Waiting list for reception

[Mummyk13]

my daughter has attended my nursery since she was 3 months old attending all through Covid/lockdown and has made the most amazing bonds with her peers over the passed 3 and half years
I have worked at the nursery for 18 years working hours between 7-5:30 or 7:30-6
there is a primary school 0-4 miles on the door step of the nursery we live 1.8 miles 6 minute drive away
so we made 4 choice’sout of 6 for school application in January none of the schools have wrap around care like the school next to my work so we couldn’t make any other work

we fond out on Tuesday she did not get her 1st choice of school problem now all her friends are going to her 1st choice and she is the only one who hasn’t got her first choice

problem two one of the mums at the nursery was collecting her from me at the nursery to drop her and same collecting after and dropping her to me after school obviously now she can’t as she won’t be going to same school as her friend

I emailed our first option school on Wednesday morning explaining all this and how upset my daughter is and what I could do
the school actually called me they where so nice she said she had to call me as her heart was breaking reading the email and she wanted to put my mind at rest that this is just the first list and it changes a lot in first week she said there are only 15 children on the waiting list and my daughter isn’t at the bottom of it she said she dose not want to give me faulse hope but she said she thinks I’ll def get a place 🤞
she can’t tell me where I am
on the list untill May 1st she said she would call
me back once I can be told

question is what are the chances we will get a call for a space we have appealed but read that you never win reception appeals
but if there was no hope would the school had gone out there way the day after offer day to call me

@Sunshineclouds11 we tried that Friday it didn’t go down to well so we quickly changed to soft play and thought it’s best to bring it up gradually we are working with the nursery to to help her with the transition.

think she finding it hard as obviously and of course they should be all excited about going to big school at nursery there all talking about going together which I think is what she is struggling with

thank you so much for the advice really appreciate hearing from someone who’s been through this

@CelesteCunningham what’s frustrating is that 2020 was a low birth rate year so our bourgh are allowing children to start a whole school year early to fill places which would mean kids that are meant to start this year get pushed to the back if they meet a higher criterion

it is what it is I am just being positive and trying to work with my dc

and hoping we get an offer of the waiting list
just come on here to say we had a massive movement on the list today and just been bashed

hopefully this post helps others or gives others a place who are in the same situation to get it off there chest

or for people who have been in this situation to share there out comes not for people to bash people or comment on peoples parenting

Fwiw my ds attends a nursery on the other side of town due to it being the only one that had availability that was not term time only, so none of his nursery friends will be attending his primary! He makes friends easily which it sounds like your dd does so I'm not worried about it in the slightest. Were any of the schools you applied to your catchment school? It sounds to me like maybe the real reason you're upset is because you wanted to get your child into an outstanding school and couldn't - presumably your local one it in a bad area (based on your comments) or is rated poorly!

I don't think you're being bashed, I think people are trying to help you see that it will all work out just fine if she goes to the allocated school, and that there's no point wasting your time and headspace on an appeal.

Agreed.

I also wonder why the system needs reforming. Distance is the main criterion and it seems a fair one. I see your answer is the first to apply get a place. Would you need to put your name down as soon as your DC is born? What about people who move between the birth of their child and the approach of school start date? And what about those whose DC are born at the end of the school year?

Or would it be that there will be a time and a day when you can apply? Like when you have to call the doctor’s at 8am to get an appointment? What if people were at work? What about people who don't have access to the internet, or have not realised they have to act at a specific moment?

IMHO the current system, while flawed, is probably the best way. People have an extended period to get their application in, and nurseries and LAs can contact them and remind them. Even though the system leaves people frustrated at not being able to access their preferred school., it is more egalitarian. As others observe, one major benefit is that DC go to school locally (as long as parents list the local school) which means less traffic, greater independence and sooner, and local friends.

As many others, I utterly agree that every child deserve a good education. What should happen is that work should be done to improve the poorer school, and all poorer schools – by giving funds to support more teachers and facilities perhaps. That’s an idea.

OP I agree with others, WL is the best option for you.

You should apply as you do now online and they get listed as they are submitted ie first come first service
if people can’t access the internet then they couldn’t apply any way as it has to be online regardless and if people couldn’t work one morning out to apply which take’s 2 mini again really not bothered about what school they would be getting as I know myself and everyone I know would make this a priority

Would not really mean less traffic if you go to a local school working parents will always have to drive to drop and get to work course more traffic as two places to drop off
if children had more chance of school closer to parents work should cut out the first drop off wouldn’t it

unfortunately that’s just not happening school are not being made better and that takes years so basically where saying kids should have poor education if or untill the schools get better
in the min time areas are getting built up and no extra schools being provided

the distance works only for none working parents or flexible working hour parents
or people with high paid jobs meaning they can afford to live near outstanding schools unless your lucky enough to have a council property in these areas

And then we would have the posts from parents saying “ Oh no, my internet went down on allocation day and now my child hasn’t got a place at their siblings school and I will have to drive ten miles to a school we don’t want.”

As others have said, the current system works as well as it can, yes, some people don’t get the school they want, but tweaking it will mean exactly the same situation, some people won’t get the school that they want. Which is why waiting lists exist.

Your other point about some schools being better than others is valid, but schools can change quickly either way, a good head coming in can push a school on remarkably quickly, just as a poor head can destroy a school in a couple of years. Parents have a lot of power in schools that they don’t always use through the PTA or governing bodies, they can also help a school to move on by supporting good practice, volunteering to make the school environment more welcoming and creative, using their skills to extend children’s learning and experience etc etc.

Never said siblings shouldn’t get priority of course it’s ridiculous to think a parent can get two children two different schools at once I never once said that should be changed

you don’t need Wi-Fi mobile data is all that’s needed like when you apply now

In a dream world all schools would have the same standards but that will never happen as more privileged areas get more funding which pays more ect
people work and don’t have time to put that into a pta and they shouldn’t have to the teachers should be doing that already in an ideal world

so what about people that rent in the area for a few months to get the post code or sell up and move out once they get the better schools should they be aloud to continue at these schools or should they have to move schools if there not in the area should they have to use schools in there post code

So you're not saying it's first come first served then if you're also including sibling links?.

I am saying as in the distance criteria there are 3 other criteria’s haven’t questioned them what so ever

Oh I read about a country that does this and I just wish I could remember where it was - the system was bonkers! Spaces open up monthly so everyone tries to give birth in the first few days of a month. If you're born after around the 8th places at the best schools are all taken. I couldn't actually believe it because it sounded so ridiculous.

I disagree with you op, I actually think distance is the fairest way of doing it, after siblings etc. why shouldn’t children be able to go to their local school with the other children locally too? It would be a bit unfair if someone from out of the area got a place instead. It’s better for play dates too, kids can walk to each others houses after school. I think parents choose nurseries knowing that they will or won’t likely get it it he same school as others, our nursery is also further away and we knew we’d be applying to a school that the others probably wouldn’t be. We were fine with that and know dd will make new friends at school when she goes in September, each choice we made was the right decision at the time.

wanted to answer a few of the points you made @Mummyk13 tho I don;t know if you will take my views on board.

people work and don’t have time to put that into a pta and they shouldn’t have to the teachers should be doing that already in an ideal world

The P in PTA stands for parents. Parents do volunteer their time - even those who work. Maybe you would not be keen but some people do want to help and support. Most PTAs IME do have teachers involved, but blimey - they really have enough to do tbh. And input from parents is key and useful tbf.

more privileged areas get more funding which pays more

AFAIK this is not the case. Schools with a high number of PP pupils will get funding for those pupils. Not sure if that is what you mean - but tbh those schools are less likely to be in wealthier areas, obviously.

Would not really mean less traffic if you go to a local school working parents will always have to drive to drop and get to work course more traffic as two places to drop off

It isn't true that working parents will always have to drive to drop off. We always walked our DC to school (we tag teamed it) and both worked full time. Most other families I knew had both parents or a single parent working by the time the DC were at school. The vast majority of them walked their kids to school. We live in a residential area and our nearest primary is about 7 minutes' walk from our house, and lots of ppl live nearer. It would genuinely take longer to get the kids in the car, drive to where you could park (at the bottom of our road most likely!), and walk to school than it would just to set off and walk there.

Now more than ever many people have flexible options wrt work - wfh, flexible start and finish times, remote working from satellite offices. The place DH and I worked when our DC were first at school is now fully remote, no office at all.

Obviously if you live in a rural area then it's a different tale - I infer you do OP as your nearest schools seem to be around two miles away. Even then I would be tempted to park a few streets away and walk the last/first bit - it's amazing how it calms down a child to have a bit of a walk and talk at the start and end of the day.

OP I am genuinely not seeking to bash you - but I do think you need to understand a bit about how all this works, or you will have a long tough road ahead. I'm sorry you didn't get the school you preferred, but you may well get a WL place. Wishing your DD all the best.

So what about parents who don’t have flexible hours mine and my husband jobs are both unsocoilable hours ranging from 5 am starts no later than 7:30 and finishing times no earlier than 6 pm not everyone’s situations are the same not everyone has family local to help and tag team

its not that working parents don’t want to work it’s that they work exstream hours Monday to Friday and time there not working they spend it with there children

unfortunately a lot of people are not as lucky as the ones you are surgesting

its not that I won’t take it on board at all think it’s amazing for parents who have time and flexible hours to do the drops and pick ups
next argument would be then they have more time to travel a little further out to do so as they have more flexabable hours

again what about the huge number of parents that move out of postcode once get there school of choice should they move there child as if what you all think is right then they should shouldn’t they

I think my actually point to my post has been lost at this point and it’s just become of it works for me so it’s right commenting if you look on more post on here there’s a lot of parents in the situation I am in

the post was a question about waiting lists 😂😂

If you work 7.30am to 6pm and have no local family then I agree you will have an issue with school drop offs - but tbh that would be for any school. Wraparound care is often shorter hours than that. I guess a super flexible childminder (depending on your commute - I guess you might find one where you could drop at 7 and pick up at 6.30) is your best option. That's a childcare issue tho not a school one.

Ime 10.5hour days with those inflexible hours are not common for parents with school age children - I realise that doesn't help you, but I was responding to your general point that all working parents have to drive dc to school.

I actually used to work 8am to 6pm, but when my oldest was about 3 we decided to renegotiate to prioritise school pick up. I realise not everyone can do this but it's not unusual.

What childcare do you have in place now? Can it continue? I infer it may be the nursery you work in? Tbh I think this or that school place will not help much unless the wraparound offer is bigger than usual. 7am to 6.30pm or so is a very long day fir a child at school, which is more full on than nursery.

Wrt your point about people renting then moving, schools are wise to this and can and do remove school.offers. A popular (secondary) I know explicitly bans this in its admissions details.

It’s all choices you make though. Yes we have flexible jobs and can wfh some of the time so will be able to manage a lot of the pick up and drops offs with just a day or two of wraparound needed, but we purposely chose these jobs because of that. I had the chance to get a higher paying job in London but that would have required long commutes , longer hours and a lot less flexibility so didn’t take it as I knew I wanted the flexibility for school more. My child shouldn’t be lower down on the list because of that choice. If you struggle with pick up times you need to make choices about your jobs too.

So what about parents who don’t have flexible hours mine and my husband jobs are both unsocoilable hours ranging from 5 am starts no later than 7:30 and finishing times no earlier than 6 pm not everyone’s situations are the same not everyone has family local to help and tag team

That is exactly why the admissions process shouldn't work on a first come first served basis. What if you are both at work on the day the admissions go live?

I understand your frustrations but I think that using distance is fair and objective.

Op you are very naive about how some people have to live their lives.

I work with lots of families where they can't afford smart phones, can't afford mobile data, have very insecure employment so can't just take half a day off of their choosing.

Families who have significant mental health problems and would be likely to miss a first come first served window, but manage a wide application window.

Families with disabled children who might have appointments, or be in hospital with no phone signal at the magical first come first served moment.

Just because you live a life where you have the privilege of being able to dedicate your all to that one moment doesn't mean other people are bad parents or that their children are less deserving of a good education than yours.

When you say children are you starting a year early - so they will have 3 year olds going into reception? So, children born after August 2020?

And those 3 year olds have priority over children who are 4y and in the right year group?

Are those starting early going to stay in reception for two years or will they go through their whole school life a year ahead?

It is very unusual, ime, for a state school to admit children out of year group, allowing children who,are 'too young' to begin early.

Surely that would be the appeal basis? Your child is losing it to a child who is 3y and not yet eligible to,start reception.

As the admissions system is designed and agreed under national policy and implemented by a team of professionals, I'm not sure that a mum on mumsnet can re-design it.

Nothing feels fair if it doesn't suit you, but this is clearly the fairest system. Not everyone is going to get what they want all of the time, under any system but in my LA, for instance, 96% of families were given their first preference school. A high ratio of positive outcomes using a system.

Great post @Popcorn640 yes there are many people who would struggle with a window of a few minutes,for many reasons. The longer window to apply gives everyone an equal chance to access the Internet (at a library maybe) and find time or access supprt needed to apply.

I also feel that the op is naive and am hoping they learn some empathy or as I said, school will be a long road.

Have you ever bought concert tickets op? Think Taylor Swift or the like. Or tickets for The Lion King.

You log into the website and one of two things happen. A. It lets everyone on and the system crashes. B. It puts you into a queue.

Now when Pink came out getting tickets was my absolute priority. I sat there counting down the seconds until it opened. Literally. I hit "buy" faster than you could say Pink! And I was put in a queue. Hundreds of people who'd hit it a fraction of a second faster. So I sat there for 15 minutes waiting to be let in and finally I could request my seat. All the best ones had gone.

That's what would happen with your system. It can't be a genuine free flow of everyone doing it simultaneously because of the system won't cope. So in measures of hundredths of seconds, you'll end up in a queue, or most people will. All the best schools will get picked and many local families won't get what they want.

When you're 36th in the queue for your single entry primary, will you be happy to accept you were just too slow? If your phone glitches and reboots you and you're now 52nd are you happy that that's fair?

GPs are good example. It's easy to allocate appointments to those that need it. Anyone that is ill can call at 8 and they will get the same day appointment
What happens is you a) call at 8.00.30seconds and the queue is already too big for you to join and by 8.10 when you can join the queue there are no appointments left or b) you join the queue and when they answer you accidentally hang up instead of switching your phone off loud speaker. Both of which have happened to me!