Is shouting at your children always a form of abuse?

[blisscake]

This is related to another thread I've been watching. I would like to know what people think. If it is abuse then can anyone honestly say that they have never shouted at their child and therefore that they have never abused their child? When does shouting at your child become "abuse" and when is it just ""bad parenting? Is it ever acceptable to shout at your children?

Is shouting " You have the memory of a goldfish" abuse?

If so, I'm guilty

rhub... when my ds is older he is going to think i am one big mistake i apologise so much!

Rhubarb, I just felt guilty after reading yours as I don't tend to apologise to them afterwards. Will try it next time.

Obviously some forms of shouting are never wrong - like cheering them on at football! But if there's anger involved then I think it's like all forms of bullying - it's defined by how the person on the receiving end feels. It is abuse if the child on the other end of the shouting feels abused or is damaged by it.

Some kids positively NEED to have things bawled or they don't even listen. Other kids come from families or cultures where raised voices are totally normal. But what would be appropriate discipline to a naturally exuberant child might totally traumatise an emotionally fragile one.

Iota well if it is then it won't do any harm as ds will forget it

I apologise if I think I was out of order (ie.....shouting when I have got my period is a bad thing for me.....it is normally interspersed by bad words {muttered bad words, but still bad}), but apoligies other times makes them immune to me!

I really really think it depends on the tone dn words that you use.

I do find tho, that my 13yo can shout horribly at times, and realise that she sounds exactly LIKE ME

I never apologise to dh however, because everything is always his fault.

That's the bit that shames me I think. I always feel bad but when ds shouts back I think "I taught him that" and I'm not proud of it.

Oh ffs if shouting 'NO! Stop it! I said NO!' is abuse then just about every farking toddler in the country ought to be in care.

I think Rantmum expressed it perfectly. I don't shout often but when I do, it's because the three of them have abused my tolerance. Then they KNOW IT and get back in line. For God's sake let's cut each other some slack and stop labelling everything abuse. Otherwise, how do we pick ourselves up after a bad day and carry on if we consider we've committed child abuse?

I'm an adoptive parent. DH and I adopted a child whose birth parents fractured many of her bones when she was tiny, sickly baby.

Let's get some perspective on child abuse here.

in answer to OP; yes

ah no......never apologise to the husbands.

we are perfect, they are wrong, and we don;t shout - we explain loudly!!!!

Crush: is that yes shouting is always abuse?

I shout far too much. I don't think it is always abusive but I do think it makes my children more impatient, shouty and tantrummy than they might otherwise be. I'd love to shout less but it is a deeply ingrained behaviour

they are impatient and shouty because of the example I set (if that makes sense)

Same for me. My ds though has taken to shouting and losing his temper loads. Have been blaming myself for behaving terribly.

I was never smacked as a child but got yelled at fairly regularly. I grew up to be a responsible member of society and I adore my parents.

I shout at my kids, (Let go of your brother now before I crash the car!, Put your life jacket back on this second!) they have to know the difference between right and wrong and who is in charge. In an ideal world I would always have the time and the opportunity to take them to one side and explain calmly what is wrong but if they have done something potentially dangerous then I will raise my voice and I don't beat myself up for it!

I shout at mine from time to time. It's an expression of my anger. It's not ideal but it happens and it's me and I think it's important for children to see that their parents have real emotions.

I also think many English people have been taught over the generations that shouting means you've 'lost it'. I haven't lost it when I shout. I rarely lose it. I think if I had to force down my vocal expression I would probably be more prone to losing it now and again because these things have to be expressed and not bottled up and festering.

ammaryasir.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/haight-hippie.jpg

this subject is soooooo mumsnet.

feed them lentils and play with them more - drive their imaginaion and you never have to raise your voice

bullshit

I'd rather be shouted at than have him as my dad any day

Am beginning to get a sense of freedom, you mean I can shout and not feel like a child abuser. Next you'll be saying that its ok to feed them sausages...

Abuse can take the form of shouting.

Most shouting is NOT abuse.

Hmm, maybe our opinion on whether it is abuse is coloured by the type of child we have.

Ds1 is Robust. On his first day of school, aged 4.4, he shook me off and ran into the classroom. He did the same at preschool, and I have witnessed a naughty 10 year old boy screaming in ds1's face (believe me I was running to get there!), and he didn't even flinch, wasn't bothered etc.

Sometimes he genuinely only stops buggering about and listens when I shout. And i have tried calm talking, getting down to his level, blinkering his eyes so he can only see me, but I have to SHOUT to bring his attention to what I am saying.

my shouting has NEVER, not ONCE upset him enough to make him cry. And I do get angry. (I stamped my feet in frustration once and he quite justifiably laughed at me)

Ds2 is a different child, and had he been my first, I could see how parents could think shouting is awful and your child may be damaged by it. He is much more sensitive to my moods, and 'the eyebrow' works on him. The query "Do you want to go and sit on the naughty step?" delivered in a quiet but stern voice is enough to make him do as he is told, always.