ADHD daughter - Time blindness and lateness- Need help!!

[WhyDontZebrasGetUlcers]

For those parenting ADHD children what strategies have you found to help with time blindness. My 13 year old daughter just cannot manage time and is constantly late. I have sat down with her to talk through possible solutions but nothing works and its causing huge friction between us. I have tried different types of prompts (verbal /visual). Setting things out in advance to aid organisation. Setting a frame for her in terms of what things need to be actioned by what time in order to keep her on track (e.g brushing teeth, getting dressed). I am trying not to micro manage as she then feels pressured by me and it ends up in a big stressful argument. I am finding it so unbelievably stressful as I'm a single parent with 2 other younger children. One of whom also has ADHD but because he's not as oppositional or defiant I can generally manage his getting ready in a slightly more effective way.

If I just leave her to it she's massively late for school etc and consequences make no difference to her. She doesn't learn from this like a neuro typical child might. All it does is create more upset, dysregulation and chaos. Requiring more energy from me (e.g where she's forgotten lunch card, school ipad etc).

She makes the rest of us late for school/work and I am literally tearing my hair out and want to cry from pure frustration.

I would be so grateful for any advice please.

Have you tried the medication route with her yet? When I moved from methylphenidate (concerta XL) to Elvanse, it became evident just how much I zoned out without realising. I have much more day and time available to me, much lower anxiety and find it easier to focus and organise myself.

Do you give a time countdown? I do 1 hour when waking her up. 40 minutes, 20 minutes, 10 minutes and 5.

I'm like the talking clock but at about 10 minutes she'll suddenly kick into gear and speed up. I make sure she's awake during the countdowns as she would simply sleep through if I wasn't making sure she was actually awake.

She's still often late but mostly that only impacts on her. Luckily with our day to day routine everyone else can get themselves where they need to be independently so it's not causing others to be late.

This sounds very simple and you've probably already tried it, but my teen uses alarms on his phone all the time to help live with his ADHD. As in, alarm ten minutes before he lives. Alarm with checklist five minutes before he leaves. Alarm and different checklist ("close the front door, put your key in the middle pocket of your bag") when he's leaving. It sounds like nothing, but the stuff I do automatically slips his mind.

Also to keep in mind that "remembering" tasks are still tasks, and will seem endless to an ADHD mind. With alarms on phone, you set them once and then they don't ask for any more mind work from you- less overwhelming.

Is medication an option? I despaired at myself just as much as everyone around me despaired for years, then went onto Concerta XL and it changed my life. I had to come off it after 7 years (nothing to do with the medication itself) and while it's not perfect like it was on the medication, during that time I've learned coping mechanisms and techniques so it is very, very rare that I'm ever late anywhere or disorganised. Just saying that so you can see that medication doesn't have to be a permanent thing if you or she is worried about that.

Countdown is the only thing that’s remotely worked for DD. She has multiple alarms and if I’m not in I still have to call her to remind her. She’s still late sometimes. I’ve also struggled with time blindness my whole life - pretty sure I’ve got ADHD too (currently being assessed) and also have to set alarms.

" If I just leave her to it she's massively late for school etc and consequences make no difference to her. She doesn't learn from this like a neuro typical child might. All it does is create more upset, dysregulation and chaos. Requiring more energy from me (e.g where she's forgotten lunch card, school ipad etc)."

I agree the just leaving them to it makes things worse. With ADHD the executive function of getting organised is very lacking. Being left to fail can cause low self esteem and anxiety. It won't miraculously improve the executive function.

Try and streamline the mornings but making sure everything is ready the night before, like you would do for a much younger child. If she isn't worrying about forgetting things then she only needs to focus on actually getting ready to go.

I think the first thing is to keep reminding yourself that it isn't her fault. I get that it's incredibly frustrating for you. But it's probably even more frustrating for her. She can't switch it off at will.

Definitely look at medication if she isn't already medicated. Otherwise, I think it's about helping her find what might work for her. Some people like big egg timers that visually represent the passing of time. Some people like apps that guide them through their morning routine. I use my Alexa devices to prompt me at different stages in the process of getting ready, but it still isn't perfect. Sometimes, I just can't seem to stay on track no matter what I try.

Do you know what's slowing her down in TV morning? E.g. is she getting distracted by her phone? (I bought myself a phone safe to use when in really don't want to be distracted - I think it's probably important for her to be in control of using something like that, though, as a means of managing things for herself, rather than you imposing it on her, otherwise she will feel like she is being punished.)

What about natural consequences? If she knew that you were going to leave with the other dc at a fixed time and she would be left behind, that might help to focus the mind? Nothing like a hard deadline to help an adhd brain really kick into gear!!

I would echo the alarm thing. DC has Google home satellite in his room so when dropping off can add alarms, tasks, etc. just by speaking. Also, regularly asks Google to set timers so doesn't get too focused on something and forgets to leave on time. And, setting tasks and reminders in a calendar that then appears on the phone front screen also helps. The only thing to remember then is to look at the phone....which never seems to be an issue

Is there anything else making her avoid school? Is she burnt out, bullying, struggling with work? I have (late diagnosed but it was glaring) ADD and used to stay at home to manage my own workload sometimes during GCSE year because I was such a seat of the pantser.

It takes work, finding and implementing strategies and even then it's work in progress. I found reducing my journey to as few stages as possible, even if longer made this easier to follow through on time. So a walking commute, not a bus or tube one, or even car. It was relaxing and there were fewer mental breaks in the chain. Maybe grab and go breakfasts, these can be home made or even a couple of bananas rather than sitting down with a bowl and spoon.

Alarms. You take her phone at night. Or at least in the morning. I'd consider medication. Is there any learning support at school?

When is she at her best in the day? Evening, a night owl, straight after school? Perhaps she can get her prep for the day done then and the morning absolute basics. So, bag packed, uniform ready etc.
, all checked.

DS doesn’t do anything that his phone doesn’t prompt. His morning routine is in place, but apart from that everything else is responding to an alarm on his phone.
He’s 30, and if we go away his phone sprouts a whole forest of tasks- who to ring, when to do bins, walk dog etc.

He arrived at school without shoes once. So make a list of what she needs to do to get up. Get her to check it and add what she wants. Then set it off- new task every 5mins. The spare time at the end becomes treat time. Then shuffle the start until it’s about right so she gets a bit longer in bed, if that’s what she wants.

• Clocks (the old fashioned sort) everywhere, alarms, and checklists. My house is set up like a train station - I can ALWAYS see a clock (and they're all set 5-10 minutes fast).
• Prep everything you can the night before
• Get up earlier
• Stop rescuing her if she forgets lunch, ipad etc. You have to work, she has to find ways of remembering what she needs.

Oh and a paper calendar. I've found it genuinely transformational, no joke. I was always too disorganised then tried farting about with phone or outlook ones for years. Now, for important stuff, write it on paper on the wall.

Agree with mechanical alarms and timers. Somehow harder to argue with than phone.

Also agree I'd stop paying extra dinner money. She can manage a day a bit peckish, or you can start putting an apple in her bag. I'm tempted to say also bus money if applicable as that's now I learnt (and got my steps in) if safe, light and in reasonable walking distance but obviously don't want to suggest that and something go wrong on the way. There need to be some ways she manages the situation or gets on with it herself.

We havr had similar. Much better now he's medicated. But for us, streamlining mornings has been hugely.important. clothes ready the night before. Ipad on charge. I expect him to do chores... but not in the morning. He gets up. Says breakfast. Gets dressed. Brushes teeth. Goes to school. That's it. If, for some reason, I can see he's struggling even with that, just step in... make him.breakfast, put his water and ipad in his bag etc. In fact, in just remembered that when we started streamlining I did that as part of the process if making it easier. Over time he started taking on these routine tasks himself. He's 14

I'm in same boat with 17yo DD. Following for advice!

Same here! Late everyday, everywhere. No consequences from school seem to make any difference at all. Gave up and passing the problem to Uni this autumn!

Hi, my daughter is always last minute with everything, always forgetting things or realising that something isn’t where she thought they were. It might be worth analysing what causes the delays so you can build strategies. Eg check uniform is ready the night before. My daughter leaves all her books and equipment in school so it is not lost, homework is done on google classroom and classnotes provided as part of the adhd support. I give her time reminders to keep her on track. The school also make allowances now if she is late to form/lessons due to distraction/ loss of focus/ time blindness. I also have no time perception so have to have everything in a diary and constantly keep an eye on the time. I build in extra time. My daughter finds it almost painful to wait for things so she tries to time things to avoid waiting which often means waiting till the last moment then having to run for the bus. I have made her take public transport to school rather than the school bus, when she misses it, so she feels the pain of leaving late. We are still looking for new and better strategies and I hope these suggestions help.

Thank you so much for all your responses—I'm massively grateful for all your suggestions.

So we haven’t gone down the medication route yet, as the psychiatrist who diagnosed her doesn’t feel it’s needed for now, but it’ll be reviewed in future.

I do use verbal countdowns, and they help to a point, but we still struggle in the last part before leaving. Even if she’s dressed and ready, she often gets distracted/ needs to do something extra/ runs back upstairs etc and can’t bring everything together to actually leave on time despite how much organisation we've put in place. This is often the stage where it all breaks down as she then feels like I'm pressuring him and her anxiety escalates and then is directed at me.

She’s ok with me checking in during countdowns (like you’ve got 45, 30, 20 minutes left), but as we get closer to the time, her perception of urgency shifts. She starts to feel like I’m shouting (I'm really not - I've learnt that raising my voice just makes things 1000 times worse so I try my best to stay calm and steady) which leads to dysregulation and conflict.

I really like the idea of using alarms, but wonder how you make them effective? For those who use them how do you label them so they knows what each one means? I worry she’ll just ignore or not register them.

I know leaving her to it doesn’t work, but it’s really tough balancing support with encouraging independence. It doesn't seem to be one single thing slowing her down. It's just her perception of how much time she actually has is so distorted.

I was thinking of getting her a clock so that she can see time actually moving rather than just checking her phone for the time, though she struggles a bit with reading analogue time.

Thank you so much again to you all for sharing. Just finding it a huge struggle right now so am grateful for your support.

perhaps apps etc with visual countdowns, rather than just telling the time - like a sandtimer kind of thing, but digital. She can see the end point and how quickly it's getting there

and an Alexa or whatever that speaks the alarm and what she should be doing, not just an alarm on a device - so it says 'start getting dressed now' and then later 'you have 5 minutes left to finish dressing' or whatever, so that it keeps track for her - and removes the emotional element of you shouting.

Or one that she literally has to turn off or check a box to show she's done it, etc., to stop her ignoring them.

Reward for leaving on time every day for a week?

I'd say too complicated in a morning to say what is for what exactly. I'd just have a loud mechanical timer that goes off at say 10 min intervals, I'd say until the time she needs to leave.

I would go back to the doctor and suggest that, in fact, she is not coping without medication. I learnt a long time ago, painfully, that starting DS' day with him stressed/overwhelmed/disregulated had nothing but negative knock on effects for the rest of the day, most notably his learning and his behaviour in school. So medicating, even if it's just first thing when she wakes up on a short-duration, seems sensible.

Even if she’s dressed and ready, she often gets distracted/ needs to do something extra/ runs back upstairs etc and can’t bring everything together to actually leave on time despite how much organisation we've put in place.

This is the difficult bit. DS has learnt to let all this stuff go - sometimes in an irritating way when it's something he DOES need - but a lot of the time it's ME anticipating and sorting in advance. eg realising he hasn't packed his ipad or that his PE kit is actually in the laundry area and he won't realise that so I just fetch it and put it in his bag. etc.

Also, ETA that one thing at a time. I'v elearnt NOT to say things like, "DS, eat your breakfast then take your meds". I just tell him to eat his breakfast, and then either hand him his meds or mention them when he brings his plate into the kitchen. So any alarms etc work best if it's task A then when task A is complete, move ot task B.

We were given advice on dealing with adhd. The big thing for time blindness and distractions, say before school was to use rewards. The external dopamine factor keeps them on track.

Mine are younger but it’s things like if you can get ready by 8.15 you can play a game/ watch tv before we leave.

They often say the adhd brain has two settings now and not now and if it isn’t now there’s no motivation.
Also understanding that transitions always take longer than you think so allow 10 minutes for something that would take 2.

Clocks everywhere - all set slightly ahead.

I'd be back to psych asking for a trial of meds. They can be transformative.

I would argue with the psychiatrist that medication is needed as she is being chronically late and it’s causing a raft of problems including affecting her mental health and self esteem.

I have ADHD and recognise all of that. And agree with you about the ignoring alarms thing. If there are too many you just start tuning them out and they are no longer effective.

Tbh it sounds like you are doing everything/have tried most things re strategies and they are not working. Strategies can be useful but they do not cure ADHD. I think the time has come to try medication. It can help with all of this plus the emotional dysregulation she is experiencing. The strategies you have tried may then be used (and be more effective) as an adjunct to the medication.

Id be asking for the 2 monthly appt to be brought forward as she’s not coping so you can discuss medication.

I'm an ADHD adult recently diagnosed.

I wrote down all the accomodations I've put in place over the decades...it broke down into tools and behaviours. A phone is a tool. Setting and responding to the alarms is a behaviour.

Your daughter needs empowering, she needs to be taught that she is responsible for her own actions, but that you as her parent can provide tools for her to support her. Those tools will only work if she uses them. She needs to be educated into the fact that the traits she exhibits are not in her control, but her response to them is within her control; her behaviours.

She has come to rely on you to provide the behaviours as well as the tools, and she needs to take that back into her control. Watch your language around her too. It's common for ADHD folk to be made to feel lazy or guilty for their traits and be clear that it's not her traits that's at fault, it's her management of them; her choices.

It'll be painful, she will be late, she will miss stuff, but that's a consequence of her choosing not to use the tools you are providing, her choosing not to manage her traits.

As an aside, it was very eye opening writing down my tools and behaviours in that way. I would suggest you encourage both your ADHD kids to do this. It really made me think about how I use my calendar, to do lists and alarms and more importantly why I need them; what are they doing for me? The ADHD UK site had a great wealth of possible accomodations, and I used that and added a few.

Oh and being rubbish in the morning is an ADHD thing for sure. It's not just a time blindness thing...it's a feeling like you left your brain sleeping in a different dimension. I need 4 alarms 5 mins apart just to get me out of bed followed by a 10 minute shower before I'm human enough to even say good morning to my partner.