What is the safest option for my baby, myself and rest of the family?

[Richtea67]

Hi, I am interested in people's opinions on balancing up the risks here. I know this will be a decision I make for myself but just interested in what people think....So I have a 6 week old DD who will not be put down...EVER. I am not looking for advice on what to try, as we have tried it all and persevered with all the standard advice (white noise, swaddle, hot water bottle, consistent routine etc). She is mixed fed (mostly breast) and we have tried co sleeping, but she wakes up. I used to be able to feed to sleep and settle her next to me, but she screams now until picked up. Essentially if she is anywhere except on someone's chest she wakes up. I have a sling which is a god send. My husband has been helping with night time and we have been doing shifts with her sleeping on our chests, but trying to settle her in crib or next to me throughout the night. I tend to sleep 9am-1am, and sometimes can catch up on the weekend.

After 6 weeks of 4ish hours sleep a night I am feeling the effects, as is my dh. I am struggling with looking after myself and my other child. I feel unsafe driving, and the other day totally zoned out at a junction...literally didn't know where I was for a moment. I have to drive to do the school run (too far to walk), although can get some help with this ad hoc. Reflux and CMPA have both been investigated and we are on gaviscon and special formula, but no improvement yet. As we have exhausted all the standard advice I am now considering trying things I know are not recommended e.g. baby nests, sleeping her on side with a wedge. I think my reasoning is that we are at less of a risk doing this and getting some more sleep, than we are carrying on with what we are doing and having an accident.

WWYD? I know about the 4th trimester, and that it will get better... but what would people do now??

You must be exhausted. Is she not accepting safe bed sharing?

That sounds so difficult, you must be so tired.

Do you have any family support? Eg could one of your parents take her for naps in the sling / do an evening shift so you and your husband can catch up on some extra sleep?

If extra adults aren’t an option I can see why you’re tempted to stray from the safe sleep advice. It’s so difficult when they Just. Won’t. Sleep.

This sounds really tough. We used a purflo nest in the next to me crib from around 6 weeks and really rate it. DS has slept through the night since being 6 weeks old, starting with 8 hour stints and then soon went on to 12 hours. It took a while for him to go to sleep for naps in his cot (around 7 months I think) rather than on our chests or short proms naps but I was just so grateful to get a great sleep every night! I know lots of people who have used the nests with success.

Someone I know had a lot of success with the Snoo crib, which rocks and swaddles. It's very pricey though and another acquaintance who bought one found it didn't help with sleep.

Have you tried raising the head end of her cot, we used bricks. This really helped my reflux baby. I think you can also get wedge shaped mattresses but would try a diy option first to see if it helps.

Same, they are expensive but they really helped us. They are really breathable too

Well we still never get 12 hour stints at almost 11 months old, but he sleeps well in his cot usually

How is she with the pram? DD2 was like this as a newborn, but did randomly like her carrycot. We basically walked her to sleep for almost every sleep (and got a rocker thing to keep jiggling the pram once home). Once she was deeply asleep, we'd move the carrycot to the bedroom or lounge with us.

At that age my eldest was being transferred to carry cot asleep, swaddled and placed on her side. She was reflux-y (not treated ... another story), and I didn't feel comfortable putting her on her back, despite being aware of the recommendations, as there was no predicting when she'd bring stuff up. Once she was able to roll she slept on her front exclusively for several years. Even now (age 20) I suspect she doesn't sleep on her back much.

A baby who won't sleep other than on someone's chest is telling you they don't want to sleep on their back, in my opinion. So a combination of wedging the cot and considering ways to achieve safer sleeping on their side, is probably your only option until they are older. Good luck and I hope you can start getting more sleep yourself soon.

I hope you find a solution, everything in life is a balance of risks, you do what's right for you in your family. With regards to the cmpa investigation have you also cut dairy and soya out of your diet? Sometimes GP's aren't aware that this needs to be done too.

@upfucked no unfortunately...she was previously settling with me in bed which meant I could at least lie down and doze a bit. Now she won't feed to sleep (just screams when finished feeding until you pick her up), and if I settle her down in bed with me she wakes up immediately and the whole palava starts again!

@jolies thank you, yes I think the purflo may be worth a go. I know the lullaby trust guidelines advise against but feeling desperate at this stage. Wow 8 hours, I'd take 1 or 2 at the moment!

@FrizzledFrazzle thank you, the snoo looks good, however DD will not tolerate being swaddled...she gets really cross having her arms pinned down and manages to thrust an arm out. I have ordered a 'swaddle up' to try, where you can swaddle then in the arms up position and they are still able to self soothe. Worth a shot!

@DeeofDenmark thank you, yes we have tried this...we have the next to me crib which you can set on an incline.

@SamanthaVimes we could ask my MIL to do a late evening shift. We try to keep her at arms length as she's not an easy person, but needs must. I think this could only be an infrequent thing though.

I'm so glad that nobody has told me 'this is completely normal and 4th trimester...as this doesn't feel normal to me and all my mummy friends have not had this extreme experience for this length of time (except for one).

Has she been checked for reflux/silent reflux? I wonder if this could be a factor. I had a super clingy newborn and similar struggles to you regarding being put down. I found things massively improved for us when I began feeding in the side lying position in bed as it took away the need to transfer him anywhere when he was done. This has been a lifesaver over the past year, but definitely was key to surviving the newborn days for us. Worth a try if you haven't already x

Hi I just want to say I feel your pain. My baby is 14 weeks old and the same, will only sleep on our chests so myself and my husband takes shifts all night. We have an older child who was a great sleeper. Slight difference in that ours used to occasionally sleep in her next to me when she was a bit younger, we had a few nights of 3/4 hour stints, even 6 hours once, but it got steadily worse, going down to 1/2 hours at a time, then less, and now she will only be held. I’m starting to try safe co-sleeping with her next to me but she wakes up within 30 mins after feeding lying down and won’t settle until I pick her up and then I now have to feed her back to sleep.

We’ve seen a cranial oestopath, crib is slightly raised, tried a love to dream swaddle up bag, tried with and without a sleepyhead, white noise all night, I’ve cut out dairy and soya for 3+ weeks, we don’t think it’s reflux as she’s happy on her back during the day and when we’ve tried gaviscon it’s made zero difference. Whenever we have managed to put her down she wakes and cries every time she stirs or enters a new sleep cycle. Naps are either in a sling/held and occasionally the car but she usually cries. She gets a decent amount of daytime sleep so shouldn’t be overtired. I think she just wants to be close to us unfortunately.

As she gets bigger she is getting more uncomfortable on my chest (for me and her!) and I’m acutely aware of the risks. It’s so hard, and we have to be mindful of waking up our eldest.

I really hope you find a solution (and please tell me if you do!!)

You poor thing this sounds like hell. I would be investing in a night nanny for a week or two to sort the issue, sounds like you've tried everything and you can't carry on as you are!
Good luck xx

How’s the latch? Have you given up dairy yourself too. If they think reflux you need to find the cause - I’d try and find an IBCLC to check tongue function and maybe cranial oesteopathy is worth a try too?
my daughter only really slept on my chest or with a boob in her mouth, it was lockdown so no real in person help but I had her checked at 5 months and she has a very high palate, probably meaning she had tongue tie and shallow latch - so was taking on lots of air.

On the 'fourth trimester' note... it can be normal but this is the extreme end. My first baby was like yours... there were no medical issues or reflux, he was just a baby that needed physical closeness (and oh my goodness, we knew about it if it wasn't happening!). My HV recommended co-sleeping because sitting up awake with baby on my chest was so unsustainable. Co-sleeping worked for us (with naps in the sling) but only if I was touching him the whole time... I couldn't roll away or lose contact otherwise he'd wake up!

It did get better around 13/14 months and he eventually learnt to sleep on his own (with cuddles to go to sleep initially).

I had so much anxiety when pregnant woth my second in case they were the same, but he was very different! He's slept happily on his own from day one and we only co-sleep out of laziness/habit than true necessity. I suppose your first must have been the equivalent of my second, which is why it seems like such a shock...

Sending sympathy and solidarity your way. I've been there and I know it feels utterly relentless (of course it'll pass, but knowing that doesn't help when you're on your knees with tiredness and dreading each long night).

My little one was similar (although not as bad) and this is what helped-
We got a Purflo sleep tight baby bed which is certified as safe for overnight sleep and it made a massive difference. The HV still told me it wasn’t safe but neither was her sleeping on my chest every night so that’s the decision we made. She was right next to my bed and was never left alone in it until 6 months so I felt fine with it.
We also used swaddle up as she preferred her arms being up and it helped a lot with not startling awake, I really recommend them.
A hot water bottle or heated pad in the bed for a few mins before putting her in helped with the transfer.
My oldest had reflux and we also raised the head of the bed a little with books under the legs, which did seem to help. I hope things improve for you soon x

Your baby sounds very similar to mine.

We went through the exact same thing with DD2 who's now 8 weeks.

GP suggested it could be CMPA, so I've been off cows milk for 2 weeks and just started to see the difference in the last couple of days. She still only contact naps and we bedshare, but it's a huge step forward as she would only sleep on our chests before. She would scream the entire time she was awake, but the last few days she's been a lot happier. Her spit ups have reduced significantly so I've taken her off gaviscon.

I would stick with the formula or DF diet if you're breastfeeding for at least 4 weeks. It can take a while for it to make a difference.

You're doing amazing mama, hang in there.

If you don't see any improvements, I would explore other allergies such as, soy.

I remember this and around the 8-10 week mark it changed overnight. I was sleeping sitting up. And propped up to avoid slumping etc with baby on chest/feeding. What I did to change it was - used a worn top ofine as a sheet in moses basket, swaddled and did the slllooooww put down into moses basket, once asleep in arms. Stayed down against him in MB (yes !) for a few mins and then slloooowwly came back up lol. Also used a soother when needed. I like to think it was my technique but it was probably good timing too. This is fairly normal at 6 weeks, tho exhausting. Best of luck.

Btw has your baby been on antibiotics at any point?

My daughter was a bit like this but I was doing all the nights myself. It was impossible. I ended up sleeping in a rocking chair with her most of the time but I think that's considered very dangerous (I don't know why). I had a pillow fort all around me in case I dropped her on the floor, which never happened.

Turned out she had developed an egg allergy following antibiotic exposer as a newborn and was reacting to my milk.

The biggest flaw of safe sleep advice is that it's based on comparisons that don't always apply to the individuals. For example in my case it wasn't a choice between co-sleeping and sleeping on a separate surface it was a choice between setting up the bed as safely as possible or accidentally falling asleep with a baby who knows where.

This!!!

Can you sleep with her on your chest? Not ideal but as you say, balance of risks.

We're currently I'm hospital with our poor 2 week old. The nurses actually prop her up to sleep her on her side. If this is good enough for the nurses then I'd try it at home, probably before the nest etc.