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Original poster

9 year old son and sleep

43 replies

Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 09:47

Hi, I didn't want to post this in the sleep section as it does not relate to a young baby/toddler. It's about my son, who is 9.
He's always been a good sleeper. Well, since around the age of 2. Was awful when he was a baby but that's neither here nor there.
I would say in the last month/6 weeks he has developed 'sleep anxiety', whereby he fears he will not be able to sleep.
I have a shared care arrangement with his father, and he sleeps fine at his dad's. None of this happens.
He is the only boy out of three children so he has his own room.
I am starting to dread bedtimes. It is not even 10am and I am thinking about and stressing about it already.
My relationship with him is not great. He can be rude and insulting and we argue. I shouldn't argue with a 9 year old but I do SadHe makes me so angry. He has got his father on side, I am the big, bad, incapable ogre.
He has a nice, comfy room. I haven't got around to decorating it yet but it's a good size single room, which is warm and clean.
He has a cabin bed.
He has fairy lights which I will switch on as he says he is scared.
He has no TV an hour before bed and I read to him for half an hour. He has a bath every night before bed as well.
I put his little sister to bed and he will bath and read a book in in his room while he waits for me. Then I will go to him and read to him in the room which is dim and I use the fairy lights so o can see the book, but when the reading is done he will say to me 'but what if I can't sleep?' And I immediately feel tense. He has a lavender spray which he will use and a hot water bottle so he is cosy. I don't let him watch TV in his room.
He will sometimes lie in bed and toss and turn or he will sometimes scream and cry with frustration. And he will think he needs the toilet and will be up and down for the toilet several times.
Sometimes I have given him piriton to try to help him drift off, which my ex found out about and he has threatened me to not use it again.
I'm thinking about temporarily putting him in with his elder sister, and the little sister going in his room, as he seems to settle better with someone in there with me.
Not sure what to do. It is affecting my relationship with him even more than it was.
Last night was an early one and he was asleep by 9!! But quite often he is awake at 10pm. He is getting more and more panicked and will cry and it breaks my heart.
Any suggestions? Thanks for reading xxx

OP posts:
BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 17/01/2023 09:49

Can't he just read to himself as a past time til his eyes feel sleepy?

fUNNYfACE36 · 17/01/2023 09:54

You need to stop him worrying by telling him that good quality rest is just as good as sleep

user1471446478 · 17/01/2023 09:59

Agree with @fUNNYfACE36 , it is the panic/anxiety over going to sleep which is causing the negative atmosphere around bedtimes. How about learning some mindfulness/meditation exercises to calm him and/or an Audio book he can listen to if he needs?

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9 year olds Babies & sleep Children's sleep Families
FlounderingFruitcake · 17/01/2023 10:00

Let him go to bed at 10, read until he’s tired and tell him that rest is as good as sleep. Take the pressure off. Also any chance that the arguing with you and your anger is also contributing to the bedtime tension? It won’t be easy to sleep in a stressful environment.

Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:03

BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 17/01/2023 09:49

Can't he just read to himself as a past time til his eyes feel sleepy?

I actually suggested this to him last night, said why didn't he read until he felt tired. He enjoys reading. And he wanted to do this. But I couldn't find an adequate lamp for him to be able to see the pages. That will be my mission for today..: xx

OP posts:
pjani · 17/01/2023 10:05

Poor little guy. He sounds scared and also probably quite sad and upset about the tension in your relationship.

Have you read ‘The book you wish your parents read’ by Phillips Perry? I think there’s a lot going on under the surface that is coming out in this sleep issue. What was going on for you when you were 9? What would your parents have done if you did what he is doing?

It sounds like he needs love and patience. I would really recommend reading the book and journaling to make sense of why he brings up these strong feelings in you.

Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:05

Night time is often when anxieties and worries strike.
I say without judgement that help with your relationship with your son might be really helpful at this point too. You don't want to go into teen years with a combative relationship.
What would the kids all think of the room arrangements you're suggesting? With DS in with his sister for a while?
His sleep hygiene is good but there's something worrying him I think? Have you been seperated from his Dad for long? Is he happy at school?

pjani · 17/01/2023 10:06

(Also - what about reading yourself in bed with him while he goes to sleep at 10pm or whatever? Give him some reassurance?)

Mischance · 17/01/2023 10:06

I used to leave the light on in my DD's room and she would read until she fell asleep and I would pop in and switch the light off.

He could of course have problems around the marital separation. If one parent goes, might not the other? - in his mind. It is also very common for anxieties around death to happen at about this age - this is when they start to realise the finality for death.

Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:06

fUNNYfACE36 · 17/01/2023 09:54

You need to stop him worrying by telling him that good quality rest is just as good as sleep

This is a great and positive way of thinking. I shall say this to him tonight. You're quite right. If he is in the mindset that no matter how much sleep he gets he will be ok he will worry less. He's an anxious kid and I see myself in him a lot. I used to suffer with the same, when the first of my grandparents died when I was 23. I started to suffer terrible sleep anxiety and would take myself off in my car in the middle of the night and scared the shit outta my ex as he would wake and I would be missing.
He will be aware he is awake longer and I will hear him asking his Alexa the time again and again. I know what it's like to feel that panic :( xx

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:08

pjani · 17/01/2023 10:05

Poor little guy. He sounds scared and also probably quite sad and upset about the tension in your relationship.

Have you read ‘The book you wish your parents read’ by Phillips Perry? I think there’s a lot going on under the surface that is coming out in this sleep issue. What was going on for you when you were 9? What would your parents have done if you did what he is doing?

It sounds like he needs love and patience. I would really recommend reading the book and journaling to make sense of why he brings up these strong feelings in you.

He's a lovely lovely boy. Kind, sweet, thoughtful and sensitive. Animals love him, which is a weird thing to comment on but it's remarkable! My pets all love him and want to be around him.
I have not heard of that book?? Xx

OP posts:
Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:09

My DD was a generally poor sleeper (and an anxious, over thinking child) and I would tell her that calm rest is almost as good as sleep when she couldn't drop off.
She is dealing with her anxiety better these days but has also found a weighted blanket very helpful.

Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:10

pjani · 17/01/2023 10:05

Poor little guy. He sounds scared and also probably quite sad and upset about the tension in your relationship.

Have you read ‘The book you wish your parents read’ by Phillips Perry? I think there’s a lot going on under the surface that is coming out in this sleep issue. What was going on for you when you were 9? What would your parents have done if you did what he is doing?

It sounds like he needs love and patience. I would really recommend reading the book and journaling to make sense of why he brings up these strong feelings in you.

I was an anxious kid just like he is. My parents separated when I was 7 and I was sent off to live with my dad and his horrible partner and separated from my two younger sisters and my mother, and my brother, who is 17 months younger than me, was with me. Was miserable. He is not a happy child, when he is with me anyway. His father wants me to let him go live with him but I just can't. I adore my son. X

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:14

Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:05

Night time is often when anxieties and worries strike.
I say without judgement that help with your relationship with your son might be really helpful at this point too. You don't want to go into teen years with a combative relationship.
What would the kids all think of the room arrangements you're suggesting? With DS in with his sister for a while?
His sleep hygiene is good but there's something worrying him I think? Have you been seperated from his Dad for long? Is he happy at school?

His relationship with me is shocking. I feel he hates me. The relationship needs work. He blames me for an awful lot. We have done a lot of one on one work together with the help of outside agencies and he has had counselling. I thought he had an additional need such as ADHD but I had a meeting at the school, and my early help worker, and SENCO, and they said highly likely PTSD due to marriage breakdown and trauma as he saw so much and he is so sensitive anyway. So not ADHD. X I think his big sister will be happy with a temporary arrangement. She is 12 and always trying to help. My son will say he will refuse to share a room with his smaller sister - she is 7 and annoys the hell outta him. There are underlying issues but sometimes I feel I am just no good at trying to help him and I am a rubbish mum. My son will tell me I'm an idiot and he hates me xx

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:15

pjani · 17/01/2023 10:06

(Also - what about reading yourself in bed with him while he goes to sleep at 10pm or whatever? Give him some reassurance?)

Yep I do this too sometimes and it helps him, knowing I am next door to him! My room is next to his and my girls are at the back of the house x

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:17

Mischance · 17/01/2023 10:06

I used to leave the light on in my DD's room and she would read until she fell asleep and I would pop in and switch the light off.

He could of course have problems around the marital separation. If one parent goes, might not the other? - in his mind. It is also very common for anxieties around death to happen at about this age - this is when they start to realise the finality for death.

My ex has a dimmable light and my son will have this on when he sleeps at his dad's. I am going to get one when I get paid. His Dad's house is controlled by Alexas - lights/TVs - everything. My house isn't. The kids have Alexas in their rooms and they will listen to music etc on them x

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:17

Mischance · 17/01/2023 10:06

I used to leave the light on in my DD's room and she would read until she fell asleep and I would pop in and switch the light off.

He could of course have problems around the marital separation. If one parent goes, might not the other? - in his mind. It is also very common for anxieties around death to happen at about this age - this is when they start to realise the finality for death.

And he did lose his grandfather during lockdown and then his great nan, and even our cat got run over. I guess these things could all have an impact? X

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:18

Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:09

My DD was a generally poor sleeper (and an anxious, over thinking child) and I would tell her that calm rest is almost as good as sleep when she couldn't drop off.
She is dealing with her anxiety better these days but has also found a weighted blanket very helpful.

You found a weighted blanket useful for your little girl? I have been considering those xx

OP posts:
Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:20

Sounds like you have all been through a lot.
Trying to make things better is generally a good parenting indicator. Don't be too hard on yourself.

Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:21

Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:05

Night time is often when anxieties and worries strike.
I say without judgement that help with your relationship with your son might be really helpful at this point too. You don't want to go into teen years with a combative relationship.
What would the kids all think of the room arrangements you're suggesting? With DS in with his sister for a while?
His sleep hygiene is good but there's something worrying him I think? Have you been seperated from his Dad for long? Is he happy at school?

I have been separated from his father for almost 5 years. It was an extremely traumatic, upsetting breakup which moved extremely fast. Court hearings, battling over the kids, social workers. All instigated by my ex, I tried to shield the kids from it but he enjoyed trying to break me, trouble is my kids are the victims.
I am still recovering so God knows how my kids are finding it. My littlest doesn't remember her dad and I together but my two eldest do. My eldest seems to be more resilient but my son is as soft as shit. He is doing well at school and where he should be. He is year 5 and he tells me doing a week of tests, which isn't helping with his anxiety xx

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:22

Beamur · 17/01/2023 10:20

Sounds like you have all been through a lot.
Trying to make things better is generally a good parenting indicator. Don't be too hard on yourself.

Flowers thank you. I always think to myself - I am not the best mum ever. But I TRY my best xx

OP posts:
Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:23

user1471446478 · 17/01/2023 09:59

Agree with @fUNNYfACE36 , it is the panic/anxiety over going to sleep which is causing the negative atmosphere around bedtimes. How about learning some mindfulness/meditation exercises to calm him and/or an Audio book he can listen to if he needs?

Completely agree with this. He likes audio books too. And I hadn't thought of mindfulness etc?? I am off work today. Time for some Googling xxxxx

OP posts:
Notjusta · 17/01/2023 10:23

If he has an Alexa you can probably find free audio books he could listen to as he drifts off. My DS does this. Or you can connect the alexa to your phone and play audio books or podcasts through that. The BBC sounds app will have suitable content for children.

Original poster
Jomummy1013 · 17/01/2023 10:24

Notjusta · 17/01/2023 10:23

If he has an Alexa you can probably find free audio books he could listen to as he drifts off. My DS does this. Or you can connect the alexa to your phone and play audio books or podcasts through that. The BBC sounds app will have suitable content for children.

This is a great idea. I did not know I could link my phone to my Alexa? He likes the Audio books but he finds them so short, I didn't know about sourcing them elsewhere?? X

OP posts:
Peach2021 · 17/01/2023 10:25

My 8 year old is the same, and I'm trying all the things you've listed. Our family situation is also similar...

I bought him a torch so he can read under the covers if he wants, and he often comes in with me (not great for my sleep but better for his) so could you try that? The next thing for me is to try and wear him out physically, as his busy brain keeps chattering on until late at night, which keeps both of us up.

I also wonder about your pets, if your son is close to them, could one of them sleep in his room so he has to "look after" them overnight, or would that provoke more worrying?

I've also added a blanket to his bed, not weighted but it's heavy wool and he clearly likes the feeling of it, much more snug than just a duvet (which is underneath the blanket), so that would definitely be worth a try.

It is such a worry isn't it, and then when they take it out on you it hurts and just adds to everything you have to deal with.