I've put my heart and soul into this kid. Why is he like this?

[Bobbiebigbum]

I have a 9 year old. He has a very mild disability (not learning or behavioural). I've put everything into raising him at this point and I am close to breaking. He is constantly winding up his younger brother (aged 5), all he does when he gets up is head straight for YouTube or some other tech. He won't sit at the dinner table more than 5 minutes and he argues every night about bedtime. If I sit him next to his brother at the dinner table he will physically fight with him. He's like a neanderthal. I've done everything I can for him, engaged him in after school clubs from cubs to surfing and football. I would say our relationship is pretty strained now. He's actually making me ill with his stressful behaviour. Any ideas? I'm at my wits end.

Try more time outdoors. More time FREE playing (ie not organised activities) with other children (of varying ages). A discussion with him on his thoughts and feelings. Is he unhappy is there a need going unfulfilled?

Sounds wishy washy but all proven to help.

Does his dad live with you, OP? If not, does he see him?

You've had some good advice about tech. Limit how much he gets and take it away if he gives you any trouble when it's time to stop.

Re bedtime, set out your rules e g. Pjs and teeth done by 7.30; reading in bed till 8 then lights out (or whatever time you decide). If he breaks the rules then bedtime is 5 minutes earlier the next day. If he does it well then he 'earns' a slightly later night on a Friday or Saturday with a film or whatever you want as a treat.

Be strong, he'll push back hard and it will likely get worse before it gets better. But kids feel safer and happier with boundaries.

The fighting with his brother is trickier but I'd keep apart/supervise as much as possible for now and tackle tech and bedtime first. You may find there's less problems once those things are sorted anyway.

How to Talk so Kids Will Listen and Listen so Kids Will Talk www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1848123094/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_NG4R3RMADK84NV583DWJ?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

And cut way back or cold turkey on the tech. He sounds addicted.

Is his dad around? What’s he like at school?

I know someone kind of like this. There good people but their son is a handful and they can’t figure out why. It’s because they are scared to put in place consequences because they can’t handle the fall out, so they try to act like they are telling him off but he knows they won’t do too much to punish him because they don’t want him to have a tantrum.

Gather your strength, grow your backbone, and take the tech away indefinitely. Return it is small doses when you are seeing the behaviours and cooperation you need from him. Require more from him. Helping you with jobs, cooking, whatever... Give him a responsibility, then another one. Whatever you can manage. Nine is a difficult age for a boy, and it feels like the easiest thing is to just let him be, but you'll regret that enormously. Take control whilst he's still young enough to learn his place. If he's like this at nine, how will it be when he's 15, bigger than you, and full of testosterone!? And your younger son is watching and learning. Flex your mum muscles, op! You still have chance to get a helpful considerate man out of him!

He figured that out from age 5, kids are too clever these days!

You need to ask the doctor or school about parenting classes. I think you are too far down the rabbit hole to do this completely on your own.

Ok so you can control all your child's devices via your phone. Set it up (ask someone to help you) and take control. Set the boundaries. You will go through some pain but for so much gain.

Put all his tech in your car (hidden from view!), lock car, keys in your pocket.

And brace yourself for the storm!

But he should start to improve within a few days.

Try to find ways for him to physically burn off his energy - a walk in the woods where he can climb trees, build a den. A bike ride. Trampolining?

Hi OP.
You sound like a good parent to me, you're concerned about some tricky behaviour, let's face it most of us have been there. 9 is a tough age, and it has been a testing year where a lot of us have relied too much on tech. Not surprisingly.

I don't have any advice that others haven't mentioned. But just to say I feel like this too sometimes. When my normally sweet and happy DD becomes argumentative and moody. It's hard to know what to do sometimes. I have learnt to allow time for everything, going to school was always a rush and lead to bad behaviour and misery en route. We now spend longer getting ready. Same before bed so there's more time to adjust & bedtime tantrum is less frequent. Hope it gets better.

Would it help to think of the tantrums / hitting / whatever he does when he’s cross as showing you’re imposing a boundary? You’re not being cruel, he’s not distressed, he’s just very cross that he’s hit a boundary and you won’t move it. Each reaction shows that you’re successfully holding the line, and setting clear expectations. You can see it in an almost positive way.

On tech, I suspect cold turkey is your best bet. But if you don’t do that, then do google how to set parental controls so he has limited time, and limited access. Personally, I would not give access to any app or game that is marked as older than 9yo - though I know that’s a minority view, and many parents choose to ignore age limits.

Agree he sounds addicted to the tech.

I try my best to hide it, but he sniffs it out every time

Then you’re not hiding it well enough, an adult should be able to firstly reach places that a 9 year old can’t and secondly know about where things are kept ‘to be safe’ and a 9 year old should know/have access to those types of places.

That isn’t really the point though, I suppose, getting to a position where you’re not hiding it would be idea but I have no idea how you do that?! I can’t even get mine to look at a screen for more than 3 fucking minutes I just want to sit down

Shouldn’t *

Look some kids are harder than others, my eldest was a total pill and that was pre-tech. I would make him earn access to his devices, good behaviour earns him a certain amount of time, bad behaviour causes him to lose it for a certain amount of time. But you really need to stick with it no matter how much he begs/rages.

@Bobbiebigbum

Mostly I'm gentle natured. But after he pushes and pushes I get exhausted and about 1 time a month I loose my shit and shout loud at him. Then I feel terrible. The cycle continues.

I can totally relate, my DS8 is the same and has always been a difficult child. Rewards/consequences work intermittently but mostly he doesn't care. Everything is an argument and he wares us down. I ve gone through periods of not wanting to be near him, periods where we are close and I think we ve made a breakthrough and periods where I have totally lost my s*. Particularly during lockdown. I have reached the end of my tether with him many times.

It's hard to say what can change things as when we go through good periods I rack my brain as to why but can't put my finger on a particular reason. I think mostly he's decided to behave rather than we've done something.

We ended up getting a counsellor for my dc, maybe extreme, but we got to the point where we didn't know what to do with him, we didn't feel like we could provide him with the support he needs and having him and us talk to an outsider eased the pressure off us. We had reached a brick wall. We also tried to make things positive and focus on what he was doing right and made quite a fuss about this with exaggerated praise and rewards. Rather than thinking it was just bad behaviour we tried to think about why he was behaving like this, what he wanted to communicate to us. We listened and showed empathy and support (even if we didn't agree with his opinions or thoughts) in tantrums he was left to calm down and then talked about it with cuddles afterwards and we tried to reach a compromise. It was give and take. Screen time was earnt rather than a given. Mostly he was given time by me and my DH, 1-1 time, time to talk, listen and his feelings and views validated. It didn't mean he gets his own way and he still loves to whine and fight against us and wind DH and me and his sister up but he is getting better and we are closer. I think I understand him more and have accepted him for who he is more rather than fighting against him.

@Bobbiebigbum, Hi, the (single - because I know Mumsnetters always need to know if there’s a father on board) parent of two children with complex needs and disabilities here. I just wanted to bypass the whole ‘tech’ rabbit hole drama that’s going on here and check if your disabled child is receiving the right support for him at school as what I tend to find is that my disabled child suffers all the injustices that disabled children have to suffer in the school environment, day in and day out, and then offloads all her pent-up frustrations at home.

Sibling rivalry and arguing and fighting is totally normal but if it’s stressing you out, then why not consider seating your children differently? My 13-year-old regresses to toddlerhood when she’s with her five-year-old sister and it’s scarily like having two toddlers. Most parents have smaller age gaps and it is commonly accepted that toddlers and those close in age will argue and fight; I’ve realised that regardless of the big age gap, the normal sibling rivalry still exists but I’m less tolerant as I expect my elder child to behave better.

With regards to the tech, I would hazard a guess that most kids of your elder son’s age would be on it 24/7 if they could. Let’s face it, many of the adults on this site post so frequently that they’re clearly not tackling War and Peace in their downtime.

Please, as the parent of a (very challenging) teenager, try to find some commonality with your boy, see if you can spend some one-on-one time, love bomb him, and read up on natural consequences for poor behaviour, rather than the bog-standard Mumsnet trope of ‘change the WiFi password’ for any child misdemeanour.

Don't remove the tech, remove the internet. Tech is awfully boring without the internet.

@Bobbiebigbum

Its easy to say set boundaries but day to day it can be hard to think what that looks like and how you make it happen!

Exactly this. I think I'm so worn down from the daily grind. @MildredPuppy
Thank you for the tips.

Yes, we were too. Everyday I would dread having to deal with him. Everyday we had to watch what we said or did to avoid meltdowns, we were dealing with multiple meltdowns a day. It was exhausting, I know how you feel. When your child isn't a regular child where normally rewards, consequences and boundaries don't work people don't understand. It's not as simple as that.

Do you have a car? I've been known to hide tech in my car. Although it does mean I have to hide my car keys too.

You have my sympathy, my 12yr old will lash out and smash things up quite often. She has more energy than me so there's only so much time I can cope with meltdowns and restrain her before I need to think about her brother/ food / work / sleep.

check if your disabled child is receiving the right support for him at school as what I tend to find is that my disabled child suffers all the injustices that disabled children have to suffer in the school environment, day in and day out, and then offloads all her pent-up frustrations at home.

I think you may have hit the nail on the head there @SmaugMum. He manages brilliantly in school but I think as yuu say there are subtle daily injustices that are affecting his sense of self. It's not really a school that majors on diversity of needs. They do the statutory minimum. He came home from school the other day saying he could end it (his life) because he started life on the wrong foot with a disability. Something is going on in his mind. Later after a stint on YouTube he says he loves his life. I just don't know whether to get help as he blows so hot and cold that I don't know if he's just saying words. Thanks for all the supportive words so far. It's helping a lot.

@Lucaslucas1612, yes, I agree, I joke that the world is divided into the parents of Perfect Peters and Horrible Henrys and never the twain shall meet. It is very difficult to cope when you have a temperamentally challenging child who is hard work from the minute they wake up till they go to bed, regardless of the quality of the parental input. (And my daughter only had a mobile phone when she was 12).

💐

Between: A guide for parents of eight to thirteen-year-olds www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0349427771/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_api_glt_fabc_TE04A1M2WKS6YV36EAW5?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

At that age we removed all tech from all 4 kids for 3 months. They were much much nicer for it. Dont be scared he's 9. It'll be so much worse in 2,3,4 years if you don't get a handle on it now.

If necessary sell it. We told them it was sold.