Inappropriate behaviour in a 9 year old

[lemonstartree]

This weekend I was babysitting for my brother and his wife

My brother rang me today and said that my eldest son (just 9) had been telling his cousins (girl 6 and boy 4) all about 'mating', and more alarmingly had been trying to get them to let him touch their bottoms and put his finger 'in' . Apparently he also does this to my 5 year old ds2.

I have asked ds1 about this and he completely denies it

I dont believe him ; I dont see why two seperate children should make something like this up, also ds2 tels me it is true

I have asked him to go to his bedroom and consider this, but feel really stuck

help

I am on my own as my h left 3 months ago (for being verbally and physically abusive )

Don't really feel qualified to answer, but bump for you.

Presumably you're worried that someone has been talking/showing your son this behaviour? Would it help to maybe talk to the gp about whether your ds needs to talk to a counsellor?

I am worried about it for a million reasons, well a few !

I am worried that he has picked up this behaviour from someone, tho I cant see where ?

or seen it somewhere ??

I am worried that despite the clear evidence, he is still lying to me.

I am worried that he is growing up too quickly, emotionally he is still very childish, but physically he is big and has smellyish armpits and feet

I am worried about ds 2&3 and my nieces and nephew....

I am angry with my ex for going on abut 'shagging' in front of the kids

actually I'm just worried...

He could just be curious though. Think you need to tell ds2 that they are his bits and that only ds2 can touch them. As to ds1 perhaps a good strategy is (in the first instance) not to ask whether he does it but tell him that you know and tell him that you still love him. Then you can perhaps begin to explain why he shouldn't do it to other children. That other children may not have the same curiosity as he does (they are younger, they are not chaging in the way that he is changing yet) and so it is best to experiment with himself for the time being.

You need to get to the bottom of this. It sets off a huge alarm siren in my head, tbh. Especially that it is repeated by him on numerous occasions.

For God's sake don't frighten him by letting him see your fear but you HAVE to find out where he got this from.

I hope that it is some stupid playground talk he's heard from the yr 6's or something, and until or unless you discover otherwise, assume that's what it is. But don't ask him leading questions, he might try to please you by giving you answers he thinks you want.

It must be checked out.

Lemonstar

I disagree with KM that your ds's behaviour means he has been abused. Children do come up with weird sexual behaviour of their own accord -- I know several people with definitely non-abused children who have some very odd behaviour, including secret spanking sessions(!) Kids sticking things up their bums is not necessarily a sign of abuse.

BUT I do think the fact that he is acting this out with younger children is abusive towards them, and the fact that he's being secretive about it indicates that he knows it's not appropriate.

I would second the suggestion that you talk to a health professional that you trust and who knows your family to get some proper advice. In the meantime, i would make a time to talk to your son, tell him very clearly that it's normal to have sexual feelings and normal to touch yourself, but that it is absolutely not ok to do this kind of touching with other children, particularly much younger ones. There are several good books on this topic that might give you a steer.

I think Frogs has it spot on - it may just indicate a healthy and normal curiosity, but he needs to be absolutely clear that acting things out with younger children is very very wrong. Give him all the facts - the full sex education, including gay sex - and that will indicate to him that he can talk to you about anything at all, which might stop the lying. You also need to talk to DS2 and in as non-alarmist a way possible make sure he knows that his body is private. What a nightmare for you. Don't panic, though - just get talking to him.

two sets of my cousins did quite similar things when they were in their pre-teens. another of my cousins used to show me how his willy could get big "when he thought about love". I used to have naked cuddles in bed with my best friend when i was 4. sorry tmi but the point i want to make is that Experiementation is really common but sometimes come children don't really understand the issue of consent. This does not make them abusers its just that their physical curiosity has come before they are emotionally ready for it.

Poor you lemonstar.

Agree that it needn't be sign of abuse.
If he's misunderstood mating (word makes me think he might have got it from teachers/wildlife prog?) he might think it involves bums. And might want to investigate.

But yes, he mustn't investigate on others, esp younger ones, and he does probably know this hence secrecy.

Gentle kindness essential - tho is very difficult not to be tough when you're v anxious. It will be difficult to fully get to the truth if he's feeling really ashamed adn embarrassed.

I'm not sure I would get healthcare prof involved immediately, tho? Maybe being paranoid, but it sounds possible that this is straightforward exploration, and could suddenly spiral into something bigger than it is. But I may be completely wrong - is theer a professional out there?

KerryMum

Yes, agree with Hassled that some serious sex-education sessions are called for, including gay sex, and including an explanation of the fact that some adults touch children in this way and that this is always wrong and not the children's fault.

That way you clear the way for him to tell you if anything of that nature has happened to him, without putting the idea in his head.

And no, KM, I don't think children sticking things up bottoms is necessarily outside the range of normal kiddie sexuality your children may not have done it, but it's certainly not unheard of. And the fact that it's naughty and a bit disgusting is presumably part of the draw as it may be for adults, no?

I think Lemon needs to be aware that her ds may have had disturbing encounters that have put this idea into his head, but may also have come up with it spontaneously, or as a result of playground conversations. To assume he must have been abused might be be a way of avoiding confronting the fact that a 9yo boy with some signs of very early puberty is likely to have sexual feelings of his own, and that he needs urgently to learn what is and isn't an appropriate way of acting them out.

thanks

I have been very non confrontational, and told him that he is my son and that I love him;that my job as his mummy is to help him see what is right and wrong and explain things that he dosnt understand.

he is still adamently dening everything......

ds2 however has confirmed this to me...

Honestly dont see how/where or by whom he could be being abused......

sh*t; just want to do the right thing......

I went through a phase when I was eight/nine of touching my friends parts.

Approach it in whichever way makes you feel most comfortable, but it's certainly within the boundaries of normal behaviour for children of this age, and should not automatically be indicative of any prior sexual abuse.

I would be careful how you approach that, imo.

Hmm, possibly. But then again he might just be picking up on the fact that's it's taboo. I mean, my ds (8) likes having a good fiddle with his willy, but I can't remotely imagine him being prepared to discuss his habit with me.

I'm so sorry to hear you're going through this. Whilst it may not be a sign of anything sinister my concern would be that someone has told him not to tell anyone and that is why he is denying it so vehemently - I understand that that's often the way abusers operate.

also will be picking up on the fact that his mum is really worried about it. yes he probably knows that it is wrong but not why. perhaps he feels that he is a bad person for wanting to do it

My sympathies: keeping it as calm as possible is the right way to proceed. ANd should it turn out fo have been abuse by an adult, you still need to keep as calm as possible around your DS and make sure above all that he understands it wasn;t his fault, that you still love him and that he is not irrevocably tainted by what has happened - unfortunately the horrified reactions of adults to abuse, even though understandable, can make the experience even more frightening and traumatic for the child.

I'm sorry for your situation. I can't imagine how awful it must feel. I really feel that you need professional help with this particular problem. Explain it to your GP and I'm sure that he/she can recommend someone to help you and your son.