getting bigger and heavier and it's becoming really uncomfortable for me. If I lay her down on the mattress next to me, she does the same thing... Waking every 10 mins screaming until she is back on me again.

I feel insane someone please give me some tips on how I can get a little bit of me time🙏 (no I'm not sleep training her as I'm happy to cosleep)

Can your partner not take the baby for 20 minutes in the evening and rock her while you shower?

Have a look at the contented little baby book.

That said 9 weeks is v v little and your baby sounds v normal. It’s not so normal for a 3yo to need to sleep with dad tbh and that’s what I’d be focusing on.

It does change, but it is bonkers when you’re in the think of it. My first didn’t have a night where she wasn’t on me for all or part of the night for her first 8 months, it was all about survival.

First of all cosleeping is a personal choice and It is very normal actually for many families. It's a primal instinct, animals sleep with their kids and so do many other cultures. If my little one feels safe and secure that trumps what other people have to say.

You don’t appear to want advice as you are putting yourself on par with primal animals.

Your OP said - ‘I promised myself this time around things would be different‘

So either safe and secure and primal - or actually very dysfunctional for the family unit and creating insecurely attached children unable to settle / self soothe? Your child isn’t safe and secure if dependent on one of two adults being around to sleep.

No baby in the neonatal unit screams every 10 mins and needs to be in constant contact for sleep. They all learn to settle and sleep safely in cots incubators.

This is a you issue rather than a child issue.

Rude. Is it a problem you want help with, or isn't it?

A 3yo needing an adult for all and every sleep is neither feeling safe nor secure btw. And I cosleep as a choice.

No. That book is dangerous IMO..I thought it went out of fashion a long time ago and with good reason.

It advocates for very strict routines and mothers whose babies just won't fit in with the routine often end up feeling like a failure, with no one feeling anything close to "content".

Routines work for some mothers and babies and not others. But the book doesn't recognise this, it makes you feel there is only one correct way. I really wouldn't be surprised if trying to follow it - especially when it was a best seller and it felt like everyone else was managing to do it - pushed some struggling new mums into PND.

It's not based on science, the author isn't a mum, and she once threatened to sue Mumsnet.

Best given a very wide berth IMO.

Bullzeye, I never did manage to crack the "how to do things in the evening" issue with my youngest, who wanted to contact sleep when very little.

Instead we muddled through with a combination of DP stepping up a bit, and doing a bit more, and just letting a lot of things slide in those early days.

Are you able as a family that reorganise things so there's less pressure on you to get things done in the evenings? Your DD is still very little, and you're absolutely right it's a primal instinct to be close (and we are mammals, no matter how much people may like to deny that!)

I agree with the poster saying that it may be time to transition your 3 year old into his own bed. You can't go on like this and it would free up your DH to help with the baby.

There's no reason that you can't work towards your DS feeling safe and secure in his own bed.

Sleep deprivation is a killer. You are not a failure! It’s bloody hard to raise kids.

Can baby’s Dad take baby when you are getting ready? If that’s possible that’s one easy fix. I appreciate it’s not always viable with a toddler in the mix.

Do you have anyone who can babysit or even just pop round for a chat and help out with the chores?

There is a reason why people say it takes a village to raise children. Please don’t be afraid to ask others for help.

Are you saying that once your 3 year old is asleep your partner has to stay in bed with him otherwise he wakes up? If not, and if Dad can sneak out once DS is asleep, get him to hold the baby for an hour so you can have a shower and feel more human again. If DS can’t stay in bed by himself even once asleep for a few hours, I agree with others that you need to work on this rather than the baby (and I say this as someone whose seven year old still co-sleeps sometimes!).

My partner does help out but he works on call and sometimes has to go to work for a few hours in the evening. My 3 year old CAN sleep on his own but will wake through the night and it's just easier for my partner to stay with him than stay in bed with me and there is more risk to the baby having him in bed too.

Wow.

Just, fucking, wow.

Thank you.
Yes Dad does help out of course but sometimes works in evenings and is back super late.

Yes some absolute world class mothers thinking they are giving world class advice.
Taking with a pinch of salt 😊

What time are you trykng to put her down? Is she falling asleep on you and then waking up on transfer or shortly after transfer?

Just until you get back into a somewhat more rested state, can you get yourself ready for bed including shower before you put DD to sleep. And either wash the bottles earlier in the day or your partner does it when he gets home.

You take the baby to bed with you. Take a charged phone with some earbuds and podcast, or a book that you can read by low nightlight.

Boring but maybe just what's needed till you get some more rest.

Other things that occurred to me -
Is she warm enough?
White noise machine with the heartbeat setting
Use pillowcase you have slept on as the sheet for her next to me.

Many years ago, a friend had a similar problem. She put one of her worn tee shirts in the cot, and her DS seemed to be able to sleep better. We assumed it was because he could smell his mum, and was comforted by it.

Op if your 3yo can sleep on their own as per your later post then just start this into a routine, bed time story, chat about what a lovely room, hug etc then out to your own room!

Moses basket beside the bed and you rock baby to sleep in your arms then put down before you lie in bed with them in Moses basket beside.

But the issue is that the baby won't be put down?

Thanks. We have tried to get him to fall asleep on his own but he tells us he is scared and he won't sleep. He falls asleep quickly and we leave him until partner jumps in with him and finished the night with him. When I was pregnant we tried to leave him on his own and he would wake multiple times through the night crying and having nightmares. At this point we are doing what we can to ensure everyone sleeps and is happy the next day!! Looking after a grumpy toddler and a newborn is totally not worth it.

I have a next to me crib and believe me I've tried it all 😂 lying with my arm on top of her etc.
She needs the contact to sleep at the minute or she just won't stay asleep.

I know it'll get easier but right now I guess I need to ride the wave.

Shallotsaresmallonions

Sorry looks like my phone cut out some sentences!!! I was saying we used to rock for a long time in the arms, took forever to a rhythm and after a while they’d fall asleep (was a longer explanation but have forgotten how I worded it!!!)

Not world class but safe and secure kids (many more than you) and not on the internet asking for help then going - because the animas do it I’m actually primal you know.

You are clearly unhappy with how you’ve parented the first one and now you’re preparing process with new born.

Animals don’t co-sleep for the human equivalent of years and their rates of infant mortality are a damn sight higher. But hey a fox knows best.

Approximately 75% of wild fox cubs die within their first year, with high mortality rates. While they can live to 12+ years in captivity, the average lifespan for a wild fox is often only 1–3 years, with roughly 60%–80% not reaching adulthood.

Those wise primal animals. They know it all.

There is a reason why there is research and safety advice. Co-sleeping means your kids are both anxious and stressed. A child waking up and getting into distress every 10 minutes or every night isn’t actually a good outcome for the child.

Yes if 3yo is ok on his own at least until adult bedtime (say 11pm) then DP needs to step up in the evenings and hold the baby so you can get showered etc. then you go to bed with baby and a podcast as others have suggested. On nights DP is working after DS’ bedtime you could either ask someone else to help or just forego the shower etc. if you can’t bear (and DS won’t sleep through) the baby screaming. Does DS go to nursery in the day? If so maybe shower then - put baby in the bouncer in the bathroom so she can see you and be as quick as possible -she may cry for five minutes but I always thought that was worth it to feel clean!

9 weeks is tiny. But YABU for waiting until having another one before cutting the co-sleeping with the 3 year old, who will now be feeling pushed out.

Also, I know you say you’ve tried everything but does that include a dummy (can’t see it mentioned in the list)? Might buy you enough time for a quick shower!