Too young to discipline?

[BeMyFriend90]

My near 3 year old throws stuff. He doesn't like anything. He shouts and demands attention. He grabs at my phone and tries to hit me when I say no.

Everytime I read advice online it says at this age its all down to frustration and I just need to love and support

My everytime I go to MN it's full of mums saying "god how awful are other people's kids" and then stories about how awful 3 year olds are and the comments are just horrendous..."ferral kids" "awful parenting" "weak mums" blah blah.

When my toddler has a tantrum I try to support him because I think I'm doing the right thing. But should I be telling him off properly?

Pls don't say trust your instincts. I don't seem to have any on this stuff. He's going to school next year and I just want to do whatever I need to do to help him. Right now he can't sit still, throws his food, and cries if his banana breaks in two so yeah...we have got some way to go

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You're conflating the anxieties/downsides of several approaches, which won't work. You kind of need to pick one and stick with it and then ignore what people say, because it there isn't a single perfect approach and you can't please everyone at once.

So (massive simplification and in reality there is overlap between all of them)

You could use the boundaries = consequences approach:
Make expectations clear in child-friendly language
Warn that current behaviour will lead to consequence if continued
Administer (fair, non-terrifying) consequence if behaviour continues
Balance with praise and reward for good behaviour and lots of positive attention when child is not misbehaving.
Pros: Probably the most common/well known behaviour management technique. Simple and clear. Effective for most children.
Cons: Bit of a blunt tool, ineffective if demands are not age (or development) appropriate, relies on direct conflict. Some consequences (e.g. smacking, shouting) can be harmful.

You could use a positive parenting approach:
Ignore bad behaviour unless it's actively destructive/dangerous, in which case prevent/redirect
Think about how to turn request around e.g. instead of "stop throwing food" try "here is a plate for the pieces you don't want" or redirect urge e.g. instead of "no throwing" try "you can throw this soft ball into this box".
Praise and notice good behaviour
Use natural/logical consequences e.g. help clean up a mess.
Pros: Less conflict than consequence-heavy, positive discipline more effective than aversive.
Cons: Can be hard to deal with persistent destructive behaviour

Or a non-coercive approach:
Look past behaviours as being something to encourage/discourage and more as communication - top 3: they have an unmet need or overwhelming emotion; their understanding of expected behaviour wasn't clear; they aren't capable of this yet and need more support/supervision.
Validate feelings/emotions before (not instead of) trying to problem solve or teach
Avoid blame/shame language (you have done X, that's bad/naughty)
Assume positive intent
Coach/support/scaffold to avoid future repeats of behaviour
Pros: Low conflict, helps build relationship/trust, very effective if done well, works even for neurodiverse children
Cons: Labour intensive for parent, can be unclear how to tackle situations, not much good consistent support/resources, often seen negatively by others.

He sounds pretty normal, and you're doing a good job. I'm sure its the new baby that's causing some of the issues. I'd say try the naughty step for hitting, but everything else you're doing is great.

[quote BeMyFriend90]@Hellocatshome He's nearly 3. I take him to football on Saturday and he is the naughtiest there by a mile and they're all the same age. As soon as there is an exercise to do he just runs in the opposite direction to the other kids! He literally doesn't give a crap about other kids or following what they're doing. It's like he's in his own world and he only wants to be with me.[/quote]
Two is very young for a structured class and it’s just too much for some people. Are you a sahm or who look after him during the week and what do they think?

Also has he had an audiology assessment?

If you’re looking for reading material to help you to work out an approach I would really recommend ‘the book you wish your parents had read’ by Philippa Perry.

A really key takeaway from the book for me was that your relationship with your child is the thing you absolutely need to focus on, and that all behaviour can tell you something about this relationship. So basically, if they’re being ‘naughty’ is it really that they just want your attention?

Im very much finding that, since the baby was born, if Im too focused on him and not on toddler DD, she can become a bit destructive. If I make a point to spend one on one time with her daily, and to give her lots and lots of affection, she is much calmer and more likely to do as I ask.

Reading all your posts I think you are being so hard on yourself. Your DS sounds like hard work but many/most toddlers are and if any of us had all the answers we’d be millionaires. As he’s understanding increases his frustration will get lower.

OP, one thing I would suggest is to read up on the different kinds of tantrums. Sometimes called 'distress tantrums' vs 'little Nero tantrums'. The approach for managing are very different. Essentially, a distress tantrum is a result of genuine anguish/upset and the child needs comfort from you. Even if it seems like a tiny insignificant thing has caused it, it may be huge to them and it doesn't mean the distress isn't real for them. Vs a Nero tantrum which is all about them trying to exert control. Being able to recognise the difference and have a consistent approach in each case has been very helpful for me.

As soon as there is an exercise to do he just runs in the opposite direction to the other kids! He literally doesn't give a crap about other kids or following what they're doing.

My DS was like this until a bit older- still running in the wrong direction at 4 or 5. Also took a while to start playing with other children. Some kids just do things at their own pace- it's often boys, I think.

Agree with PP that you are being hard on yourself and worrying too much about what sounds like pretty normal toddler behaviour. I second the recommendation of the Philippa Perry book. One of the things it's very good on is helping you see why you react in a particular way to your child's behaviour, which might be to do with how you were parented yourself or other things (like worrying about your DH).

[quote BeMyFriend90]@Hellocatshome He's nearly 3. I take him to football on Saturday and he is the naughtiest there by a mile and they're all the same age. As soon as there is an exercise to do he just runs in the opposite direction to the other kids! He literally doesn't give a crap about other kids or following what they're doing. It's like he's in his own world and he only wants to be with me.[/quote]
Just spotted this update.

My kids were not ready for structured classes like this at 2 nearly 3 but by the time that they went to school, they were very ready and were never in trouble for not listening to the teacher.

Have you considered stopping these classes and trying again next year if he's still keen? There's no real benefit for 2 year old classes and it's absolutely fine to try again when he's older and more ready to listen and get something out of it.

Hey OP, I can sympathise, my DD sounds similar in some ways but we are further on from you as she will be 4 this summer. We have a second too but DS is only 5 months.

You've had some good advice, a few things I want to comment on...

Football - sack this off? If he's not participating why are you taking him? My DD wouldn't have been able to participate in a structured class at that age either, apart from swimming but she did that with DH (Water Babies). We tried a trial of baby ballet when she was 2.5 and she wouldn't engage at all so dropped it. Now at nearly 4 she's asking to go back to ballet so we might try another trial soon, she also goes to a different swimming group now where she goes in the water without a parent and participates well despite being the youngest in her group. So it changes quickly! Just leave it for now, not worth the money or the stress.

Tantrums - ignore. I wouldn't bother with 'sorry'. DD says it herself usually now but wouldn't at your DS's age and I don't really see the worth when they are so little. We've always focused on a restorative approach. I can't say it's helped as she is still a terrible tantrummer!! However she is only really like this for me and DH, since she turned 3 she's rarely much bother if we go out and about. So throwing things means she will have to tidy up after (I will help), I have encouraged her showing kindness to people after e.g. if she hit her DF I'd encourage her to give him a cuddle or draw him a picture or something after rather than say 'sorry' specifically. Tbh I often despair with her tantrums but writing this makes me see that we have made progress because actually now she's older she usually does this stuff off her own back now once she's calmed down.

Speech - no expert at all, not sure speech therapy may be an option or is that not appropriate/possible?

Not sure what your DS is like but my DD doesn't like being at home and thrives being out and kept busy. So we do that as much as possible. I'm on mat leave now, she goes to nursery 2 days a week, the other 3 weekdays we do a playgroup every morning, usually see her DGM one PM and sometimes squeeze a playdate into another PM too, as the weather warms up on anticipating spending a lot of PMs in the parks.

School: summer born children can start reception after their ,5th birthday, that's what my DD will be doing.