Impossible to find mum friends?

[Tina8800]

Is it just me, or are other mothers also struggling? I have a 19-month-old daughter, and we have been attending baby/toddler groups three times a week since she was 3 months old.

I was hoping to make mom friends because I find motherhood very lonely. My husband and I are both from different countries, so our families are far away, just like our childhood and best friends. I came to the UK to pursue my master's degree and ended up staying for a PhD, and now I have a job here. I am very open, social, and eager to go out with friends. However, my friends here either don't have kids or are unable to have them, which makes it difficult for us to connect when my daughter is around.

I tried using Peanut, but it seems like everyone wants to message, and no one is really keen on personal meetups. I constantly FaceTime and text with my family and friends who live far away, so I don't want more long-distance relationships over the phone.

I've met some very nice women at the playgroups and invited them for walks, coffee, or even cocktails for a night out without the kids (my husband is more than happy to look after our daughter while I'm out). They all initially agree, but when the time comes, they often cancel or simply ignore my messages.
Finding mom friends at nursery also doesn't work because I only see other parents in the queue while we drop off the children.

I guess I am just struggling to understand. Are other mothers not craving socializing, or do they all have their own groups, families, and no time or desire for anyone new?

I took dd to baby massage very soon after she was born. Doing things with very young babies seems more likely to promote mum friendships. People feel a bit more vulnerable therefore can be a bit more open. Also, if you’re putting yourself out there that soon after birth, it may be you’re looking for friends.

I’ve found many people in England closed off as well. The friendships I’ve made have been with people from other countries (though not my own). It can be lonely but you just need to find a few to feel better, keep at it.

It’s hard, it’s probably similar to finding a partner - what are the chances of everything lining up re timings, personalities (and of DC)? I spoke to lots of people at the swings and the playground, but always struggled to do much beyond that. Even school wasn’t as I’d hoped - I know lots of people to say hello to but I tend to be the sort of person that people will speak to if there’s no one else on offer. I’m ok with that now, it means I have few obligations. My advice would be to enjoy the social interaction in the here and now, and see what happens. I hear what you’re saying about the messaging versus real life meet ups - messaging just seems draining.

It's a myth. Our grandparents rallied around. Kids were raised by a sensible community. Their children (boomers) got on with eachother, helped each other out. Their kids (us) do nothing but bitch! Especially mums. We are raising our children alone. The community has gone. After 5 years, I go out of my way not to make mum friends, am I'm an expat. Expat mums are the worst!

Where do you live in England OP? I have done 2 facebook posts on local mum fb groups, basically saying I need friends! I have one good friend from the first time, and a very close knit group of 8 from the second time. It’s tough and I think area dependent. Sounds like you are doing everything right though.

I live in a London suburb where most people didn’t grow up here so are keen to meet other people. We considered moving near to DH’s hometown but most people there are locals and I worried I wouldn’t be able to break into friendship groups.

After a baby class say I'm going to the park if anyone wants to come.

I'm lucky that I have made a lot of mum friends but I agree it can be very cliquey! I just start a conversation with everyone I hate being bored at a class then you can see who you click with

Thank you all for your messages. I strangely find some comfort in knowing I am not the only one.

I live in Newcastle—people are very nice and friendly here, but at the same time, they are quite closed off. They all have their own families and childhood friends around, and they don't seem to be interested in anyone new; especially in foreigners.

@LaundryWoes @VerityRoss
Yes, my husband always tries to comfort me by saying that I will make friends when our daughter is in school. I really hope that will be the case. I guess it also depends on the school itself, whether they have any programs and events where parents also attend?

@SoSad44 I am sorry you feel this way too! Where do you live?

@MaggieFS Thank you! These are very good suggestions. I will try to set up a book club or join one if they have it around- and see what happens.

@Givemepickles I was really upset for a while because we have two other couples in our street who had babies around the same time. I talked to both of them and asked if we should get together at some point. They both seemed keen, but after that, they became so awkward. One of them literally turns her face away when she sees me on the street. I know English people can be very awkward, but I find that so insulting. I am not pushy or anything; it was just a suggestion to meet up. I understand that they are both from here and have families and friends around, but it would be nice if they could at least say hi on the street or engage in a brief conversation with me for a few minutes. It's quite odd.

@mandymion
That's very interesting. I thought that only we - foreigners - felt like this. I had a lovely childhood, surrounded by my parents' friends' children - weekend plays, going on holidays together, etc. I just really want to give the same experience to my daughter. I constantly ask myself if it's worth keeping trying, or if I should just accept that it will never be the same?

I've also noticed similar issues when it comes to adult friendships. My husband and I thoroughly enjoy having people over and frequently invite colleagues and friends for dinners. We even host large gatherings for occasions like Christmas, Easter, and Thanksgiving (my husband is from the US). We often have people over for afternoon teas and barbecues as well. However, we haven't received a single invitation in return since we started this tradition when we bought our home. While it's clear that people enjoy coming over and spending time with us, no one has ever suggested that they'd like to host a gathering themselves. I do not know that to think of this- I lived in 3 other countries in my life, and I never experienced anything similar.

You are so not alone (even if it feels like it). Don’t stop trying to make friends - it is a bit of a numbers game and eventually one of the connections you make will stick. British people can be very “closed” initially which can be off putting.

I agree with posters here who say you might have better luck getting to know people through a shared interest or hobby - helps mitigate for the “tight knit” established friends/family groups you are coming up against.

Try and set up playdates with friends your kids have at nursery? Can use them as an entry point/reason to meet up!

I got passed a paper note via nursery once from another mum suggesting a play date as our two children played a lot at nursery, and now we are all friends.

We also organised a birthday party for him and set up a WhatsApp group for it, and that then became a general play date group for a number of families just posting when they were heading to the park etc.

How I did it was went to groups and if I chatted to the same women for a couple of weeks in
a row I asked them and their DC to do an activity or come to my house for a coffee. Then they may or may not suggest something and it went from there. It took quite a bit longer if at all for us to meet without our DC. I found keeping arrangements to day times really helped. Then say at Christmas we’d do an adult meet up with about a 50% chance of cancellation.

Also looking for mummy friends. Anyone near York?

English people just do not host like this! They will attend your event but do not expect a return invite

I don't expect invite for big gatherings; but not even an invite for a cup of tea after having them over at least 10 times a year for food and drinks it's strange- and considered extremely rude in my country.

@Tina8800 I think it's very rude here and I don't know how people can still accept your invitations without reciprocating.

My grandparents are boomers and my parents are gen x and I was born in the late 90s. If I think back to when I was growing up in primary school, it's very different to how it is now. Nowadays it's more drop and run and if I go off what I've read on MN, play dates don't come as naturally and children don't play out as much as I did. I'm a FTM of a 2 month old and I'll start baby classes soon. I didn't grow up in this area and most of my school and uni friendships drifted over time. I hope to find new friends but I bet locals will just stick together🙁 it's quite lonely because I don't know anyone around my age who has had children.

If you are aiming for Mum friends with young children, asking them out in the evenings might be tricky with their own commitments. I would suggest for park play dates to start with and build from there. When mine were small I was way too busy and skint to even think about going out in the evening. If I did go out in an evening it would be with DH for rare quality time.
they maybe too shy to say they can’t get out of afford it so slink off.

suggest day meet ups that are kid friendly, when you have established a good footing with them they may start to want to go out in the evening. Friendships take time and to the person who said English are closed off, no we are not, maybe knackered and skint. To group people in such a way is unkind. Good luck.

Try Bumble BFF!

I can relate to you. I had my kids in France and Belgium and met lots of friends there. Some were from my home country Sweden others were local. We then moved to London when the oldest was starting school and I met a few people there, all expats. After London we moved to the NW England and although I got to know the people on my street, the other parents from my kids classes and some from dog walking and exercise classes it was almost impossible to actually make meaningful friendships. They were all friendly but it was the type of place where they all had their families there, had grown up in the area and they had no interest in adding to their friendship groups. It's not that you are doing anything wrong, they are just not open-minded enough.

Now I have moved back to Stockholm, which is notoriously hard make friends in, and in the almost two years I have been here I have made 5-6 new friends who I see regularly, but what we all have in common is that we have been expats. We all know that it is hard to come to a new place and start afresh.

I couldn't not reply to your message as this resonates so strongly with me. I actually have my own thread about it from when my son was pretty much exactly the same age as your child.

I am also in Newcastle and you are entirely correct about how difficult it is. While I haven't found people to be as outright rude as you are describing, I have found it very difficult to make friends. I think a lot of people are "from" here even if they moved away then moved back and mostly socialise with previous friends and family. I too have lived in many different places and never found it as hard to make friends as I have done here. (I am from the Uk but not from Newcastle).

A few things:

1. I think the age your child is at now is the hardest possible age to make mum friends. They are not tiny babies which is a bonding experience and opens the door to conversation. People are back at work/in the swing of normal life after maternity. But neither are they really old enough to actually enjoy playing with other children/making friends in their own right. This does naturally get better on its own as they get older. My child is now three and there are some parents from nursery that I would count as friends.
2. It definitely is a numbers game keep at it - in the end you only need one/two close friends to feel less lonely. At the same time, if someone is repeatedly ghosting you and making you feel bad just drop it. It is definitely not you but chances are they have their own things going on and don't have the time so it is not worth your time investment. I would also recommend trying to find fellow transplants (can be from the UK or abroad) - it is a shared experience which is great for bonding.
3. Try and do something for yourself - I have taken up a hobby. I haven't met any friends through it directly but it makes me happier which has a positive knock on effect.

I too had a very similar childhood to the one you describe and would love to re-create it. I am 100% not there yet and I am very lonely sometimes but I can see that it will get better. Bear in mind that the childhood you remember was when you were older - my mum tells me that she was also very lonely when I was tiny.

I will drop you a PM with a few Newcastle specific suggestions that may help but are a bit outing.
Wishing you all the best - it will get better - just slowly.

It is really hard. My son is 5 now and as a toddler we didn’t really see anyone apart from my best friend and her son, I was lucky to have them. People just don’t seem interested in making new friends. It’s been easier since he started school last year, there are some nice mums who we meet up with but that took most of the 1st year to build up. Do you have local Facebook pages? I often see people on here asking if anyone in the area wants to meet up so could be worth a try?

I moved twice and had to make friends from scratch. First time was through baby clubs and meet ups. I found the first time mothers had more time and headspace for this than those with multiple children. Then dd started nursery so I invited a few mothers each time to our house to celebrate Halloween party, Christmas crafts and normal play dates. We kept them short but more frequent. It didn’t take long bevies we were invited back and the friendships developed. Have you tried having a little party op? Just 5/6 dc and their mothers.

We did this when they started school too. I would tag on a glass of wine or a coffee at the pick up, or ensure I had time to stay if invited.

I understood that the friendship might not work due to circumstances, but always worth a shot, and most of the time it worked out. Organising things for dc always seemed to work,

Is there a local mums facebook group you could post in to ask if anyone fancies meeting up? Apart from nct friends the only couple I met in London were from shared interest groups on facebook (one who became a very close friend) then we left London for Yorkshire when DD was 3 and again met one friend through shared interests, had a few playdates with friends of friends/acquaintances from years ago in the same area that didn't turn into anything more and only really made mum friends when she started school. That said, we both work full time and DD now has lots of hobbies so we are very busy!
My best mum friend from London was also a sahm and when our daughters were 19 months we did most of our mum socialising together but she has built quite a squad since her dd started school and they moved out to the home counties (so hope is there!)
I'm sorry nobody seems to have taken up your invitations. I would have certainly agreed to cocktails! Really hope you find your people, you only need a couple!

Yes English people don’t really know how to host (I am one) and certainly not on a large, fun scale. Our tradition is stiff formal dinner parties and we all think that our houses and gardens aren’t big enough, clean enough or posh enough to host. That’s why only family (or friends we’ve known forever) get past the door. So don’t take it personally - but if they don’t at least bring a damn good gift then don’t invite them back!

I never understood the need for ‘mum’ friends. Why can’t you just have regular friends? Why must they be other mums? I have a lot of friends - I too am an expat (British but not living in the UK) and my friends aren’t all mums. I have a couple of friends who happen to be mums, but that’s not why I’m friends with them. Loads of my friends are child free, why is that an issue? I just take my kids along when we do stuff that’s appropriate for kids and DH and I take it in turns to watch the kids if the other one of us wants to do something that’s not kid friendly.