How difficult is it for high achieving academic parents to relax and not push their children?

[spokette]

I ask because DH has already mapped out the degree courses (Maths)and universities (Oxbridge) that DTS will be attending and they are only 3years and 11 months.

DH and I both have PhDs in science subjects and DH recently achieved an MBA with distinction.

DTS start school in September and I want them to thrive in terms of their social development as well as academically. I know that DH wants this too but he wants them to be top of the class. He already has plans in place to tutor them in maths himself. He means well but I think he needs to accept that DTS have to develop at their own pace and they may not be scientifically inclined - they maybe arty!

Well said, Spokette. You'll be able to deal with this.

I have found having two children has been immensely educational, because you really do have to learn to deal with individuals. And of course you have to curb parental boasting, because there will always be one who can't quite do what the other can.

spokette - completely agree that you want to avoid your twins competing against one another. Fine to compete against the outside world, but fraternal relationships ought first and foremost to be supportive IMO.

mb -sorry, I know I shouldn't but rofl at the college banning all fathers! can see that it wouldn't really affect many parents...

I'ld be f*cking delighted to think of DS managing any degree. I rather like wool and knitting so if DS was into textile design, hey, bring it on.

It can be tricky - we're both academic parents and I find it hard to imagine dc not going to university, but then we don't know how academic no 2 is going to be yet.

From my personal xp, getting a degree has opened up doors for me, especially in the salary stakes, that wouldn't have been available, so this colours my view of what I want for dc - and before I'm slammed with a backlash, I'd be the first to declare that having a degree isn't everything and people can be really successful without one having been raised by 2 non-degree qualified parents!

We're not at the point of mapping out degree courses but will be more than frank with children about work/life balance and try to help them make the right decisions for themselves (hopefully).

But if no 2 isn't academic/doesn't want uni, then we know of some other fantastically rewarding directions to push him in (tee hee)...

Would he be open to suggestions of letting them try out as many things as possible before specializing (I know G and T current wisdom is going in this direction, even in sporting fields ie don't push any child in only one direction too soon, let them try loads of stuff)?

Also there's loads of time for him to change his mind abut the degree courses etc, it sounds like he wants (I could be wrong) what you want - the best for your beautiful children.

I have always known that I value education because my father values education. He took no active part in my choices though. My parents allowed us freedom and encouraged us to take ownership of our own learning.

My dp is very scientific and I'm 'artsy' but I'm secretly hoping dd (2) is sporty. Naively I think that if she is sporty she won't smoke and drink her way through her teens (like her academic parents did).

Knitting studies never did Kaffe Fassett and Brandon Mably any harm, they look pretty happy to me Fio ditto Marie Wallin, Sarah Dallas and numerous others
Dh and I are academically well-qualified but what matters to me is that the dcs understand that school and learning should be fun (and knowledge is power bwahahaha). Dh and I both like and value the sector we work in (HE) and communicate that job satisfaction to the dcs. Our degrees and interests haven't brought us particular material wealth but have enriched our lives culturally and emotionally. I don't mind what the dcs study or do for a living (I always quail when I read posts asserting that children will only "be allowed" to study a vocational degree, I did drama in the teeth of parental dismay and it has been a constant asset to me throughout my career), so long as they are happy and fulfilled.
I think pushing children hard blights their childhood.

This morning DT1 said that he did not like coming second after DT2 was declared The Winner after being dressed first (DH helped him to get dressed).

A 3yo should not be suffering anxiety about coming second. DH has been told and warned that this foolishness stops now. Not surprisingly, he was rather chastened.

well done spokette!

you can read Knitting Studies?

Why was I not told?

Glad he's finally seeing sense.

I've really enjoyed this thread, it's made me think a lot about what we want for DD. I think that it will be easier for us to understand her and support her if she is academic, but I know that our order of priorities is for her to be happy, healthy and loved, and her career will come safely after that lot.

Leicester University I believe Filly

Racing like that is a motivating factor for a 3yo. But my DD always races against me and usually wins..... might be something to do with me going and sorting a wash load out half way through getting dressed. I agree that twins (or any siblings but there is alway that extra element with twins) racing is a recipe for disaster. Last night I said "who wants to get out of the bath first". Cue both children jumping up and scrambling to get out of the bath, water everywhere etc.

I don't mind racing games if it is done for fun but this was becoming too competitive. DT1 was nearly in tears because he had not got dressed first and what made it worse, DH was cheering DT2 for being The Winner. Can you imagine how that made DT1 felt?

Hence why I read DH the riot act and he knows that he has overstepped the mark big time. He knows not to mess with me when I get angry.

OH no spokette I was agreeing with you. I don't think what happened with your twins was/is right at all. And I was at my own inadvertent initiation of a race to get out of the bath. Sorry if I didn't come across like that - I think that at the beginning was maybe out of place. I sort of use it when I am thinking about something rather than raising an eyebrow IYSWIM.

Only read OP, so apologies if this has been said but I think being too prescriptive about what you want your children to acheive can actually backfire and possibly lead to major rebellion when children actually reach the age where they are making decisions about their own futures.

DH's father was very ambitious on his behalf - wanted him to be a successful business man, to study economics and managment at University etc, etc.

DH rebelled - he deliberately failed his business course at Uni, whilst excelling at his arts subjects, then dropped business altogher to do a humanities degree, with his father raging about it in the background.

Later in life, dh did actually end up working in business, although he retains a love of his subject from Uni. If his father had not been so prescriptive, they both might have been saved a lot of tension in their relationship at a time when dh really still needed some parental support, understanding and encouragement.

bb99 - we tend to assume dd will go to university and I think that is harmless enough as long as we realise that she might not want take that route. I'm old enough to have seen many of my friends' kids grow up and although actually most of them did go to university it has been interesting to see that some of the most academic parents have had non-university-going kids and friends that left school at 16 have some of the most academically inclined kids. That has been educational to watch.

Acinonyx - I actually think that the assumption that one's child will go to university is a good one for the child - much harder IMO for a child whose parents do not make that assumption to pursue higher education than for the one whose parents do assume they will be doing so.

Families are full of self-fulfilling prophecies - some good, some not so good.

Basically what Rubyrijoa said! Dh and I both bright and well educated

DS is 7 today and how I feel about him is totally different to how I feel about DD. I know at this point that DS is academically minded - he is significantly above average at numeracy, writing and reading, but finds art and physical activities much more of a challenge. But DD is 3 and I am still clueless as to where her strengths lie, although I am seeing her personality develop.

I am with Lazycow all the way-I though it was a good post. I feel so sorry for hothoused, pressurised children and unfortunately come across a lot! Instead of being pleased that they get 90% in a test the parent wants to know how they lost 10%!!
You have to work with what you have got, and love them for those qualities.They are all so different, you can't possibly map it out at such an early age. My eldest went to a good university to do a Science degree, the middle one is dyslexic and has struggled but is doing brilliantly in an apprenticeship, the youngest is still at school and is very arty. The middle one is motivated by money (hence the apprenticeship as will end up as a high earner), the other 2 are not motivated by money.The eldest 2 are sports mad, the youngest is hopeless at most sports. They are all lovely, well rounded boys, I would agree with martianbishop that I would go for nice over clever anyday. I have done well academically myself so I am not looking to live through my DCs. I was just as thrilled that my dyslexic DS managed to get a C in English GCSE (a huge achievement for him) as I was my eldest getting an A.
I agree with yurt1 and don't equate academics with intelligence, certainly not with common sense!
To map out the life of babies is truly depressing IMO.

Totally agree AbbeyA.
Children are individuals - it's wrong to try to map out their lives for them, and IME, those parents who do, tend to be the ones who are frustrated/disatisfied with some aspect of their own life, and are trying to compensate by living their life through their child. eg I always found it slightly ironic when ds was at private school, that the pushiest mothers tended to be the SAHMs . Providing a loving and supportive home is the most important thing, and I'd say second to that is the role model set by mum and dad. eg if mum and dad are seen to be reading quality literature/listening to a range of music/taking a interest in current affairs, then the children are more likely to soak this up. Children see straight through hypocrisy, and don't like being told something is good for them if they don't see their parents doing it.
What's been really positive about this thread is that most people seem to agree that academic success does not necessarily equate with happiness or general well being anyway. I think the ability to form and sustain good relationships is probably a more key factor in whether someone feels contented with their life. My brother is very academic, and got a very good degree from a very good univerisity, but has a broken marriage behind him, two children who he has very poor relationships with and sadly doesnt ever seem to have achieved contentment as an adult.

I don't think it's the qualifications that matter, it's how much of a type A personality the parents have. Our list of post-grad qualifications is impressive, but we're bone idle