Pumping help

[mmmare]

Hello.
A lactation specialist doesn't think my 1 month old is getting enough milk (pooing every 2-3 days and a poor latch).
She's recommended I pump 8 times a day and cup feed what I express.
I've just pumped for the first time and got 80ml. LO just screams when we try to cup feed.
I don't know how this is going to be sustainable. He feeds for 45 mins, then I need to pump, then try to cup feed, then he needs to sleep and then it's time to go again?!
Any advice?!

I think it depends how important you believe it to be to exclusively breastfeed. I was put on the regime you describe and it had a terrible impact on my mental health. I decided to top up with formula using a bottle whilst I addressed the latch issues. Then I gradually reduced the formula. By 10 weeks she was on 30-60ml formula per 24hrs. I kept that because I was exhausted from the stress of it all. She dropped the formula herself when we started to introduce food at six months, then breastfed until 18 months. The lactation consultants would not advise what I did - risking nipple confusion and low supply and meaning baby is not EBF. Only you can decide what is best for you and your baby.

Your lactation specialist is a twat lol sorry but pumping 8 times a day while breastfeeding and trying to cup feed is ridiculous, my 7 month old is breastfed and since about 6-8weeks old only poops once a week, so lack of poop isn’t a sign they aren’t getting enough, why does she think your latch isn’t good? Are your nipples sore? Personally best way to get milk production up is putting baby to breast whenever they want and lots of skin to skin contact, is your baby behaving like they aren’t getting enough? Eg fussy, unsettled etc xx

I was also advised to pump 8 times a day to build supply. Baby fed 45 min EACH SIDE then fell asleep for about an hour before wanting the next feed, around the clock. Then would clusterfeed for 4 hours each night. That gave me some windows of about an hour to do things like eat, use the bathroom, shower etc. Not sure when I was supposed to have time to pump!!!

Anyway, I didn't do the impossible and after about 3 months I found breaks between feeds slowly start to increase.

I'm not saying this is THE right thing to do: but it was right for us. Your mental health is also important and pumping is soul destroying.

Thank you for your reply, great to hear that you still managed to bf. The impact on mental health is huge. I've managed the pumping today but think we need to bottle feed any expressed milk. I'm worried he will then hate the breast, but have to do what is sustainable to us all!

She watched me feed and said my attachment and latch weren't quite right. He had a tongue tie cut at 1 week and she also wonders whether something is still not quite right with that, but will be next week that they review that again. Nipples however aren't sore (whereas they were awful when he had the tongue tie!)
He is fussy and unsettled in the evenings and sometimes at the breast randomly during the day. But other times falls asleep happily at the breast.
She's really knocked my confidence and I feel like we're back to square one! Appreciate the reply thank you.

Thanks for the reply. Seems like the best advice is what's right for us as you say.
Surely they should be able to see that the pumping 8 times a day regime is likely to break people rather than build positive BF!

I did breastfeeding and pumping - it was hell. My baby never got enough milk from my breasts - I also had a very slow letdown, so she often got frustrated or felt asleep.
I fed for 40 minutes, pumped for 30, washing, sanitising, feeding- and start again; 8 times a day. Did it for 4 months - it is possible, but very hard!

I really don't understand the cup feeding - I've never heard such a thing.
Maybe she is afraid of nipple confusion? If that helps, my baby took all types of bottles (and I had at least 4 different ones) and never had an issue.

I’ve fed 4 babies and my 3rd sounds a lot like your little one. I started topping up with formula at 3 weeks as I was on the cusp of a mental health crisis, don’t think I slept at all until then.
4th baby had perfect latch and nursed until she was 3.5.

Tip- if you’re thinking of trying a bottle, go for a latex teat rather than silicone

Have they been checked for tongue tie - posterior ones are sometimes tricky to spot

https://habermanbaby.com/suckle-feeder

their bottles are really good for mimicking actual breastfeeding as opposed to bottle feeding

I don't think pooing every 3 days is unusual. My first pooed every day and second pooed once a week. Both breastfed with pretty much the same routine.

Its number of wet nappies and steady weight gain that need to be watched.

You pumped a good amount! Why cup and not bottle feed?

Is baby putting on enough weight? I'd ask health visitor for second opinion

I would echo what others have said about there being nothing wrong with giving a little bit of formula, even if it just gets you going at first until your milk supply gets up. I did this when my little one was born. I never breastfed directly but pumped exclusively pretty much after relying on a bit of formula the first week or odd times my fridge/freezer ratio hadn’t worked out and my timings were off so made a bottle of formula. It was great to have as a back up and made me relax knowing it wasn’t all on me! We made it to 5/6 months doing it like this. By the end I was giving a bottle of formula before bed as in my head I thought that would keep her asleep (and she did sleep ridiculously well so my theory seemed to work) 😅

Other factors in how successful you’ll be pumping are things like which pump you use. I used the Elvie and I loved it. I also bought enough parts so that for during the night I had a pre sterilised pump sitting ready to go and wasn’t having to wash parts. Further into my journey I realised you can keep parts in the fridge to save washing (up to 24 hours if i remember?) and that also kept me going a bit longer as the washing and setting up the pump was the time consuming bit!

Most importantly don’t panic. Your baby will be okay. They will get milk. Whether it’s from you or a bottle. I think it’s often us that puts this pressure on ourselves by setting goals of what we want to achieve in an ideal world. I’d say take the pressure off. You also need to be able to sleep in, drink, eat etc in order to function as a human yourself! I think I did 7 feeds in 24 hours, maybe 8 at the very start but tried to stay up til midnight or 11.30 to do one so that I felt like I was only up once during the night. Hope things get easier for you. You’re doing great

Just wanted to echo that your lactation consultant sounds like a twat. Well done for breastfeeding this far, especially with opinions like that coming at you!

Breastmilk causes less waste and poops than formula, so as long as your baby has plenty of wet nappies they're getting enough milk. If your nipples aren't sore and baby isn't gassy, you probably don't have a latch issue either. Especially if she couldn't point out exactly what was wrong - e.g. shallow latch or wrong position.

Most babies are unsettled in the evenings too - the witching hour catches us all. Supply usually slows down in the evening and they're tired and cranky after their days. If you were going to offer any expressed milk this would be a great time to give yourself a break but absolutely not abnormal to have a fussy baby in the evenings.

I'd recommend checking if there's a local La Leche League near you - amazing free breastfeeding advise.

Is he putting on weight? IMO that's the only thing you need to think about.

Above average weight gain in the first two HV visits (last one was 15th August), next is on Wednesday so we'll see!

We had exactly the same advice and it ended with me in tears to a lovely midwife who told me it was most important that I was happy and in a good place for my baby, rather than putting enormous pressure on myself to keep her EBF. My baby was slow to gain her weight back after birth but got there slowly with combi feeding (we lead with breastfeeding and I also pump 1/2 times a day to keep a stash in the fridge to top up with a bottle but we also use formula to top up if I can't express enough) this made me feel so much more positive about our feeding journey and I felt the weight lift off my shoulders. I'd never have opted for formula but it's really helped us.

Oh and we tried cup feeding once, it took two of us and it went straight in the bin and we switched to a bottle and we've had no issues!

Above average weight gain in the first two HV visits (last one was 15th August), next is on Wednesday so we'll see then!
I think it must be nipple confusion concern, but so many here use bottle and breast, so I feel like that would be better than failing with a cup!

I'm glad we're not the only ones! It's horrific isn't it.

See another lactation consultant. If weight gain is good why is she suggesting anything other than working on a better latch?

A hydrated, growing, settled baby is getting enough milk?

It really is possible to improve your latch with practice which will also help milk transfer, comfort and length of feeds. But if you’re pumping 80ml after a 45 min feed AND baby is gaining weight well you have a really good milk supply and don’t need to worry about anything. It took about 11 weeks for DC3 to settle into more efficient feeding pattern then she was a dream and as fat as a cream bun ☺️

@mmmare

I don't understand why you have concerns and are struggling with expressing and cups and so on when the baby is putting on weight so beautifully. Could you try to explain so we can help?