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Parenting

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Original poster

It's me AGAIN. My DS is spiralling and I just do not know what to do...

57 replies

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:30

This is going to be very disjointed, but I'd appreciate any views.

DS1 is not an easy child (there was a long thread about this a few weeks ago). His teacher has been really struggling with him and today asked if she could temporarily move him to another class because he has been so bad this week.

He just doesn't listen to her, he totally ignores her in fact (to the point of being rude). Today DH went to fetch him, all the other children were lined up ready to go home. He was nowhere to be found.

Eventually he was found in another area of the school, showing some other children his guitar (today was show and tell). This is despite very firm rules from me to the effect that he was not allowed to take the guitar out of the classroom.

The teacher had asked him three times to pack up his things and be ready for hometimeand whilst she was getting the others sorted out he just disappeared out of the classroom.

When DH and the teacher finally found him, he just totally ignored the teacher i.e. he turned his back and walked away whilst she was asking him why he wasn't where he was supposed to be (in a very nice way). DH was mortified that our son could be so rude to an adult.

I just don't know what to do with this child. I have totally backed off from school (as per the Ed Psych's request) in the spirit of allowing him to find his own place and engendering in him a greater self respect and knowledge that we love him unconditionally.

This hasn't worked. It seems that unless I am nagging him day and night (and this has it's own set of perils) he just flounders.

For being so rude to his teacher and generally being a disruptive and rude to all around him today, we have told him he cannot attend a friends' party this afternoon. DH (I am at work) says he has just sat in one spot and said nothing since he was told this, he is totally silent and uncommunicative.

I am at work and trying not to stress about it, but I am starting to get really worried on a deeper level that something is wrong with my DS. He just thinks he is an adult and that he can speak to people out of the family home however he pleases. He would never, ever in a million years disrespect me like this.

Oh I dont know...

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Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:34

I should add that DS just cannot sit and do schoolwork with his peers. His teacher put him on his own table for a few days and he did much better. Once he was put back onto his table with three others all the fun and games started again. He talks constantly, disrupts the others (pulls their books, waves in their faces and on and on).

This in itself doesn't worry me. It's the total disrespect he shows for the teacher which I am concerned about. He just doesn't care what she says. He gets desparately upset if he thinks he is upsetting me, but it seems that nobody else is on his radar.

OP posts:

amynnixmum · 09/03/2007 12:35

Does he have a dx of any kind?

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:38

No Amynnixmum. He has been evaluated by an educational psychologist.

There is nothing untoward in her eval. He has above average IQ and is in general quite a sensitive little boy (not helped by the fact that I have always been a fairly pushy mum). For the most part she tags him as a normal child (with some self-esteem problems).

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amynnixmum · 09/03/2007 12:40

What do you think? My ds has no dx but I'm sure he's on the autistic spectrum and that this is a lot do do with the behavioural problems he has.

Soapbox · 09/03/2007 12:41

dejags - that sounds really hard for you all - and DS can't be having a ball either!

He sounds one unhappy boy as far as school goes. Is it just this teacher he lacks respect for, or is it all other adults?

What did the ed psych think of his behaviour?

I can only imagine how exasperating this must be for you all to deal with - I think you need professional help to get it sorted out - and soon

amynnixmum · 09/03/2007 12:41

sorry menat to add that our first ed psych was complete crap and didn't have a clue. Can you get him evaluated by a paediatrician?

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:42

I am scared to go down this route. What I mean is that I am scared of armchair diagnosis. I know precious little about the autistic spectrum.

DS1 is very verbal. He has no communication issues at all - in fact the opposite (he will look you in the eye and converse with you). He is incredibly articulate and outwardly confident too.

From the little I know - this seems at odds with Autistic spectrum behaviour and patterns?

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foxinsocks · 09/03/2007 12:44

hi dejags - what type of school is he at in SA?

(I was brought up there and my sis and her 3 kids are there at the moment) - perhaps he would do better in a different school environment?

is he like this at home with you or dh?

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:45

Thanks Soapbox. We are seeing a psych, but it's just not working. He is also lined up for Occupational Therapy (he has average fine motor skills which conflicts with a higher than average non-verbal IQ).

He isn't disrespectful to all adults, but, this is not the first time I have seen this sort of behaviour. He is just and old person in a young person's body. I don't think he means to be rude (well most of the time).

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Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:46

Foxinsocks - he is in the international school. We chose it because the classes are much smaller than average.

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amynnixmum · 09/03/2007 12:49

Ds is is confident, outgoing and articulate but he still had many asd traits and the paed said to deal with him using techniques designed for children on the autistic spectrum and they work for him. He's very unlikely to get a dx as he doesn't tick enough of the boxes but tbh it helps thinking that he doesn't actually mean to be naughty a lot of the time but gets confused and frustrated becuase he thinks a little bit differently to most people. It definately helps dh stay calm with him.

Bink · 09/03/2007 12:51

Have just done a search to find out how old he is - nearly 6, am I right?

I know just what you mean about other people not being on a child's authority-radar - my ds (nearly 8) has just certain people he respects (which, luckily, includes me) - as to others, it's feels completely random as to whether he decides he's going to comply or not. I too feel as if some people are "real" to him, and others are not.

What we have done recently, with his school, is just accept that my ds is not motivated in the "normal" way by adult approval/disapproval, and decide to approach it differently - with a version of the MN Pasta Jar. My ds is currently motivated by two things - food (not a good one to use!) and Money (which he wants to save or give to charity). So his school has created some counters which look like 10p pieces, and each time he acts up/messes around/isn't compliant a 10p gets moved from the credit jar to the debit jar (available, of course, to be earned back again by super-good behaviour) - he seems to completely understand the "realness" of that, and so far touchwoodtouchwood he has been behaving FAR better.

foxinsocks · 09/03/2007 12:52

aah ok. In my experience, most of the primary schools there are actually much stricter on discipline than most of the ones over here so was wondering if he was in a 'typical' SA school.

What do the school think?

Is he too old for incentives for good behaviour in class?

foxinsocks · 09/03/2007 12:53

x-post with Bink

Bugsy2 · 09/03/2007 12:53

dejags, my son aged 7 has recently been diagnosed with Aspergers. This is an autistic spectrum disorder, but is different to autism.
My DS can make eye contact & is reasonably sociable, but his sociability is just not the same as other children's. He lacks any sense of intuitive understanding of other children's moods, body language or subtleties of emotion. He can behave in just the way you have described about your son.
I do not want to suggest that your son has Aspergers, but you may want to try and get a child psychiatrist to meet him so that you could get a better insight into what makes him tick & how best to help him deal with his own behaviour.
Good luck.

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:54

Amy, I am starting to think that it's definitely out of the range of normal 5 year old behaviour.

I have tried everything.

Being strict and controlling
Being relaxed and allowing him his space to make his own mistakes
Being super involved in school
Being less involved in school

I have always thought we are at "fault" and that he is like this because of us. In the past few weeks we have gone to every length to make sure that his home life is normal as possible. Including diet (fish oils & vits), routine in the week, relaxing about the little things. It gets better for a few days than back to square one.

I don't feel like a failure anymore, I just feel as if I don't know him sometimes.

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Soapbox · 09/03/2007 12:56

Like you Dejags, I'm not too keen on armchair diagnosis

However, there are aspects of this that sound a little bit like Aloha's DS, who has recently been diagnosed as having dyspraxia.

The similarities are, being fiercely intelligent, behaving in an adult like way and preferring to socialise with adults over children, and motor skill issues.

Is this something that is being considered as a possibility?

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:58

Thanks Bugsy.

I am going to ask the therapist if she thinks this is a possibility. I think he will be labelled ADHD soon if we don't get to the bottom of this.

There has already been talk of medication (which I am vehemently opposed to!).

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amynnixmum · 09/03/2007 12:59

I know its scary but I really recommend that you get him assessed by a paediatrician. Our paed is fantastic and always listens to what we have to say. It made a big difference to my opinions being all but ignored in ds old school For me just knowing that it wasn't mu fault he was having problems lifted a weight from my shoulders and helped me find the energy to put the work into helping him in the way he needed.

I have to go out now but if you want to chat CAT me

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 12:59

It has not been considered Soapbox. But I think I will start pushing for a formal diagnosis.

I think I'll CAT Aloha for some more info.

Thanks

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Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 13:00

Thanks Amy. I will do.

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foxinsocks · 09/03/2007 13:00

aww dejags - I didn't realise he was only 5.

Is he in a class doing proper lessons as opposed to nursery type class?

He sounds like he's feeling overwhelmed in the classroom.

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 13:03

You are right Fox. He will be 6 in May.

He's just a baby - but he acts like a 10 year old and further compounded by being the tallest child in his class (the oldest child in his class is already 7).

He is just floundering. I feel so helpless to help him.

OP posts:

Bink · 09/03/2007 13:03

I should also say that my ds is somewhere in that range of Asperger's/dyspraxia/ADHD/language disorder, though in a "now you see it, now you don't" sort of way. The school which is being so imaginative with him is a specialist one.

So, just to say that the "alternative motivation" system we're using does seem to work with a child who is outside the normal range of behaviour.

Original poster

dejags · 09/03/2007 13:05

Thanks Bink. I think the teacher is ill-equipped to help him individually. She is quite young and I really believe that despite good intentions she doesn't have the experience to get down to working with him on an individual level (taking into account any pending diagnosis).

I am not being disrespectful of her - I am ill-equipped and I am his mum. So I can't imagine how difficult she would find him.

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