Four year old - do I really have to resort to reins?

[summerm]

I’ve done a search for similar issues and reins seem to be the favoured option. I’m reluctant to go down that road though - will explain why in more detail below.

DS is four and a half, starts school September. He’s reasonably sensible, doesn’t run off or go into roads or anything like that. But he does have an infuriating habit of just vanishing. Today for example, we’re at a small museum and he goes onto the next floor without asking / telling me - just goes. On the way out he went charging ahead of me and outside - I’m sure he wouldn’t have gone onto the road but he goes out of sight and while I realise it’s unlikely someone could snatch him in those moments.

I can keep up if it’s just us but I have a younger child and that slows me down.

I really, really don’t want to resort to reins. I am worried that he’ll never learn to stay near me then, and he can’t wear them forever. I also feel like I do want him to have a reasonable amount of freedom, like at the museum I don’t need him glued to my side but he just doesn’t seem to get ‘stay in sight.’ Like when getting into the car - I put my younger one in first, I’ll tell him ‘stand there still’ and he just ignores me and wanders to the side of the car where I can’t see him. Reins wouldn’t work in that instance as I don’t want to be yanking him around with me. And I do feel they are for much younger children.

I guess I’m looking for tips on how to get him to listen a bit better. I’ve tried to drum it into him that it can be dangerous but he just doesn’t really pay attention.

What are the consequences for when he doesn’t do as you ask? Like when you’re putting his sibling into the car?
At 4 and a half he’s old enough to understand not going off by himself.

Has he ever got lost? I'd be tempted to engineer it. In the supermarket or something where you follow him round without him realising. See if once he realises what it's like not being able to find you he might be a bit more careful.

Either that or the wrist strap things, they're a bit better for older children

I am worried that he’ll never learn to stay near me then, and he can’t wear them forever.

Why would this mean he wouldn't learn? We use all sorts of adjustments for children, doesn't mean they don't grow out of them. IMO reins are to keep children safe until they have learned to keep themselves safe. A tool to be used alongside modelling good behaviour, praise, consequences, reinforcement and repetition.

I think he’s still too young to trust that he won’t do those things and you could end up in a dangerous/accidental situation that I just wouldn’t risk at that age.

I have a 9 month old and a 4.5 year old too and I would leave the 9 month old next to me in the pram whilst I strap the older one in rather than hope the 4.5 stands and waits sensibly.

What he's doing could have really bad consequences. You can get a wrist strap thingy that seems a bit "older" than reins. Or the backpacks with a strap. Until he learns to stay put he wears the wrist strap.

I'd get a wrist strap. If he's not safe yet, he's not safe. He'll get there. But don't leave him unsafe.

You don't need him to "listen a bit better" in the car situation though - you need him to do what you say so he doesn't get run over and die.

I would go with reins and I would explain to him that he will be wearing them until he learns not to run off from you.

I suspect he will learn quickly.

What are the consequences? Sorry if you've tried his already but with my rather adventurous rabble it's a matter of setting expectations before we get out the car/ leave the house.

'we are going to a museum today, there's going to be A LOT of exciting things to see and it's going to be BUSY. So, there's two things I need from you. I need you to LISTEN to me and I need you to stay close to me. If you can't listen and you can't stay close to me - we will go home because I can't keep everyone safe."

I would also give a silly example like 'i don't want you to go further than 4 crocodiles away from me' so that when they start moving away I can say some thing like 'OOH you better not step on that fourth croc!' - that works better than just saying stop/no/too far on repeat.

If DCs go further than whatever parameter I've set - they get one reminder/warning.

Second offence, we go home.

I've only had to do it a couple of times, they know I mean it now. It's actually worth taking low stakes day out and enacting the 'go home' threat when you've not spent loads of money on a day out.

I couldn't get on with reins with multiple children. It was like walking too many dogs, especially with a pram as well. I hated it, and so did they tbh.

The thing is, you can set expectations out so clearly but in the moment he just doesn’t … I don’t know if it’s over excitement or whatever but he just blanks frantic yelling from me to come back / stop - just carries on oblivious.

Reins are all well and good (he wouldn’t feel any sense of embarrassment or humiliation at having to wear them) but I can’t tie him up while I put his sibling in the car or really keep him next to me forever, eg at a playground or park where the whole point is for him to run and play.

Is he too big for a double buggy? That's another good way of enforcing a boundary, 'if you run off you'll be going in the buggy' ad infinitum.

I'd be tempted just to give any big days out a miss at the moment and just take him to places where you can practice expectations/consequences safely.

Get him in the car at the same time, he's contained then. Teach him to do his seatbelt up himself - that's quite exciting/empowering for young kids.

not a cat in hells chance he'd have the feeefom to go to a different floor in the museum if he was with me. He stays by me or he has wrist tether on. Not negotiable. At the park he stays in the designated area or we go home 🤷🏻‍♀️

Definitely too big for a double buggy! And he’d want to go in it - that wouldn’t be a deterrent in the slightest.

People have responded to tell you how to keep your child safe and you aren’t taking any notice- I am not sure why?

Why would you not want to keep your child safe on a road/ car park? Why would you not choose to keep him SAFE near you using reins??

I understand at a park/ play area he should be free but maybe you need to just go to parks that are enclosed/ gated for now to keep him safe.

Has he got additional needs/ a processing disorder?

Regardless of this the priority needs to be his safety- he is showing you every day how he is not listening and how he is at risk, you are the adult please keep him safe.

yeah unfortunately this could have really serious consequences so you need to pull it way back. Get him into his car seat first, keep reins on him all the time, only go to small gated playparks. Explain why and practice loads. would be good to work out if he’s just inquisitive or deliberately ignoring you or if there’s something else going on. Thinking of everything possible but is his hearing okay? Any other signs of other challenges? The only child I know personally who had issues like this at 4 had other symptoms of neurodiversity as well as the uncontrollable impulsiveness so I wouldn’t necessarily think in that direction unless there’s other stuff going on.

but until he learns you’ll just have to restrict him to what he can do safely. It’s too much of a dangerous situation to let it slide longer for me anyway.

I think this sounds fairly unusual at 4 and half.
My youngest was an absconder and did stop around 4-5. She always refused reins.
Eldest was also tricky.

I would say its often a sign of sen.

How is his behaviour at nursery - is he listening to their instructions? What would happen if they took him somewhere?

If he had been at school from 4 they might have been taking him on a school trip by now where he would have to stay with the group.

Does he scoot/cycle and stop for junctions etc?

@summerm what are the consequences for him not listening?

Let's say you've told him to stand next to you while you put the baby in the car. He doesn't. Then what happens...?

Yep, this. Either he isn't mature enough yet to listen, so reins are necessary to keep him safe, or he knows very well what he's doing/sticking to this rule isn't important to him, so using reins will focus his mind on caring/remembering as the consequence of not is much worse.

I remember DD1 randomly deciding to drop my hand and peg it across a road when she was reception-age. The reins went on for the rest of the week, and she hated them. By Monday, she was ready to give being a Big Girl another go and was allowed to demonstrate just how nicely she could walk to school holding my hand. It never happened again.

How olds the youngest? If very little then maybe put them in a sling and hold the older ones hand. After about one I struggled to carry but did keep my second in a buggy until the first could walk with me reliably, as I just couldn't manage 2 running in opposite directions.

I also found stay there or stay in sight to be to abstract at 4. Maybe more precise instructions like "stand here touching the car door" or "stop and wait for me at the next lamp post"

I strongly resisted grandparents calls for reins when my son was around 3. Lots of hints and "Well we did it with you, and you are fine now" etc.

For me, reins are not going to cause major damage or have a significant lasting impact on a child. My parents were right, they didn't do for me. I grew out of them, and never ran off or got lost as an older child.

But - using them means missing one of the many chances that we get to teach our children responsibility and good behavior. If they are unsafe, by all means use them, but if you think you can handle it without, why not? I knew I could handle my son, and I could see him improving with time - and he did. He now has no problem walking with people, doesn't dart off etc. Likes to hold hands, and be by you. I'd have missed that opportunity for improvement/growth if I had used reins.

(But that is with only one child. 2+ kids? Who knows.. maybe it would have been necessary)

Sounds like he needs more discipline, take away something he loves if he behaves like that, tv, his favourite treat. It’ll only get worse because he thinks it a game.
i gt a 4 yr old and she wouldn’t dream of running off because she knows the consequences. Good behaviour gets rewards.

Use the reins. I wouldn't even think twice about it. Mine were in them until just before they started school. No problems at all. This is exactly what reins are for.

Put him in the car first. I always did with my eldest. Even if you can't strap him in until after you have sorted the youngest, at least he is contained in the vehicle then rather than running loose in the car park, which is potentially extremely dangerous. I always did this. At least then you can strap youngest in and then concentrate on him. Far safer.

None of this works with my ND dc. They're too impulsive. It's like the blinders come down and all the can see is the thing they want to explore.

You need to pick and choose where you go, reward for doing as he's asked ,lots of animated chatting to keep engaged and a consequence for not. Ok, we are going home now. We are sitting here and waiting for 3 minutes until I know you can walk safely. We practiced a game in a safe place of ok, go to the next lamp post and wait , red stop, green go. I empathise,I had one of mine who always wanted to be a head, it was such a relief once he was older and could but you just have to keep on with reinforcing what is safe. Sounds like you are inconsistent and expect him to have more sense than a 4 year old does. No way my wanderer would have made it onto the next floor and if he had I'd have been very upset with myself for taking my eye off the ball.

You can’t force them to understand that it’s dangerous. By all means explain it and talk about it, but they just don’t get it yet. Not really. You either use a wrist strap or you give immediate and proportionate consequences for wandering off out of sight.

As for the car, just open the door and tell him to sit in his car seat himself. You can buckle him
in after you’ve sorted the wee one. I don’t understand this problem at all- why are you faffing about with the wee one first while he’s hovering about on the pavement? Just get him to sit in the car. Mine sits in the car while I sort all the crap into the boot etc, I don’t do it the other way round and get him to wait.