12 year old refusing contact

[Emm220884]

Hi all,
Please help.
My lovely son doesn't want contact with his Dad.
We've been separated 12 years since my son was 4.5 months. He saw his dad "mostly" regularly until he was 4. He then told the school that he was locked in his room and wasn't allowed out to the toilet during the night, causing him to wet his bed.
After that, over night visits stopped and he only saw his dad during the day, this then dwindled and visits stopped completely within a year. His dad would occasionally phone and son would refuse to talk to him.
His Dad then moved to Thailand in around 2018, for 2 years. Contact was minimal, when he came back I would take the children to see him, but they would want me to stay with them.
He returned in 2020 and contact has again been minimal. This year he has been trying to visit more often, my son has told him that he doesn't want this, he finds it stressful and doesn't want to see him.
I encourage him to see his dad, generally sitting with them at Starbucks, making conversation with my son in the hope that his dad will join in.
My son has told me I am going against his wishes, and is cross that he is having to see the person that causes anxiety and upset.
Please someone tell me what is the right thing to do here?
We have no child care agreement, it's always been just left for us to decide. Can I let my 12 year old make this decision?

We do have another child (16) together. He's had no contact alone with his dad since he was 7, and at 14 he backed off and left him alone.

Thank you so much, I understand that this is a difficult topic

Nothing difficult here... your boys dont want to see this man who wanders in and out of their lives as he feels like it.....
They are both old enough to see him for what he is... no kind of father.

Agree with pp. Your son is old enough, and it seems wise enough, to make this decision. His dad hasn't shown up for him and he's not prepared to play along anymore. Very important you support him on this now imo.

What do you think is best for your son? If you think visits are stressful and unhappy, and make him anxious, why would you insist on them?

At 12, he is old enough, IMO. His father's been pretty useless so far....if he's making more of an effort, then I expect you have some sympathy with him. He could write or send presents if your son is not keen on seeing him. In time, they may get closer, of course.

What sort of maintenance has he paid? This is sometimes an indication of how important the relationship is to a parent.

Your children see that the man who is supposed to be their father never prioritises them or make them feel important, so why would they want to keep in contact? Let your son make the decision. It’s a shame for your ex, but he made his bed.

At the ages your sons are now this is not a difficult topic. It’s actually really easy. They don’t want to see him (twelve is old enough to decide for himself). Literally the only thing you need to do is support them

@mikado1

Agree with pp. Your son is old enough, and it seems wise enough, to make this decision. His dad hasn't shown up for him and he's not prepared to play along anymore. Very important you support him on this now imo.
*^
THIS
Your ds sounds ace.
He's not waiting for validation
Good on him.
Support and make sure he feels loved

Courts use the idea of gillick competence to determine if a child is mature enough to decide they don't want to see a parent. Your son is old enough to meet that threshold. I think it's probably good you've encouraged him up to now and shown that it's ok for him to have a relationship if he wants one, but now I'd maybe start to listen to what he's saying. Sit down with him and be direct and say you've always tried to encourage a relationship with his dad because you feel its important he knows who both his parents are but you feel he's old enough now to make his decisions on how much contact he would like to have. I'd be really clear that you will support any contract he still wishes to have even if initially he wants none and then changes his mind later or if he decides he wants to do things differently from older brother. I'd say you don't want an answer right now, you're going to give him time to think about it and he can let you know what he decides when he's ready. Then leave it to him. Every now and then I'd check in that he's still happy with the arrangement but I'd let him lead it. Locking a child in a room long enough that they wet themselves is abusive so I think it's understandable why your son might feel uncomfortable around your ex.

This with bells on it.

He s 1w
He decides
Dont force it
Dont facilitate aNy more
If you want to continue meeting your ex in starbucks because you want to then you can and you can invite ds along but his choice to come or not
He can stay home he is old enough

Does his dad cause 'anxiety and upset'? It sounds as though they sit in a cafe and ignore each other.
Your ex has been abusive and unreliable. It's not impossible that he's changed but you would need to judge that.
I wouldn't make my DC see him if it genuinely upset them. But, as a parent you need to take responsibility for the decision. 12-yr-olds aren't old enough to shoulder that responsibility. And it's likely they could change their mind again when older and blame you for isolating them. My friend had that situation with their DCs. Now one of their DC speaks to the estranged parent and is no contact with the resident parent.

I know that you’re only doing what you feel is best for your DS. You’re his mother and you love him. Having said that, it’s unfair of you to push him into contact with someone who hasn’t been a father to him, especially when his brother has been allowed to avoid seeing him. Rather than ‘facilitating’ contact I’d be trying to find someone with decent qualifications and experience counselling children and adolescents. Give your DS a private space to talk to someone about how he feels about his father away from you and his brother. If you stop pressuring him and he has someone neutral to talk to, he can decide for himself if he wants a relationship with his father and if so on what terms.

Why on earth are you trying to force this? They want nothing to do with him, and for good reason. Why should they have to make any effort when their father is so unwilling to?

Has he paid maintenance?

Doesn't matter if the father pays maintenance or not.

The 12 year old doesn't want to forced to spend time with his father and he is old enough for his wishes to be respected.

Sorry if I'm not quite understanding but was what your son said to the teacher true? If so, I can understand why he feels stress and anxiety. Did you discuss this with his dad?

I'd let your son decide what he wants his relationship with his dad to look like. Unless you've had any feedback from his dad to suggest otherwise, it sounds as if he himself isn't particularly bothered about the lack of relationship

Any court would allow a 12 year old to choose not to see a parent in this situation.

You should support his decision

Your son's dad has been at best useless and at worst abusive towards your poor son. Why does your son have to spend time with someone who never bothered to build a strong bond with him when he was younger? He's old enough to vote with his feet.

Thank you for all of your replies.
I've encouraged my children to see their dad as I never wanted them to feel that they were unable to see him. I had both of my children with the same man because I wanted them to be part of a family.
Being shut in his room was investigated and yes, it is the truth. The story surrounding it is blurry as his dad was supposedly not there at the time and he was being "watched" by his dads gf (who was a nanny).
We have tried to address this recently with his dad after speaking to our GP as he bedwets at 12 and he felt that he needed answers. His dad told him that he couldn't tell him what happened that night, but that he will be forever sorry for it.

I know in my heart, that it is not the right thing for my son to keep seeing his dad. My post was more, how do help him end this endless crap.
Our idea currently is to get his dad to WhatsApp him directly (currently it is me who he contacts) and let my son tell him no directly.

Should I get legal advice? Do I just go to a family solicitor for this?

Thank you all again

If he told the school rather than you of what definitely abuse (being locked in his room and denied the toilet, who does that??!) then maybe he's not telling you everything (most likely to avoid upsetting you). Kids have smart instincts usually, and I would give him the choice on this.

He'd been told not to tell me, he asked for the teacher to tell me

Our idea currently is to get his dad to WhatsApp him directly (currently it is me who he contacts) and let my son tell him no directly.

If your ds does not want to communicate with him he does not have to
He should not be dealing with dad directly if he does not want to
If he wants to see him and whatsapp to arramge thats different
No reason for any contact here
Has to be led by ds
Ask go to refer to camhs so ds can work thru it without you or dad (they will want to hear from both parents however ds could then have individual sessions

I think you should send him a message saying he doesn't want to see him and leave it there.

If you ask your DS to tell him in a WhatsApp then your ex will likely guilt-trip him and he's not as mature mentally to deal with that.

Honestly just tell him to stay away.

For goodness sake stop encouraging these visits. Why do women do this?
Your son has said he doesn't want to see his father and 12 is plenty old enough.

Although old enough to decide no contact I don't think old enough if he has such severe anxiety to have the responsibility of informing his father. I think you have to tell his dad what he said about it causing so much anxiety and distress. Are you worried that dad is going to think that this is coming from you and not DS and maybe stop paying maintenance?

Tell dad that you have done what you can to support them having a relationship but now you must do what your son needs. You can tell him that if those needs change and DS want to pick up contact you will support that. Has DS said whether he wants to have any contact at all eg just through WhatsApp etc? A

Dad is extremely difficult.
This year requested £60,000 as "a gesture of goodwill" when I sold my house, because it had doubled in value from when I purchased it 9 years ago.
Ended up going through court. Solicitors having to use a private investigation company to find his address as he refused to give it to me for paperwork to be sent to him, just to hold up the sale.

But yes I agree about WhatsApp.
My son doesn't want his dad to have his number, so I think I will let him know that he will call/text him when he wants to speak to him

Why are you making your child see him? It’s obvious he must have suffered some kind of abuse at the hand of this useless “dad”. What are you gaining for your son by forcing contact he doesn’t want and your older child has already shunned?