How much money do you need to earn for 3 kids? Really?

[Onemorequestionplz]

How much money to you need to earn to have 3 maybe even 4 kids ?

for simplicity, not london based, average mortgage and average expenses, no debts. Older dcs would be 30 funded hrs/ school age, both parents working.

how much do you think you need to earn?

No one can really answer this question, too many variables.
For example is income split evenly between 2 salaries or is mainly or all one parents income ? This impacts how much tax you pay and if you are eligible for child benefit.
So I think you need to look at net monthly income.
Also depends on mortgage, lifestyle and perhaps family help with childcare.
We have 4 DC, DH earns a good income and I earn a more modest income, due to DHs income his tax bill is high and we don't get child benefit.
Anyway despite having family of income in excess of 100k we still need to watch spending. We have one modest holiday a year but that is often part paid on credit card,same for Xmas.
We are currently supporting oldest through uni as she only gets minimum maintenance loan which doesnt even cover rent due to DHs income. Sometimes I think if you earn slightly less,and get child benefit, pay less tax etc you could be a bit better off each month.
You need to look at your income, housing costs and work out budget. If you have a big enough house and car already then the cost of an extra child isn't huge, particularly if one parent stars at home or you have family support for childcare. It is more expensive at Xmas, birthdays, days out etc but they aren't every day expenses. Clothes can be as cheap or expensive as you like . Holidays can be simple UK caravan holidays, car can be 10 years old. You cut your cloth but clearly if exotic holidays and private education are important then the income would need to be huge.

We earn £115k between us, and alongside help from parents with childcare, and a bit of inheritance we can just about afford to have 2 children and give them the life we want them to have. That being said, that includes a big house and garden, private schooling, travel, activities, driving lessons, university costs, house deposits and some financial help if they have children of their own. So of course there is plenty there that could be trimmed back to stretch the budget to fund more children, but we would need to compromise on the lifestyle and opportunities we could give them. I'd rather stop at 2 and be able to do it the way I want than keep having more children and have to compromise.

oh hey neighbour! Where abouts? Birmingham? I do find Birmingham (including Solihull for ease) increasingly expensive, im nosey and often look up nice places I’ve driven through on Zoopla. A few years ago I saw 3 bed detached new builds (small ones too) in knowle on for 625 🙈🙈

£100k household income is obviously not struggling level but you're not rolling in it either if you have a mortgage, childcare, pension contributions, and want some savings

£6k take home a month approximately
£1k for wraparound for three kids or more if you have a baby in nursery
£2k mortgage
£500 pension contributions (not even that much)
£500 utilities

That's £4k gone

Car costs/public transport costs
Activities for the kids
Clothes
Food
Holidays
Savings
Birthdays/Christmas

It won't necessarily feel like a lot of money day to day.

I emphasise, it's not struggling level by any means and lots of it is discretionary but equally you're not rolling in it

Exactly it’s that in between like you said, although our mortgage isn’t even half that and with increases and including htb when we remortgage if rates stay as they are (unlikely) it would be a smidge over half. Energy on new tarif from April will be £220 based on Martin Lewis calculation, currently on a (£170 fix) prior to that was £100 (house is very well insulated). We’re at our max contribution from our pension 3% but they put in 11/12% as standard and then match the 3 so we’re getting a lot for v little.

childcare is the killer like you say

We have 3 (8,3,1)

Dh is main earner, earns 60k. I earn 12k. Nursery bill is £700 a month th for 1.5 days for 1 year old and 2 days for 3 year old ( 30 hours funded but top up fee is £27 a day ) so my income is basically the nursery bill with £100 left over.

We are in a very unique position where outgoings re house are £600 a month so it's doable - wouldn't be if we lived elsewhere!

We do.

I am to this day a little resentful for my parents because they took your approach. I felt patronised and controlled (and it didn't work anyway, I just worked harder to get what I wanted).

Hopefully your kids won't feel that way, I hope they don't.

we’re quite some time off that now so we’ll have to see when the time comes but likely it will be one lump sum that we’ll have for them that can only be spent once, so my steer would be to stay at home and get the best of both worlds, house and uni

There are also many benefits to not staying at home that your child might want to experience. Not every benefit is financial. There is also life experience.

When the time comes, they may not want to do what you want them to do.

Sure, give an opinion, but they should be allowed to make their own decision and not forefeit the money.

Ok you have your opinion and I mine, I wish I’d have a had the option to not have incurred a full loan and wish I’d have had access to a degree apprenticeship, like I said in France it’s so so common, so I come from that background

Depends. We live in a moderately priced yet beautiful area. We set up a business a few years back which took a fair investment, but now pays us both. Between us we only earn about £35k.

However we live a very comfortable life with 3 kids in part because of an inheritance that extended our house which was already lovely and in a great location, but now looks/feels 'above our means'.

So questions like this don't work really. Because we have never really used paid childcare bar a few top up hours for our youngest due to being a SAHP and then home educating for a while. We don't have any real debt, have suitable vehicles, are able to have holidays when we like etc. But in terms of cash we earn very little. 🤷

It does mean that right now we don't have the option of private school, but we are happy with our local state provision.so that's fine. If we needed to we could rejig things and probably make it work accordingly.

I think you're think way ahead of where you need to. I guess your kids are still really young so between now and then all sorts could happen, especially with a change of government. I live on half your income and support two older kids (with all the costs that entails), live in the SE etc and am very comfortable.

If you've grown up with private education and 3 holidays abroad each year plus new cars etc you may feel very poor in comparison. But in real terms you are not poor.

I totally understand why people post their huge salaries and everything it affords them as an illustration to your OP. But they are not 'scraping by' or just about managing. And neither will you be if you choose to have another child.

It’s absolutely fine to make sure they know they have the option of a degree apprenticeship or of staying close to home for university. I don’t think you should make that choice for them though. I went away to university and am 100% glad I did. I knew I could have stayed at home and gone to an (excellent) local uni, but I didn’t want to. And thankfully my parents supported me in that choice.

You're calling it an option but you're not presenting it to them as an option. You seem to be saying you're going to basically tell them that's what they have to do.

It's fine to make sure they know about degree apprenticeships and yes, they're a great option for a lot of people.

Personally, I would have hated to do a degree apprenticeship. I wanted to study and that was the right decision for me, and it is the right decision for a lot of people, even if they are not 100% solid on what job they want at that point. University isn't only for people who want to be lawyers, doctors and engineers. Following and studying your interests can open all sorts of doors. Just because it didn't for you, does not mean it won't for your children.

The best way is to tell your kids about available options, talk it through with them, of course give an opinion, but then you let them choose and support them in what is ultimately their decision.

You don't choose for them (and really, good luck if you think you're going to be able to!)

We’ll support them whatever but my guidance will be my guidance not a mandate based on both of my degrees and experience and my husbands, but one/ two/ three or four kids I doubt we’ll ever feel so inclined as to fully find them staying away from home. They’ll have to get a job to support themselves too and If it’s the experience of living away from home they desperately want then the money comes from their pot of cash

i think you’ve got it confused, university did pay off for me, I enjoyed hence a subsequent degree, i even taught at one but I went to uni at a different time, it was cheaper, there were grants and from having Been on the other side I don’t really know if I had my time again, knowing what I know now, if I’d go again and pay over £9k per year plus maintenance loan, or at least not so aimlessly. I have a ‘good’ job and earn above average (mid 40s) and I’ve ‘only’ been working 6 years and I’ve had 3 out (mat leaves) so that’s obviously due to the opportunity Uni afforded me.

you might be misinterpreting what I mean by my steer, ie my encouragement or advice but it’s not a commandment they are free to make their own call, but they can only spend it once.

I don't think you can ascertain they can only spend it once though. The government are clearly very keen on parental contributions to university education. There are issues with this being non-obvious at the moment and students are suffering when parents don't contribute what they're supposed to. This isn't good for government / university metrics and so I wouldn't be surprised if uni fees were taken from parents at-source ie via tax returns in 10-15 years time. So you may have no choice but to contribute on top of any savings in place.

Well that becomes a different question then and then insisting on going away to uni might not be an option, but this is just my opinion on how dh and I are choosing to raise our kids

Because anyone who claims they couldn't raise three kids on a six figure income quite frankly needs to get their head out of their backside

You'd get a 1 bed flat here for £300k

Because anyone who claims they couldn't raise three kids on a six figure income quite frankly needs to get their head out of their backside

I suggest you work on your comprehension skills, no where did I say I COULDN'T, I said I wouldn't want to, I very clearly stated I could not give 3 children the life we WANT them to have with our current circumstances, and just to further clarify for you, if you re-read what I said I did not state that others couldn't do it, I said it was a personal decision that depends on the lifestyle and expectations of the family. Could I raise 3 kids to keep them clothed, educated, loved, fed and warm? Sure I could, could I raise them so they could do the after school activities mine do, so we could travel multiple times a year to the places I want us all to go to, so I can buy their first car, support them in uni and perhaps even a helping hand on the housing ladder? No I couldn't, and that's what I want to do for my children, and that is why I am only having 2 and why even having a 6 figure income is not enough for 3 children, FOR ME.

London?

MN is a parallel universe at times! We have 3. Income less than £70k between us. But I suppose crucially no mortgage due to early death of parents (no childcare either).

Older two and then an unplanned third some time later so only two in childcare at one time.

I doubt we will be able to give them house deposits, cars, fully funded university etc but I think they'll survive. I had a lot handed to me and it I think it made me lazy.

I think time, or lack of, is the biggest thing with 3 rather than money. Of course you need a certain amount but some of these responses are madness!

It definitely is

It definitely is

Well it will be if you can't be arsed to read properly.