Ungrateful 5 year old

[Embarra55ed]

DC1 has just turned 5 and I’m struggling at the moment with how to deal with him. Whatever he gets, he will find some reason to complain about it rather than being happy and I’m worried that he is really spoilt. E.g. tonight as a treat I gave him and his sister a homemade ice cream (well, shop bought components but assembled at home - really nice cone, 2 flavours of ice cream, nuts and a flake). I thought he would be delighted but instead of thanking me he immediately started complaining that he hadnt got 3 flavours (I hadn’t given him coffee as knew he wouldn’t like it). This is typical of him.

I told him I’d tried really hard to give him something lovely and it was rude that he hadn’t thanked me, and he did then say sorry and thank you, but how can I work on the first reaction? Is it just because he’s 5? (His 2.5 yo sister is nothing like this, but then he probably wasn’t at 2.5 either!) Will he grow out of it? Do I need to be stricter? Tbh when he started whinging at me tonight I felt like taking the lovely ice cream away from him.

I would have taken the ice cream away.

More seriously does he do this with other adults e.g. grandparents, aunts, uncles, family friends?

I would have taken the ice cream away, or at least threatened to do he understood his behaviour was wrong.

I don't think you can really expect gratitude from a five year old, they don't understand enough about the world yet and don't know that you've gone above and beyond. But they absolutely be polite, say please and thank you, and not whinge or complain about what they're given.

I told him I’d tried really hard to give him something lovely and it was rude that he hadn’t thanked me

Dont set yourself as a martyr/victim or he will either play on it or model it (maybe the complaint was modeling a poor me role) - a simple well if you don't want it I'll have it is sufficient and let him work the rest out himself.

I actually don’t know re other adults (other than DH who he definitely does do it with!).

We don’t live near family so see them quite rarely but he’s generally well-behaved at school and his clubs etc. I guess in those scenarios people are giving him things in the same way.

I mean AREN’T giving him
things

Thanks yes, probably good advice. I wanted him to recognise that it was rude to complain when it was obvious I’d gone to some effort but tbh even if I hadn’t it was still rude!

I feel like his default is just to always ask
for more. If I’d given him the third flavour he would have found something else to ask for. He’s also constantly comparing with what his sister has.

I told him I’d tried really hard to give him something lovely and it was rude that he hadn’t thanked me, and he did then say sorry and thank you, but how can I work on the first reaction?

I think you did well with that; you pulled him up and made him think without blowing the whole thing out of proportion.

At bedtime maybe chat about ‘the best thing that happened today..’ or ‘the things I was grateful for today..’ to change his mindset. You can then model gratitude, ‘ I really enjoyed watching you in the paddling pool’ or ‘I loved it when daddy made lunch,’ ‘I had fun making ice creams for everyone.’ He’ll learn to start seeing the world through other people’s eyes and also have to think of the nice things that happen to him.

My ds1 always had a negative first reaction. It was just his personality and I really worked at trying to adjust it.
I wouldn't take the ice cream away but I'd point out that if he had a choice between that ice cream or no ice cream, what would he prefer? Isn't he lucky then?

When he's a bit older, start making him aware of it and tell him to try not to let his first reaction always be negative. It's so frustrating!
But my darling is now a happy cheerful teenager who isn't always negative but still can't help it at times.

Take the ice away immediately, no fuss, no explanation,no unpleasantness eat it yourself straight away or put in the bin. You may need to do something similar another once or twice but he'll learn the lesson very quickly. He is trying to control you.

Thanks @Draconis this resonates with me as I do think it’s really part of his personality, but equally he needs to learn how to moderate it as it’s not a very appealing trait. Thank you for the advice.

@Geo42 that’s certainly exactly what I felt like doing but it seems very harsh…what do you think he is trying to control? I would never have given in and given him the other flavour (which he also knows) so I don’t think he was trying to get me to do anything as such.

I think taking it away without warning would be very harsh.... depends what you mean by complaining..... him mildly saying he'd have liked three flavours (and you maybe taking it personally), or him throwing a fit and whining for ten minutes?

If the first, I might ask yourself whether you are particularly triggered and over-invested in him thinking you've done wonderfully by him? If the latter, then yes - clear warning then very fast consequences.....

Did you or anyone else have 3 flavours? If so, did you explain before giving it to him why he didn't have the same?

I just say “pardon” or “thank you mummy for making me a delicious ice cream that’s very kind of you” my 6 year old usually takes the hint

Oh, if you don't want it/like it that's fine. " Remove icecream and eat it/feed it to dog/chuck it in the bin.

It was much closer to the latter. I wouldn’t have described it as a fit, but loud whining of “ohhhhhhh it’s nooooottttt faaaaiiirrrr” and stomping about type stuff. No tears or shouting but extreme whinging I would say and absolutely no suggestion of a thank you.

@AllBlackEverything everyone had 2 flavours but the adults had coffee+choc, kids had vanilla+chocolate.

The ice cream is just an example though. I can’t think of another off the top of my head but generally he will find something to complain about. I’d like to know whether im handling it right or whether I should actually ignore it or be harsher.

I have a DS5 who is similar. I’m no expert by any means. I’ve been a lot stricter, which has worked in my case.

Firstly, make sure you set him up for success. Explain that there are only two icecream flavours. I often say ‘You will not fuss over what you get’ and ask him ‘what did I say?’ And he responds ‘to not be fussy’. It works if we go to a shop and he wants me to buy him something too. ‘Mum can I have a chocolate?’ ‘What did I say before we came in?’ ‘Ah, we’re only getting some bread.’ I’m just reinforcing the expectation.

Try to also give a choice. ‘Do you want this flavour or that flavour?’ If he asks for both, patiently repeat that he can only have one flavour. If he fusses, I remind him again of the expectations.

Sometimes it doesn’t work. If he continues to complain, the treat is taken away. Same if he doesn’t treat his toys well, E.g. throws them, purposefully damages them, etc. I take them away for 2 days. I have thrown toys in the bin when he’s thrown them in a tantrum.

I personally never use language like ‘I worked so hard on this’ or ‘you’re hurting mummy’s feelings’ or anything like that. I prefer clear rules and consequences when they are broken.

What do I think he is trying to control? YOU!He is 5 he hasn't given this long and deep thought but he knows that if he doesn't give you the praise you are seeking then he is for that moment "in charge". Don't overthink all this it is not complicated. Good luck.

My 4.5 year old sometimes does this. I think it's his age! I tend to say "well you can have this or nothing (or an option he doesn't like as much)" which seems to focus the mind and suddenly makes him a little more appreciative...

Try not to take it personally, he is 5, and I think you are responding as if he was an adult. Little kids have whiney stages and they need to be taught good manners.

Model the behaviour you want - prompt him to say thank you when he gets it, and if he complains about it - tell him whining is an awful sound, why doesn’t he tell you what he likes about it.

If it carries on take it away / take him home / end the activity.

He needs clear boundaries. Don’t martyr yourself to him - he’ll play on that, and martyrdom isn’t anymore attractive than whining.

Ok so forget you know that you wouldn't like one of the flavours....if you and your friend were given ice cream by someone and your friend had something different would you wonder why? I don't think his reaction was that odd given 5 year olds are still learning manners, self control and appreciation.
Are there better examples of him being rude or ungrateful?

It’s stuff like i say he can watch tv for half an hour, and he will immediately say “ohhhh I wanted one hour” - it’s like whatever he gets he wants more and will immediately focus on that. Whereas I guess I’d hope that he would be happy and grateful for what he does get, rather than sad that it isn’t “better”.

There aren’t any big examples, it’s just constantly like this. I’ll read you two stories before bed/it’s not fair why can’t I have 3 etc etc.

But sounds like it’s fairly common and I should just carry on as I am (which is reminding him of his manners and trying to get him to focus on the positives).

In general he is a very kind and caring boy, and very thoughtful with his friends and little sister. Which I should remind myself of too!

Definitely model the behaviour you want. Doing things like taking away the ice cream and throwing it in the bin won't get the results you think it would.
It would make him act similarly.
Expect manners, gratitude and kindness, model this too (without being a walkover or martyr)

With my ds, I got him involved with charity work, volunteering, helping around the house, buying small gifts for sibling and baking stuff for grandma.

Bedtime chat could include one thing that he's grateful for or that made him happy today.

Just keep going. It's frustrating and not easy. Especially because mine takes after his dad!

I can’t believe people are saying to throw the ice cream in the bin! You pulled him up and he apologised!

I agree with PP about preempting. My daughter is the worst for eg moaning about one more episode of a programme even if we’ve agreed we’re only watching the one so I always say beforehand eg “How many are we watching?” And in a jokey voice “And are you going to moan when we turn the TV after one?” to which she will always say no, and most of the time she doesn’t. If I forget the preempt, she moans a lot more often!

But he’s five. He’s learning and you’re teaching him.

It's not obvious at all to a five year old that you've gone to trouble.

I'd rein in the trouble you go to from now on. You're making a rod for your own back by going the extra mile. All future ice cream treats will be compared to the one you just served, and all will come up short. For a five year old, a few scoops of ice cream in a bowl all by themselves without any of the bells and whistles you included should be a fantastic experience.

I suspect you've fallen into the trap of trying too hard to impress your child, and he senses this on some level.

Kids can smell weakness. It bothers them. Make future treats dependent on polite behaviour or tidying up, or whatever other behaviour you want to encourage. Don't let your child think he gets a treat for nothing.

Point out to him that he is mummy's big boy when he starts comparing what he has with what his little sister gets. Try to carve out time for just the two of you on your own.