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Original poster

9 year old girl friendship angst

47 replies

Fluffyflipflop · 26/08/2024 19:55

Hiya, hoping to get some advice on how to help my daughter navigate some issues she’s been having with her small female friendship group for the last year.

My daughter goes to a very small primary school, there are only 2 other girls in her class and a few more boys.

She has always been very close friends with one of these 2 girls, from toddler age. We were in a bubble during covid, she has come on holiday with us etc and we are friendly-ish with her parents (have had meals together etc, but not close). To be honest this little girl has always felt like part of our family and perhaps something I started to take for granted.

This best friend and the other little girl have always played as a happy little trio, getting along really well. All of us mums have said how lucky we feel that our daughters have such a solid friendship group.

However, about 18 months ago, the best friend started to clearly favour the other girl in the trio. It started in quite a harmless way way, always picking the other girl to be partners with for example. Then gradually actively excluding my daughter, sometimes ignoring her completely for week . The last year at school has been awful with the behaviour becoming bullying. The ‘best friend’ pushing my daughter over, purposely kicking a football at her head etc. My daughter stopped wanting to go to school. It also extended to online, where she would be invited into a group chat and then actively ignored within the chat (this was quickly resolved by not allowing any more group chats but at the time it added to the consistency of it all)

I spoke to her teacher who was able to tackle the aggressive behaviour, but of course the more subtle stuff (like whispering, sniggering and excluding) is harder to see and to stop.

I have talked to her mother about this and she says her daughter denies the whole thing. That as far as her daughter is concerned, they are still best friends and love each other. And perhaps my daughter is just imaging things or being sensitive.

Of course, we supported our daughter through this, explained that we can’t force others to like us or want to be our friends. Told her that we loved her and tried to
build her confidence, reminding her how brilliant she is. We encouraged her to branch out and make friends with the boys, who tend not to get bitchy or catty. And she did really well, she made some lovely boy pals and started to worry less about her old best friend who didn’t seem to like her anymore.

Every now and then she gets a little sad, looks at old photos and mourns their old friendship. She’s quite a nostalgic little girl, but she had got through the worst of it and the future was looking a little brighter.

Then…

During the early part of the summer holidays, the old best friend got in touch over text message and said she really missed being friends with our daughter and could they be best friends again? My daughter immediately forgives and forgets the entire year of heartache and they spent a couple of days chatting, sharing photos (all very closely monitored by me) and my daughter was walking on air. She was so so happy that her old best friend was back and she could go back to school with a buddy. As it was going so well, I arranged a play date and took them both to the seaside for the day. They got on like a house on fire and it was really lovely.

However, from the very next day (and the 2 weeks since) this friend has completely ghosted my daughter. Once again she’s being invited into group chats with the other girl and then actively ignored when she says hi or tries to join in with the conversation. Of course I’ve had to put a stop to the group chats again. But for my daughter this feels like a massive rejection and she’s now dreading going back to school.

It genuinely feels like she’s been hoovered and ghosted, narcissist style. (I appreciate this is unfair, they are only 9!)

Im not sure what I want to hear, but perhaps some advice about how to help her navigate through this. My daughter has lost a lot of confidence over the last year, has stopped going to all the clubs she was in, and doesn’t even want to go to the park for fear of one of the girls being there. She point blank refuses to join any clubs at all now. Almost panicking at the idea, and I don’t want to put pressure on her. She used to be so sociable but now says things like “I’m weird” “people just don’t like me” etc 😢

I realise children are fickle and I only know her side of the story. But my daughter is a nice kid, she’s polite and kind and funny. If anything she wears her heart on her sleeve too much, making her a bit vulnerable.

Ive suggested changing schools and my daughter absolutely hates the idea and absolutely begged me not to do it. Plus, I think there may be more value in learning how to deal with this situation rather than run away from it? But what do I know, I feel like I’m completely failing at this so open to all suggestions.

Thank you

OP posts:
Original poster
Fluffyflipflop · 26/08/2024 21:13

Bumping for the later crowd 🤞🏻

OP posts:
TheBrightBear · 26/08/2024 22:49

Solidarity....if you scroll down in parenting you'll see my thread from yesterday evening about my 9 year old losing her close friend. Luckily we haven't had the bullying aspect but there is a lot of sadness here in this house at the moment.
I'm not sure what you can do as the school is so small. You might get a lot of comments telling you to move schools but I know the reality of that can be difficult.
But I guess she really does need the outside school activities that those girls don't go to in some shape or form to counteract this.
Our school has a voluntary code that most of the parents have signed agreeing not to give the children a smart phone in primary school. I can only imagine how hard the phones make all this.

Maybe she could do some kind of camp at midterm? My daughter did one by herself this summer and it was brilliant for her confidence as she found another girl to hang out with for the week and they got along very well. Any little thing where she might meet someone new and see that she can get along with them.

Pyjamatimenow · 26/08/2024 22:55

No advice but big sympathy here. I have a ten year old who seems to be pushed out and ignored a lot. It’s really worrying and upsetting.

cupcaske123 · 26/08/2024 23:05

I think it's a lesson in learning how to nip this kind of thing in the bud. It sounds like the bullying was going on for some time and escalated and your daughter didn't have the skills to deal with it.

As soon as they started excluding her, in hindsight, she should have backed away from the friendship and when it became physical, it should have gone through the school protocol for bullying. And escalated from there if it didn't stop.

Your daughter shouldn't have taken the girl back as a friend after how badly she was treated. Some things aren't forgiveable.

It's obviously good to be kind and to forgive others but learning to stick up for ourselves and having good boundaries are invaluable lessons for life.

MikiSu · 26/08/2024 23:08

I'm sorry OP but I'd be insisting she change school. There's no value in sticking this out, she needs nice kind people around her :(

Beansandcheesearegood · 26/08/2024 23:28

My dd is turning 11. We've been there, 'best friend ' very manipulative, low level bullying- agreeing to be partners in PE, then pretending she can't hear my dd speak at all, trying to get all the gurls not to speak to her etc. I did mention to teacher but explained to dd ultimately she needed to decide whether that's how she liked being treated. After many many angst and tears over months- actually most of year 4- she told the girl face to face what she thought of her and why. She rejected the girl a few more times and has now at beginning if year 6 found a nice group of friends that has much less drama. This is a learning point for your daughter but wow its so hard for her and us! Year 4 and 5 girls are so hormonal !

OhMaria2 · 27/08/2024 00:01

You need to change schools. Your daughter will be learning how to tag along and placate a bully for fear of being left out/ being lonely. This is an incredibly unhealthy dynamic.
There's no one else for her to go off with so what is she meant to do?

Oor · 27/08/2024 00:03

I agree that you need to change schools. The school is too small, she’ll not be able to escape this.

Original poster
Fluffyflipflop · 27/08/2024 06:47

Thank you for the replies. I’m pleased the responses haven’t been that I’m over reacting to it all, which is what I feared!

Changing schools wouldn’t be easy and would mean needing to move house which of course may not even be feasible financially. We live in a very remote place.

There is a rumour of a new child starting in sept. I’m praying it’s a girl! Although my daughter had made some good boy buddy’s in the latter part of last term and I’m hoping that will reignite.

@Beansandcheesearegood that exact scenario of agreeing to be partners and then changing her mind last minute, leaving my daughter alone, has happened several times. Clearly a common tactic. Why are they so mean?!

@cupcaske123 i think it all happened quite insidiously. My daughter didn’t tell me anything for 6 months. I couldn’t understand why she didn’t want a birthday party and it was on probing more about that, that all was revealed. I was conscious of over reacting at the time. Obviously wanting to be sure that this wasn’t a one off - but the last episode has confirmed, this person does not deserve any more second chances. We have had lots of chats about how friends should make each other happy and be supportive. And how the best judge of a friend is how they make you feel about yourself. And she did notice a big difference when she started playing with the boys. I think this latest betrayal has been a big lesson for her, but it’s heartbreaking to see it playing out in front of me. She just doesn’t know what she’s doing wrong. I keep telling her, this isn’t about HER at all. It’s about them. Happy, fulfilled children don’t feel the need to bully others. I just wish she cared less.

@Pyjamatimenow its so upsetting isn’t it? I remember going through phases of having nobody to play with and feeling alone at school. I’ve had friends tell me she will build resilience through this and develop a better red flag sensor for friends on future.

@TheBrightBear Thank you for the solidarity, I will read your post. I have really tried to encourage clubs and to find friends outside of school. I think her self esteem has taken a massive hit and she just can’t see herself fitting in anywhere. I’m not sure how to move past that without forcing her to attend a club and facing the tears and begging that will happen. I can believe such a confident, happy little girl can do such a 180. She’s still her usual happy, funny self around family, but gets immediately intimidated by new children.

Ive explained that her old best friend is actually the odd one out here. If that makes sense. The general population of children is not like this girl!!

Yes the online stuff really bothers me. She doesn’t have a phone thankfully but does have an iPad which is fully connected to my phone. If her friends want to contact her they have to message my number which they have saved under her name (their parents doing, not mine!) The old best friend isn’t the brightest bulb and I think has forgotten that I read every message sent often before my daughter even gets chance to see it. So it is very closely monitored and I now only allow her to see what I know won’t hurt her feelings. I’ve screen shotted and sent one exchange to her mother to demonstrate who they are actively excluding my daughter in group chats (so weird!) but she dismissed it completely. These girls have been online up until 11pm most nights during the holidays playing Roblox, and chatting online - I can see if they’re online or not. And because of their insistence of including my daughter in group chats I am able to see their conversations. I have reminded their parents of this fact several times but they don’t seem interested or concerned at all that their children are effectively messaging a 45 year old woman every day. My daughter has no access to anything after 7pm and so I think has become less “cool” as a result.

How should I go about the clubs idea? Every method I’ve tried has failed and resulted in tears. I think she’d go if I could go with her.

OP posts:
violetcuriosity · 27/08/2024 07:06

Solidarity. My 9 year old daughter has been having problems on and off too. My only advice would be to take away phones and means of contact at home- let home be a space where she can't be contacted and the dynamics can't invade that safe space, at least until she's older and more resilient.

Girls can be dicks.

ShillyShallySherbet · 27/08/2024 07:13

I’m so sorry OP this sounds horrible and sorry but I think it’s largely due to 9 year olds having phones. They’re far too young. I don’t know if you can put the genie back in the bottle though, but I think taking the smartphone away would help.

sunshine237 · 27/08/2024 07:23

Yep I would ditch any connectivity whatsoever, report the online bullying to the school, and move schools as soon as humanly possible. I appreciate that's not straightforward, but I don't think this situation will get better.

So, so utterly depressing that anyone gives smartphones to primary kids - let alone 9 year olds!

Monvelo · 27/08/2024 07:31

Are there any clubs she could do outside of school that would give her a broader friendship group?

Re schools and being so remote, what happens when they go up to secondary school?

EffinMagicFairy · 27/08/2024 07:41

Some girls can be horrible, my DD was bullied from 12/13, social media exacerbates it. What is the secondary school plan for your DD? Not sure where you are, in our area we change schools at 11, so presuming you have 2 school years left, that’s a long time for your DD to be unhappy. How big are secondary schools? She needs a chance to get away from both of these girls and make a fresh start with new people. Unfortunately our experience of SM means bullying doesn’t give you any peace, there’s no break from issues at school, hoping the weekend or school holiday will dissolve situations. I would block SM contact with these girls, think of your DD’s mental health, try and get her involved in outside activities where she can make other friends outside of school. We did end up moving schools, which was a pain, as it meant a drive or bus instead of a 10 minute walk.

Vettrianofan · 27/08/2024 07:44

My DS (8) had a "best friend " but this boy assaulted him just before the end of the school term. I had to contact the school as another pupil in their class was involved. I explained to DS about boundaries and how this isn't what friends do...the parents were contacted.

One of the mums came to my front door and said that your DS has had my DS in tears etc racing home trying to be competitive...not at all comparable to assaulting DS! What a cheek. It was her DS in the wrong. I just explained that I needed the assault to be in writing for legal reasons should further incidents occur.

I understand what you're going through OP. Some DC can be incredibly mean.

DS has made friends with other boys who are in his class and live locally. He has moved on now. At the start if the holidays he did attempt to meet up with the boy who he was friends with but he never answered the door so I said his mum may be busy working etc. He gradually stopped asking.

rollerblind · 27/08/2024 07:45

I'd move her school too. As others have said, two years is a long time to be unhappy. Sorry you are going through this. Heartbreaking 😔

thekrakenhasgone · 27/08/2024 07:49

What about the other girl in the trio? Does she get on well with her? Do you know if the other girl has been on the receiving end of similar behaviour?

I would speak to the teacher - a new one for the new school year? The dynamic will likely change again

Three is always a bad dynamic- there is always the potential for this to happen, even in the tightest friendship group

It's not your daughter's fault - make sure she knows this.

shockeditellyou · 27/08/2024 08:04

Get her off the bloody iPad for a start -why on earth would you bring all the school drama into your house?

We are at a very small primary and yes, it can be a bit too small. Are there composite classes - can she play with the girls in the year above/below?

I’m not sure I would automatically move schools if you are y5, but concentrate on out of school activities and minimising school drama - don’t let it be all consuming. “Best friends” in primary shouldn’t be the be all and end all.

LittleLittleRex · 27/08/2024 08:38

There's three of them, you were quite happy to nurture the best friend dynamic when your DD was one of the favoured two - you should encourage your DD to think about the one who is left out, drum home that with only three girls in the class, the pairing up doesn't work without someone getting hurt. Sometimes it will be her.

When the fickle one decides to favour DD again, make sure DD includes the other one and doesn't let it happen, change the default dynamic (which is one little girl having all the power and two playing pick me).

Talk to the school about asking them to pair up, as it's encouraging this. School can set pairs or put them in a three. Or move to a bigger school.

TheBrightBear · 27/08/2024 09:13

Fluffyflipflop · 27/08/2024 06:47

Thank you for the replies. I’m pleased the responses haven’t been that I’m over reacting to it all, which is what I feared!

Changing schools wouldn’t be easy and would mean needing to move house which of course may not even be feasible financially. We live in a very remote place.

There is a rumour of a new child starting in sept. I’m praying it’s a girl! Although my daughter had made some good boy buddy’s in the latter part of last term and I’m hoping that will reignite.

@Beansandcheesearegood that exact scenario of agreeing to be partners and then changing her mind last minute, leaving my daughter alone, has happened several times. Clearly a common tactic. Why are they so mean?!

@cupcaske123 i think it all happened quite insidiously. My daughter didn’t tell me anything for 6 months. I couldn’t understand why she didn’t want a birthday party and it was on probing more about that, that all was revealed. I was conscious of over reacting at the time. Obviously wanting to be sure that this wasn’t a one off - but the last episode has confirmed, this person does not deserve any more second chances. We have had lots of chats about how friends should make each other happy and be supportive. And how the best judge of a friend is how they make you feel about yourself. And she did notice a big difference when she started playing with the boys. I think this latest betrayal has been a big lesson for her, but it’s heartbreaking to see it playing out in front of me. She just doesn’t know what she’s doing wrong. I keep telling her, this isn’t about HER at all. It’s about them. Happy, fulfilled children don’t feel the need to bully others. I just wish she cared less.

@Pyjamatimenow its so upsetting isn’t it? I remember going through phases of having nobody to play with and feeling alone at school. I’ve had friends tell me she will build resilience through this and develop a better red flag sensor for friends on future.

@TheBrightBear Thank you for the solidarity, I will read your post. I have really tried to encourage clubs and to find friends outside of school. I think her self esteem has taken a massive hit and she just can’t see herself fitting in anywhere. I’m not sure how to move past that without forcing her to attend a club and facing the tears and begging that will happen. I can believe such a confident, happy little girl can do such a 180. She’s still her usual happy, funny self around family, but gets immediately intimidated by new children.

Ive explained that her old best friend is actually the odd one out here. If that makes sense. The general population of children is not like this girl!!

Yes the online stuff really bothers me. She doesn’t have a phone thankfully but does have an iPad which is fully connected to my phone. If her friends want to contact her they have to message my number which they have saved under her name (their parents doing, not mine!) The old best friend isn’t the brightest bulb and I think has forgotten that I read every message sent often before my daughter even gets chance to see it. So it is very closely monitored and I now only allow her to see what I know won’t hurt her feelings. I’ve screen shotted and sent one exchange to her mother to demonstrate who they are actively excluding my daughter in group chats (so weird!) but she dismissed it completely. These girls have been online up until 11pm most nights during the holidays playing Roblox, and chatting online - I can see if they’re online or not. And because of their insistence of including my daughter in group chats I am able to see their conversations. I have reminded their parents of this fact several times but they don’t seem interested or concerned at all that their children are effectively messaging a 45 year old woman every day. My daughter has no access to anything after 7pm and so I think has become less “cool” as a result.

How should I go about the clubs idea? Every method I’ve tried has failed and resulted in tears. I think she’d go if I could go with her.

Edited

Sounds like moving schools isn't really an option.
You've made great progress with the boys! If she has a couple for friends who are boys for the duration of primary there's no harm in that. I grew up in rural areas with small schools too so I know where you're coming from. I assume secondary school will have a wider pool of children to be friends with.
I wonder if the friendly boys do any clubs that she'd be able to join too? Do girls sometime attend scouts or similar?
A good suggestion from someone there if the classes are mixed...maybe there's a friendly girl in another class you could do a playdate with once in a while even if they don't play in the school yard.
Maybe you could make a deal with her to try a club for one term/block of classes or whatever in return for a reward as I've found sometimes there can be a lot of clinging and anxiety and only watching for the first few sessions then finally they'll start joining in and in the end they start to enjoy it and see it as part of the weekly routine. It can take a while. Even if they don't make a particular friend it is social exposure. The way to overcome anxiety is to face the fear...unless you can see the club isn't particularly nice it is probably worth persisting with something for a while.
Try to focus on the friendly boys etc and not analyse, ruminate on the mean girls etc...obviously listen if there's bullying type stuff but keep future focused...no point dwelling on memories of what used to be...the only way is forwards!
Try to keep your own anxieties to yourself and not let her see (so hard I know), be cheerful and optimistic in front of her if there's any opportunity of interaction with others take it!
Wishing you the best of luck.

Vettrianofan · 27/08/2024 09:52

Monvelo · 27/08/2024 07:31

Are there any clubs she could do outside of school that would give her a broader friendship group?

Re schools and being so remote, what happens when they go up to secondary school?

This.

Mine has started a new sport extra curricular club each week so he is meeting new people his age.

This is really important so they realise there's more to friendships in one setting. Expand their horizons.

Vettrianofan · 27/08/2024 09:53

Please do ditch the phones. DS won't be getting one until he is secondary school age. Unnecessary before then. School life is already enough of a roller coaster for them as is!

Original poster
Fluffyflipflop · 28/08/2024 06:58

TheBrightBear · 27/08/2024 09:13

Sounds like moving schools isn't really an option.
You've made great progress with the boys! If she has a couple for friends who are boys for the duration of primary there's no harm in that. I grew up in rural areas with small schools too so I know where you're coming from. I assume secondary school will have a wider pool of children to be friends with.
I wonder if the friendly boys do any clubs that she'd be able to join too? Do girls sometime attend scouts or similar?
A good suggestion from someone there if the classes are mixed...maybe there's a friendly girl in another class you could do a playdate with once in a while even if they don't play in the school yard.
Maybe you could make a deal with her to try a club for one term/block of classes or whatever in return for a reward as I've found sometimes there can be a lot of clinging and anxiety and only watching for the first few sessions then finally they'll start joining in and in the end they start to enjoy it and see it as part of the weekly routine. It can take a while. Even if they don't make a particular friend it is social exposure. The way to overcome anxiety is to face the fear...unless you can see the club isn't particularly nice it is probably worth persisting with something for a while.
Try to focus on the friendly boys etc and not analyse, ruminate on the mean girls etc...obviously listen if there's bullying type stuff but keep future focused...no point dwelling on memories of what used to be...the only way is forwards!
Try to keep your own anxieties to yourself and not let her see (so hard I know), be cheerful and optimistic in front of her if there's any opportunity of interaction with others take it!
Wishing you the best of luck.

Show quote history

Thank you for this reply. I must admit I’ve been finding it hard to stay positive because it causes her so much worry and I’m absolutely dreading her going back to school. But you’re right, I do need to be more positive.

I’m going to explore the clubs with her. We’re in such a remote place there isn’t much going on. The 2 girls in question are in all the obvious ones. But I shall research. Do you guys just force your children into clubs even if they cry at the thought of it? Im genuinely interested to know.

So many messages saying to ditch the phone. Like I explained in a previous post, she doesn’t have a phone, she has an iPad and, if I allow it, she can see my text messages. I’ve switched that off again as soon as it started getting nasty.

My suggestions last term, of playing with children from the year above or below has fallen on deaf ears. And unless I invite them around to play against her will, I’m not sure how else I can make that happen. I think she’s lost so much confidence that she feels she isn’t friendship material and is now too scared to try making new friends for fear of rejection.

OP posts:
TransformerZ · 28/08/2024 07:04

Tell her friendships are fake.
Not to waste too much time on them and emotions.
Keep things superficial.
Take her to athletics and maths, chess club etc.
Go to your place of worship on the weekend.
Expand your social circle.
Does she have cousins? Siblings?
Poor kid, stuck in the middle of nowhere.

BananaGrapeMelon · 28/08/2024 07:13

The same thing happened to my DD at the same age. She was really upset about it for about a year before finally starting to make other friends, which turned things around for her and she had a really happy and positive year 6. Honestly, I would consider moving schools even if it's a long journey. She has two more years of this!