Employer mumnetters - would you even shortlist someone for a job if...

[monkeytrousers]

...they had a good degree but no qualifications to speak of from school?

I was a very good student at school but was bullied so missed a lot in my final two years and left with hardly anything. Now I have a good degree but because of my history no GCSE's or A levels. I've been applying for so many jobs - all of which I'm qualified for - but haven't been short listed for any of them. I'm literate, which is hopefully obvious from my applications. Is it this or am I being paranoid?

Oh FFS!

I just got declined for interview for the last of the ten jobs I applied for last month. I am out of ideas, feeling sorry for myself and obvioulsy destined to work in a fucking pub for the rest of my life!

Monkeytrousers, can I ask what sort of sector you are applying in?
I recruit to graduate-level posts in HE every so often and I personally would want to see a convincing explanation for the lack of school qualifications. If the explanation was there and the person was in more relevant respects (eg degree subject, relevant experience) suitable for the job...I'd shortlist them and expect to cover the issue at interview.
I agree the discrepancy between performance pre- and post- 18 would attract my attention but I would not necessarily write you off!
Ask for feedback. Hopefully you will get some honest ideas as to what is going slightly awry here.

Arts admin Marina - but what should I put on my CV? Should I say I came from a disadvantaged background and was bullied so missed a crucial time at school?

We shortlist from those monster public sector application forms monkey, where the yawning gap would be unavoidable. In that sort of situation I'd expect to see a little note saying, "please see covering letter for details" in that space.

I would be frank about it in your covering letter, tbh.

I know from experience (my sister's especially but I work in arts education) that getting into a regular job in the arts is a stressful near-tombola
Even now Monday's Guardian makes me jittery.

Do you think that being honest about the school record and why you could not do well

does still allow you to accentuate the positive because you returned to education and
got your degree despite those difficulties?

To me that looks like someone with drive and determination as well as intellectual ability.

MT, sorry have only scanned thread but think MorningPaper is on the right track - trumpet the degree first, then a spot of vagueness. Did you actually take the GCSEs and A Levels? Or have you no formal quals apart from the degree? For the vacancies I have been responsible for filling (admin in an architects' office) the fact that someone can write in sentences and sticks to a uniform format throughout their CV is so important that I really don't think I'd notice schooling, OR would at best be intrigued and want to know more about that.

btw, I have tended to give feedback to all candidates and think it entirely reasonable for you to call a company if you weren't invited to interview so that you can find out what the people who were interviewed had/did/said on their application that you didn't.

I've always been told by friends in high powered jobs to avoid anything negative in an application, but after this experience, I'm just going to have to change my strategy and do this.

I have asked for feedback but as yet it's unforthcoming.

Thanks for your imput

At the moment I feel like Yosser from Boys from the Blackstuff; "gis a job, I can do that, go on, gis a job"

Hi Lio, I left school with a could of CSE's and RSA II in typing. I know that the better jobs I was applying for had applicants in teh hundreds so it's probably like someone said further down, they are looking for a negative not to shortlist you rather than a positive to give you a chance.

Looking for a job is SOOOO demoralising

Since you have nothing to lose, I would say that turning the negative into a positive is a good plan to try - when have more time maybe I can think of a great way to point out how brilliantly you have done, given the bad time at school (actually that is prob not nec, since you are easily one of the most literate MNers there is )

ta lionheart Straight back atcha!

Personally I would avoid explaining the "gap"

What are people asking for exactly, that you have to give this information?

Are you applying by CV or application form? There is NO REASON that you need to say anything in your CV about your GCSEs and A-Levels, except what school you attended and the dates. (This is all I do, I have GCSEs/A-Levels)

What is extracting this information from you? Specific application forms?

I suspect that there is something else that is stopping you from getting shortlisted. I'd be happy to look at whatever you are sending if you want to send me a copy.

that was a couple of CSE's BTW. Don't want to do myself out of them

Cheers MP. These were all application forms where a CV was prohibited.

I put most of my energy into the bit where you sell yourself, and did each one seperately and to the job speck.

I'll see if I have any saved on this computer. I recently changed systems though so not sure if I have them on here. I'll CAT you soon though - defo with any new applications, if you don't mind.

If you do feel the need to explain it, I would suggest putting hte school and the dates as per MP's CV, then something like 'Having only gained poor academic results due to personal circumstances/bullying (whatever phrase you feel comfortable using) I was delighted to have my potential recognised by University X, going on to achieve ...'

Hmm, sounded better during the 3am feed

MT - I do a LOT of recruiting. A few things:

1. Never, ever lie on your cv. However good the reason, however insignificant it may seem, just don't do it. I am always willing to give someone a hearing if they have a good story; if someone has told a lie or embellished the truth I do not believe one other thing they have said. I would probably discontinue the interview, and make it clear in the "recruiting community" why. (Mind you, I am recruiting lawyers so it is a big deal if one fibs on an application form). Also, I tend to think a fib on your cv makes you a bit shifty in interviews.

1. I actually think you potentially have a good story to tell. You have triumphed over adversity. I get a lot of "cookie cutter" cvs - anything that stands out is a good thing. If I were you I would talk up the way you have turned round a bad experience and made it a positive one - that can be much more important than actual A levels, as it demonstrates real skills and attitude. Do not apologise for being bullied - show how you have dealt with it.

1. I like to see people with a good work ethic. I also check for gaps in cvs - are they being economical with the truth; have they had to retake a year; have they been in prison. So again if someone could demonstrate a good work ethic over a period of time, even if it is wholly unrelated to what they are doing now or want to do, it is a good thing - successful people tend to be successful at evrything they do. So talk up even small/menial jobs - what position of responsibility did you take; did you make suggestions to change the job; were you promoted etc - I like to hear all that.

Good luck!