Poor behaviour on holiday

[Coffeedream]

We’ve just been on holiday with DS(9), DH, and in-laws with DNephew(8). DS(9) played up on/off the whole time - not listening, refusing to do as he was told, flying off the handle at the slightest thing, and grumpy. Then, he’d be alright for a while before something would set him off - all behaviour directed at DH and I (but mostly me). They say behaviour is communication but we can’t figure out what the problem but as soon as we parted ways with the relatives on the last day DS was back to his usual self and has been fine ever since.

DS gets on very well with his cousin and they’ve never argued or fallen out, but he did tell us half way through the break that he was getting irritated with him. Cousin is very ‘young’ for his age, and SIL encourages this and babies him (this has been commented on by wider family, not just us) and is an extreme helicopter parent.

She mollycoddles him and encourages his young behaviour, which DS told us one evening he was getting irritated with ie carries a stuffed toy everywhere and constantly role plays bouncing the toy over people’s shoulders and talking in a babyish voice, leans over DS in his personal space (and his parents) and clambers over him if he’s sitting eating at mealtimes or elsewhere, makes repetitive noises sometimes ie na na na etc, and his conversations and interests are young for his age. No SEN before anyone asks.

But, could this have been enough to trigger DS to behave poorly (and out of character)? Dealing with this for a week? While DS gets on so well with his cousin perhaps this is just too long given they are at very different maturity stages despite being only a year’s difference in age? As I said above, as soon as we left to go home DS went back to his usual happy, loving self but on this holiday he really didn’t endear anyone to him.

Family holidays are far too much for me let alone a child. Did anyone stop DN getting into his personal space? Did anyone limit their interactions and give DS a break? Did family use DS as basically childcare to entertain DN the whole time? It sounds like it was too much for DS and he was communicating that but no one was listening.

What chaosanddestruction said

Was the nephew's behaviour addressed whilst you were there??

I have noticed that my kids behaviour does deteriorate on holiday, they seem to act up for the parents more for some reason

I think this could've been enough and if you ever do a joint trip again make some plans to have days away from them to give your ds break.

It could also be something else. My kids always get quite cranky if they are under the weather and my ds in particular always seems to get ill on holiday or suffer with his ears from the flight. Could it be anything like that?

Was it hot? Maybe he was struggling with the heat?

Yeah mine always act up on holiday and def with the double whammy of annoying cousin and judgemental grandparents

poor ds !

Did restrictions placed on Nephew by helicopter parents mean your son wasn't allowed to do things he normally would be eg go to the park on his own?

@MotherofChaosandDestruction we did make excuses to go back to the hotel room a few times as we could see it was getting too much for DS. Several times we have said politely to nephew to let DS eat his meal, as he tries to clamber on him/share his chair etc, and he’ll go back to his chair and then starts to creep over again.

SIL allows him to get up from his seat at the table and clamber all over her while she is still eating, but BIL doesn’t allow this as much, and I think nephew thinks it’s normal to do this.

The thing is that nephew is regarded as the New Messiah and can do no wrong, and DIL will not accept anything other than positive comments about her DS or she goes mad.

@helpfulperson No, we just say to them that DS is doing XYZ and they either join in or find something else to do, although SIL gives the impression of being a bit sulky as she wants the kids to do absolutely everything together.

Being clambered over when eating would be highly annoying!

I would imagine as a child it's bad enough having your personal space constantly invaded the same as we would feel as an adult.

But then you have the added problem where you feel you have less autonomy to prevent it because adults make decisions where you go and to allow behaviour that you don't like.

It does sound like a stress and frustration reaction. And possibly a little bit of "well I'm not the good,one anyway" thrown in.

You’re looking for an excuse for your own child’s bad behaviour because you and your husband have failed to deal with it. Regardless even if he is annoyed by his younger cousin, he cannot behave like that. Also 8 is still a child and the insinuation that he can’t be playing with toys is ridiculous. He’s 5 years off being a teenager!

you and your husband need better plans in place to punish your son for his behaviour before you blame someone else’s parenting I.e your sister in law.

You needed to deal with your child’s behaviour as well. If DN is clambering over him then your job to tell him to get off and if SIL doesn’t like it then go and clamber all over her.
Sounds like DS did a sterling job of keeping his shit together while the adults did nothing. Why should he behave if the other child isn’t expected to.

I agree with parts of this. I think you need to equip your DS with better skills to deal with situations and people that he finds annoying/frustrating/overwhelming. There will be plenty of them in life! He needs to ensure that his response is appropriate.

Part of this however is learning when to walk away (and for you to walk away on behalf of your DS, in situations when he can't do so himself). The "good kid/bad kid" dynamic is toxic and you need to distance yourself from people, including family, if they are trying to cast your DS as the 'bad kid'. That's not a healthy dynamic for him and is just going to make things worse.

I disagree with 'punish' but you need to teach him that he is responsible for his behaviour and his response to situations that he finds difficult. There are a range of appropriate responses - including, for example, saying 'don't do that to me, please!' or 'I need some space and I don't want to play right now' or 'I'd prefer to sit by my mum and dad, right now, thank you'. Appropriate responses aren't necessarily those that will please everybody all of the time. If SIL gets snotty about any of these because she views your son as the free entertainment for her son, that's her problem. Your son is entitled to set some boundaries for himself and expect them to be respected.

You are very critical of your DNephew/SIL's parenting - obviously we have no idea whether justified or not, but if I'd come off a week of my usually laid-back DS being cast as the villain of the piece, I'd probably be out of patience with them too.

Some dynamics just don't really work, particularly when you're stuck together for a whole week.

It doesn’t sound like a fun holiday for your DS. I wouldn’t do it again.

It sounds like you were pretty stressed out by your nephew (and I don't blame you!). I think your DS will have picked up on this and reacted accordingly.

I wouldn't do a joint holiday again.

I'll be honest op it sounds like both kids were being pretty badly behaved but you're determined to blame the whole thing on your nephew and his mum.

Sounds like both mums are a bit guilty of this. It's much easier if you can both have a giggle and say "aren't the kids being a pain in the arse today?" rather than secretly blaming each other's. We all have days when we'd like to re-home them.

Next time make sure there is a safe space where your child can go by himself. Or set up a code word where you take him somewhere by himself for a bit

Shock horror your 8 year old DN was acting like an 8 year old!
And your 9 year old was acting like a brat - probably because he would still like to be allowed to be a child with stuffies and role playing!

Playing with stuffies and role play is quite normal for 8!

Reading your post it's completely obvious why he struggled. Holidays can create a bit of anxiety anyway- new place/weather/travel/food. Then throw in he's got his aunt , uncle and cousin there so less chill than just immediate family. Plus cousin keeps pestering him and little is being done to address that.
It reads like it got too much for him. He would have probably benefited from some days out /meals just you guys but I appreciate it tricky with family.
Lesson learnt don't put him through it again.

Ffs clambering over people who are trying to eat a meal and talking in a baby voice is not how most 8 year olds act. It is incredibly annoying for everyone else.

Playing with stuffed toys and having standard "child" interests is normal. But if they are not interesting for OP's DC then that is fine. I have an 8yo and a lot of her school friends aren't interested in these things, that is also normal.

Tbh OP I think you should've intervened more when your nephew was annoying your DS. If your SIL doesn't like it then tough, hopefully she won't want to go on holiday with you again and then that's the problem solved.

chat to your son before you next meet up. Point out that cousin is nice but young and you understand that he must be incredibly irritating. Should grow out of it. In the meantime have a secret word he can say to you to indicate he needs a break. You can make any old excuse to whisk your son away .. headache, needs quiet time in room, fresh air, the loo, popping to the car …. then disappear for a bit and do something nice together. Take him off alone more generally anyway to prevent a build up, don’t indulge the sisters demand that they are always together. Pop son in the car and take him to breakfast in a cafe

Also it’s down to you to put boundaries in, if your son is being pestered tell the other boy to stop and keep telling the boy to stop so that the boundary is consistent. Role model saying no and stop so your son can eventually learn how to vocalise no and
stop.

My DS is 7 and isn't babyish but can be a bit overwhelming and obsessive if he is in to something. I can always see when he is annoying someone before he can, he doesn't pick up on social cues particularly well.

We had a similar experience when staying with friends, first few days were amazing and the boys played great but by the end of the holiday I could see their son getting annoyed at mine and a bit moody and a bit mean at times to my DS. I just removed him completely and we went out for day to give the other boy some space. They are still very close and speak all the time and can't wait to see each other this year (for a much shorter visit!). But tbh I don't really blame your son for needing a break from that. Maybe you could speak to him about ways to be firm to his cousin to back off or ways that he can tell you when he needs some space and you can do that for him.