Regretting having a second child

[Walton45123]

Just that really. Dd is 5 months and is a lovely happy healthy baby. I love her, of course I do, but if I’m honest I think I’ve ruined everything by having a second child.
Ds is 3 and has gone from being a happy, cheeky little soul to a total nightmare - not all of the time, but he can be so incredibly difficult now, playing up at bedtime, trashing his room, throwing things, running away. He tells me he likes his sister (without being asked) which is nice, but his behaviour otherwise is not great. I really struggle to look after them both, especially with breastfeeding. Dh is an amazing dad but I feel so guilty, he works crazy hours as a deputy head of a school, and almost every evening he has to put ds to bed because dd goes down at the same time and screams if it’s anyone except me. I do try to do bath time with ds when I can but often I can hear dd screaming downstairs, which just winds ds up.
I am worried about Dh’s mental health as well, he says he’s miserable and gets no pleasure from anything, and often bursts into tears.
I just feel like I’ve ruined everything. We were a happy unit of 3 and I wanted a second child. Now everyone’s unhappy. Most of my mum friends from my first pregnancy have stuck with one child and their children are so much better behaved.
I feel I am just wishing dd’s babyhood away - she still wakes up 2-3 times a night. I can’t wait to stop breastfeeding, get rid of the horrible clunky pram etc.
I know there’s nothing to be done, I’ve made this happen and it’s my fault. I feel terrible and have let dh, my son and in a way my daughter down. Any advice gratefully received.

I felt this at the same stage. It gets easier I promise!!

I absolutely loathed the baby stage for all of mine, and having to neglect the older ones. No question at all though that having siblings is good for them long term. They have so much fun together and learn from each other. Just get through that awful first bit.

I feel for you,OP, this all sounds very hard.
I can sympathise as my DS is one month, DD4 and I am finding it very hard to juggle everything and really miss the time I had with DD before DS came along, I feel like the bond we had before has really changed.
It is so hard to find time for everything, despite having a very hands on DP, as he is also very busy with work and we are all very tired due to lack of sleep (and for me,incessant breastfeeding as well).
I am just hoping it will get easier with time, as I am sure it will for you. I know its easier said than done, but try to keep positive. You had a second for a reason and with time I am sure your DS will adjust.

I think most people wish at least some aspect of the baby months away to some extent. Even when things are going comparatively well, you’re exhausted, you’re physically tied, often skint etc. I wouldn’t worry about that aspect. Take lots of photos in the good moments, try to carve out some nice bits, but accept that a baby and a preschooler is inevitably chaotic, and the family dynamics have to shift to adapt to the new arrival.

There are nice elements to having a baby, but it’s also hard grind, especially if you don’t have access to those magical hands on grandparents or nannys or whatever.

It will calm down and settle into a new normal once the first year is past. Hang on to that.

What are your plans re work, childcare and so on? Focus on that when things feel impossible. Could you book a holiday for 2023 as another landmark to look ahead to?

I have 2.5 year old twins and its so hard.

I think ur both just exhausted right now. Can you ask hubby to take couple days off work? Or even holding it together till the Easter hols?

Can you ask family to look after kids for few hours while you both catch up on sleep?

I have been told it gets easier so try to focus on this.

Big hugs

Very normal to feel this way. Your ds is attention seeking as he's having to get use to sharing your attention. It is definitely all hands to deck when you have two so it will put more pressure on dh. Try to remember it will change. Dd will get older her needs wil change as will ds. They will be able to play together and the pressure will lift. Also this is not all on you, you both agreed to add to your family and just because it's hard now doesn't make it a wrong choice. Has dh accessed mental health services or gp? It sounds like he could do with some support.

Wow lots of little issues here to unpick. Firstly you haven't ruined the family. You have 2 lovely kids. Who is to say that your DS wouldn't have started behaving like this anyway. And pushing boundaries to see what he can get away with isnperfectly normal. So how to deal with it......Firstly you need a structured routine of discipline. By discipline I jist mean he needs to know what is and isn't acceptable and the age appropriate consequence. For me at that age it was 2 minutes on the naughty step, or turning the TV off. However, you also need to try to work to his strengths - so does he play up at bedtime because he is tired? If so what can you do to the routine to make that easier for him? Can you start bedtime earlier? Can you do bath during the day instead of at night? My routine at that age was that after tea around 6pm I would take both kids to the bathroom. Run the bath, toddler in with toys, baby would have a splash at the other end. Take baby out and get her dry and dressed. Put her in bouncy chair or cot while I finish toddler. Then get toddler our, dressed, teeth. Then we would all go into the bedroom. Sit on toddlers bed and do stories while BF baby her last feed. After stories I used to sit a while with the light of finishing the feed. Then when both kids were asleep put baby down and go downstairs. Usually my DH would get in around now and warm up his tea. He didn't always see the kids before bed. It didn't harm their relationship. He was very involved at weekends.

Make sure during the day toddler has lots of activities to tiee him out and give your day a structure. So that might he pre-school a couple of mornings, or a kids music session, or a trip to the library or a play date/coffee with another friend.

I tried to structure the day somewhat so we all knew what happened next, up, breakfast, pepp pig cartoon while mummy showered, morning activity (with a snack break), home, play while I made lunch, lunch, TV, sleep/nap, up, something else - pop to library/shops/grand parents/play in garden/walk to park, home, play, TV, tea, bath, bed. (Breast feeding fell into the quieter times, first thing, snack time, TV times etc - of course some times you have to stop what you are doing to feed).

Your husband crying could be because he is exhausted but could also be a sign of depression. Does he talk to anyone about how he is feeling? There is a free confidential helpline available for all teachers. Please Google it and encourage him to call. This has been the hardest most stressful time for all school staff. He has had to deal with covid and all the difficulties the schools have faced and also adjust to a new baby. If talking doesn't help encourage him to see the doctor.

You have got this. You can do this. It does get easier. If your mood doesn't improve you may also need to see the doctor - because mum's can get depressed too.

Do you have any friends with 2 kids you can talk to? Maybe not with babies the same age, maybe older kids? Solidarity and a understanding can help.

You've always got MN too.

Totally normal! But I promise it’s well worth it once the youngest is a bit older. Again, wishing their lives away! But it’s unbelievably hard with two. It will get easier.

Only tips I have are to spend tons of time with ds. And involve him in all things baby. He’s feeling usurped. Bring him into your new world and he will slowly get back to his happy self. Bath them together!

You can even sit him down when he’s thrashing about and empathise that it must be tough not getting so much time with you. That you miss it too, but it will be so much fun when dd can play games and join in when she’s older etc. lots of hugs, praise and kisses.

Spend time with your partner. If you can get a date night, even better. I expect you aren’t having proper conversations right now, so make that a priority. Coffee in the morning, no tv at night, just chat etc. it will help you both. Really empathise how shit it all is right now, then plan for fun things to do together, or on your own to bring some joy. If he feels heard and his feelings validated, he will do the same for you.

I felt the same with all of mine. Serious regret around the 6 month mark. Still had more and I’m super glad now, it’s just that baby stage. You’ll be okay

I just wanted to commiserate, really! I have a nearly four year old and 7 month old twins. Obviously, I love the twins but my god, the guilt and regret! Our house is chaotic and stressful, my husband is depressed, the older child plays up. My friends with one child go on holiday, have day trips, go out for meals etc. We do none of that. It's shit.
However! I love having my own siblings as an adult, and I see friends/family with older kids and though of course there are arguments, I do think it is such a blessing to have a sibling or two, and we'll worth the horror of the first year.
Once their needs start aligning more things get simpler - for example, the other day I came home from a supermarket trip with the kids and they all sat and ate a snack together round the table. At 5 months this would have been the older one having a hastily grabbed stale cracker and an old banana, and the babies screaming for milk. So it's getting better every month. It will for you too.

It's hard work. Can you not stop breastfeeding now DD is 5 months? I would also try some baby rice.

Can you afford a childminder for DD a morning a week? Then spend 1-1 time with DS.

There's a chance DS would start playing up now anyway. So don't just assume it's because you had a baby.

It is a massive adjustment for all of you and it is hard. My elder child was furious at the arrival of the younger one - always lovely and caring with the baby thankfully, but SO angry with me. I think I minimised the amount of change bringing a baby into the family meant for all of us before it happened.

However it does get better. My advice to friends who are having a second child is that some things will probably be easier/ less shocking than the first time, but others will be harder. There is a definite grind to all of it (and I say that having absolutely loved my children at all stages) but that does ease with time.

It really helped me to think of the long game. I.e. Two happy children who would at some point thoroughly enjoy hanging out together. My husband found this far harder as he tends to live much more in the moment. But we did get there in the end and they will now happily play for hours together without us bring involved.

I have a 3yo (4 in the summer) and the other day all of his friends mums and I met up for a play date and everyone was talking about how 3 is harder than 2. That their behaviour becomes way more challenging. Your sons behaviour might be a stage thing rather than a reaction to the baby.

I can’t remember 100% but perhaps someone else can - my memory is that babies go to bed later than 3 year olds. I’m wondering if your DS is going too late and he’s tired? Or DD early and that’s why she screams for you? Might be wrong. I think my DS went to bed at 9ish as a baby (or is that just for newborns?) and 7:30 as a 3yo. I’m about to have a baby so should probably know this!

My son was exactly the same when my daughter was born and probably up until about a month ago (she’s just turned 9 months and he was 3 at the beginning of the year).
It was exhausting and I wondered if we’d scarred him for life but it was a phase that thankfully he seems to have passed. He goes to nursery twice a week so gets to spend time with people he knows without everything being about his sister and we make sure we spend as mum 1 on 1 time with him where possible because I think a lot of it was jealousy that he had gone from being the only one to now having a baby around that everyone coos over.
It’s so hard but you’re definitely not alone.

I think it partly will just be an age thing. DD recently turned 3 and her behaviour has worsened a bit: not listening, being rough, refusing to do things, answering back. My friends with 3yos are going through the same thing, and nursery said it's a very common phase! Having another child in the equation certainly doesn't make life easier, but it's probably not the sole cause. It's just an awkward age! Old enough to want to have agency over what they do, not old enough to be reasonable about it

I wouldn't necessarily 'blame' (I know that's not the right word but it's early!) the new baby for your older child's behaviour to be honest. I've got a 2, 4 and 6 year old and for the older two, at age three they were complete nightmares to be honest. I thought it was because of the younger sibling being added but actually all my friends with three year olds also had little monsters at that age, even when they were only children.

Being honest, your youngest is at the most boring age ever and it's hard for the two children to really have a relationship at this stage. It gets better, lots better. My older two are the best of friends, but actually my six year old loves playing games with the two year old too now (I think it's because she's easy to boss around!) and they have a really lovely relationship and lots of fun together. Saying that, the older two didn't really have any interest in 'the baby' until she was walking and seemed more like a person to them. Now she can talk and actually play games they all get on well. An added bonus is that I do very very very little in the way of entertaining the kids, they all just occupy themselves together. There are real bonuses to having more than one child, you're just not quite at the stage to benefit yet but you will be.

This isn't helpful for you now, I know, but it does get easier. Try, if you can, to absolutely love-bomb your older child, even if you don't really feel like it! And give yourself a break too, this stuff is hard.

I can absolutely relate to this.

You’re really in the trenches just now. This is as hard as it gets. It does get better.

I agree with PP who said the behaviour change could have happened with your older one anyway. I don’t know a single three year old who’s not at least a bit tricky, no matter what their circumstances. And remember you’re seeing your child ALL the time, and only snapshots of those other three year olds.

Can you get a bit of help at pressure points, like in the evenings? If not family, would your budget stretch to a mother’s help for a couple of hours on weekdays?

Your DH does sound a bit depressed. He should visit the GP.

Hang on in there. You haven’t ruined your family, you’ve just changed it and it takes time to settle down.

@Mumdiva99

Wow lots of little issues here to unpick. Firstly you haven't ruined the family. You have 2 lovely kids. Who is to say that your DS wouldn't have started behaving like this anyway. And pushing boundaries to see what he can get away with isnperfectly normal. So how to deal with it......Firstly you need a structured routine of discipline. By discipline I jist mean he needs to know what is and isn't acceptable and the age appropriate consequence. For me at that age it was 2 minutes on the naughty step, or turning the TV off. However, you also need to try to work to his strengths - so does he play up at bedtime because he is tired? If so what can you do to the routine to make that easier for him? Can you start bedtime earlier? Can you do bath during the day instead of at night? My routine at that age was that after tea around 6pm I would take both kids to the bathroom. Run the bath, toddler in with toys, baby would have a splash at the other end. Take baby out and get her dry and dressed. Put her in bouncy chair or cot while I finish toddler. Then get toddler our, dressed, teeth. Then we would all go into the bedroom. Sit on toddlers bed and do stories while BF baby her last feed. After stories I used to sit a while with the light of finishing the feed. Then when both kids were asleep put baby down and go downstairs. Usually my DH would get in around now and warm up his tea. He didn't always see the kids before bed. It didn't harm their relationship. He was very involved at weekends.

Make sure during the day toddler has lots of activities to tiee him out and give your day a structure. So that might he pre-school a couple of mornings, or a kids music session, or a trip to the library or a play date/coffee with another friend.

I tried to structure the day somewhat so we all knew what happened next, up, breakfast, pepp pig cartoon while mummy showered, morning activity (with a snack break), home, play while I made lunch, lunch, TV, sleep/nap, up, something else - pop to library/shops/grand parents/play in garden/walk to park, home, play, TV, tea, bath, bed. (Breast feeding fell into the quieter times, first thing, snack time, TV times etc - of course some times you have to stop what you are doing to feed).

Your husband crying could be because he is exhausted but could also be a sign of depression. Does he talk to anyone about how he is feeling? There is a free confidential helpline available for all teachers. Please Google it and encourage him to call. This has been the hardest most stressful time for all school staff. He has had to deal with covid and all the difficulties the schools have faced and also adjust to a new baby. If talking doesn't help encourage him to see the doctor.

You have got this. You can do this. It does get easier. If your mood doesn't improve you may also need to see the doctor - because mum's can get depressed too.

Do you have any friends with 2 kids you can talk to? Maybe not with babies the same age, maybe older kids? Solidarity and a understanding can help.

You've always got MN too.

Mumdiva99 A lot of what you did with your children depends on having compliant children !

No way my baby would have been left waiting whilst if finished older ones bath.
Nor would she have feed quietly whilst I read stories and no way would she just be put down once asleep and stay that way.

You make it sound incredibly easy. Maybe that was your reality but swap in high needs baby and it doesn't work like that for many.

It's not about parenting it's about baby's being individual.

The ops post sounds like her baby is like mine was not yours ! It was an utter nightmare tbh!

I feel similar to this - and my second is only 5wks. It's feeling like a huge mistake. In all honesty I didn't want him, he was an accident and I never planned on having any kids at all, let alone 2.
My DD has only just turned 2 and is wonderful with the baby - until he cries. Then all hell breaks loose. My dad witnessed it this week and he was really shocked as I don't think anyone had really understood just how bad it gets. We can't go anywhere in the car as a family as my DD whines the whole way there and back with stretches of screaming and crying so much she starts hyperventilating.

My DP works a mix of day and night shifts and the last 2 nights have been testing my patience. The baby has screamed non-stop from my DP leaving at 6pm until midnight both nights. I take him upstairs about 1:30am and he's crying again by 4am and I don't get back to sleep before my DP is home around 9am. My DP has just taken on a third job too which is more involved than they led him to believe, he hasn't worked his 2nd job since the baby was born but that is starting again within the next week. I'm trying to finish a qualification for work and the deadline is next week but I haven't even started and don't have the time to work on it. Plus I have things I never finished at work before maternity leave that I have to deal with asap.
On top of this we're renovating our house so we're living in a huge mess with no end in sight as we're doing it ourselves.
We have no help from family and can't afford childcare fees so I feel like I never have a break. The baby is constantly puking - we had this with my DD and I forgot how draining it is to deal with plus the constant washing that needs to be done. My DD won't play alone yet either so wants constant attention. It's draining.

We'd got to the point where it would have been lovely to have lots of day trips and short breaks with DD. Now all that is ruined and my DD just runs riot when we're out together. She also barely eats and mealtimes are a huge struggle, especially with the baby screaming throughout.

I honestly can't see a time when I'll be able to cope.

I really feel for you! I completely wished away the first year of my second child’s life too. Can you get a doula for a few hours a week to help with the baby, which will free you up a bit to spend time with your son?

Breathe OP your doing fab. Your DD is 5 months why have you got a set time for bedtime that is so rigid? You have 2 babies now so sort DS out... at bedtime but the bath rocker in the bathroom whilst DS is having a bath and then move it into the bedroom when you are getting DS ready.

Just to say that I have a friend who wonders why she didn't go on antidepressants when her second child was tiny, she did a while later. I would prioritise your husband going to the doctor.

Handhold OP, as a PP said it will get easier. Everything is difficult when you are exhausted, do you have family close by that can give you a hand at all. I had my two close together, DS1 was 21mths when DS2 arrived, DS2 was a very difficult baby for the first 8mths, MIL really helped us, even had him all night, in our home one night a week so we could sleep undisturbed for a night, I was BF but he took a made up bottle of formula fine from MIL. It sounds like you and DH really need a break, even for an hour or two. I will do all I can to help my two when they have their families, my sons are 20 & 19 now and very close brothers. It will be ok, but I remember this stage well. Good luck.

It's tough! It sounds like you are both at breaking point. Can you make use of the Easter holidays to both have some downtime? Where can you cut corners e.g. cooking? Does your 3yo go to nursery? Does your DH need to speak to somebody about his mental health?

If bedtime is a struggle, can you change that up? It sounds like you want to spend more time with DS, so can you adjust the timings slightly e.g. let him play with toys whilst you deal with DD and then come back to him some nights or ask your DH to take DD for a walk when the evenings get lighter? Or just aim to use the approaching holidays for some 1:1 with DS? This all sounds like I'm telling you to do MORE and I'm sorry for that! I just wondered if small bits of more for your DS might mean he goes to bed easier, which might ultimately be better fir you.

Hang in there. Bedtime with your youngest will change and she will become more able to join in with bath, story etc. This is a tough period.

Having a baby and a toddler is incredibly intense and many of us have struggled in your situation. Having your daughter wasn't a mistake but it's fine to acknowledge that life is tough at the moment and a bit shit! Just see it as a temporary hardship. The years will absolutely fly by and before you know it they'll both be at school and everything will be different. Hang in there.

Your son sounds like a typical 3 year old to be honest. It's just a phase. Sticker charts for good behaviour started to help around that age. You don't have to breastfeed if you're finding it that hard - formula is a perfectly acceptable and safe choice so it really is ok to switch. If you don't want to, then bf isn't forever, just hang on in there. If your dh is struggling with his mental health its not your fault. Presume he agreed to the second baby. He needs to get to the GP for some help.