What makes us the mothers we are?

[mears]

Right, I am looking for inspiration once again to help me with my assignments. I am researching women's approaches to motherhood. Is there anything you thought about your owm child experience that you were convinced you would try and avoid as a mother?
In my case, I knwe my mum loved having babies (I do too) but I remember thinking that she didn't have an awful ot of time for us as we grew up (there were 5 of us). I was determined to show affection which she didn't. I had absolutely no problems with the baby stage but am aware that my I did not enjoy toddlerhood vey much. Tried to conquer that but probably not very successfully.
What about you lot. What were your demons of motherhood in relation to your own experiences?

I remember having this very conversation with my mother a few years ago. She had a list of things she wouldn't do because her mother had been a nightmare. My mother was always very relaxed and open minded about contraception, very surprising in a convert Catholic, until I discovered she had had an illegitamate baby at 19. She was also determined to allow us to dress exactly as we pleased, having been forced into 'appropriate' clothes which she hated as a child.

The only thing I, and all of my siblings, have sworn to avoid is having large families of our own. The Waltons is a romantasised version of large family life, in reality it's nothing like that at all. It's all about competiting for avaliable resources, be they financial, material or parental attention. You think 5 is bad? Try being one of 11!

My mother is absolutely perfect and we are both terrified of my grandmother (her mother), ie if she rings one of us rushes to make sure DS's cryign is not audible, and we lie about how often he is feeding in the night, etc. My grandmother thinks newborns should be left alone for 8 hours at night without adult contact. She fed my mother on cornflour and water when there wasn't any formula after the war in Berlin and she thinks babies don't cry (probably too weak to do so imo). That part was not really her fault maybe, but she put her children down constantly, compared between them constantly, and put her husband down in front of them - I'd hope to avoid all of those!

REally interesting discussion idea.

My mother suffers from depression but this seemed to have no impact on my childhood 'experience' at all, since although she had dips, she went into hosipital once when my sister was born, then started getting seriously ill (enough to be hospitalised regularly)when I was 15. I also had a very disabled sister who cried nightly for years. However, my mother was this amazing paradox of suffering from this illness that was awful for her (suicide attempts), but also being a really strong person and that's how I remember her. I do think that yu need your parents to be strong for you - and my mother was - looking after my sister for 40 years with little help (sorry - my dad was fantastic too). So, although she had difficulties, we never felt insecure. She was always there for us - quite an acheivement. It's only being a mother now that I realise how staggering that was and was she did.

She had had very difficult, traumatic teenage years and her mother was not a particularly warm person. Yet she was so loving towards us.

I really think her stoicism was significant in helping me deal with life and it's ups and downs. My father was also very good at explaining my mother's illness to us.

I remember that a teacher at school (when I was about 8) once said 'you must feel like your older sister gets a bit too much attention some times' (because she was handicapped) and being totally aghast! It had never occured to me. My mother had united her family really well and we adored our sister and perfectly understood that she needed plenty of help!

If I could pull of the childhood my parents gave me (and I face none of the difficulties they did) I would be very happy. I think the key personally is spending as much time together as you can and talking as much as you can.

If I'm half the mother mine was/is I will be doing well.

Well mears my mother didn't show me any love so at least once a day I tell ds twins I love them and what good boys they are! She was also handy with the slipper despite the fact I wasn't particularly bad so I never smack my boys. I also hope I can be a fun mum that takes interest in what they want to do and encourages them to do what makes them happiest. And most of all I never want them to feel a complete failure at everything.

becoming a new mother was easier than i thought because my mother and mil told me when they had there first my mothers case only they freaked because they didnt have a clue what to do and told me if i ever started feeling like this just to call them day or night they didnt care so even though it was hard it was nice to know that there was always the voice of experiance and god didnt i use it never called in the night called the next morning for anything from night feeds to colic so i guess that helped me being a new mum alot knowing i wasnt the only one to feel useless because i didnt know the difference between hunger and nappy cry in the end i was told to start from the bottom and work to the top took longer but it worked and i stopped feeling so useless as a mother

Having to wait 1/2 hour outside the Halifax for my Mum to get me.

But ditto Jasper!

I often moan about my mum. Since having children of my own I find it hard to understand why she did some of the things she did, but I also wonder how she coped so well with some of the things she did. I try to accept that she is a human being with faults like any other. Overall she was a wonderful mum, and in many ways we are closer now than ever.

One thing I try to do differently is that I never remember my Mum playing with us as small children. She was a 'housewife' (as sahms were called in those days! Oh how I hate that term!) so around all the time, but I never remember her sitting down playing with us. My dad did, occasionally (only because he wanted to play with our toys!), but not my mum. I try and spend lots of time with my children - playing, reading, outings...just cuddling, being close, whatever. It frightens me how quickly the time is passing with my children and I want their memories to be happy ones.

I also try and be more careful about how I speak to my children. My parents, and my mum, in particular, had (and still has..) the ability to crush me with a few words. I praise my children a lot more than she ever did, and avoid critisising.

Otherwise I can't think of anything else. Those were the 2 things that came to mind immediately.

I'll second that, in that one of my main issues is to avoid criticism and also to show plenty of affection. My Mum makes no bones about the fact that she was never especially maternal and that in family matters her husband was number 1, whereas like you, dejags, I feel that my children are my no.1 priority ( although dh does get a look in!).

Stupidgirl, you have written exactly what I would have said, my mum loves us, but as 5 of us had little time to play with us, treated other siblings differently, and was obsessed with housework...admitted she wasn't very maternal (do wonder why she managed to have 5 children though if wasn't maternal..)..I couldn't manage with more than 2 as want to give them all the love and affection I never had and find it hard to share that between many people...does that make any sense?)btw we have a messy, lived in house but spend time with children, something my mother wouldn't have tolerated as very tidy person!

Interesting Josie, I seem to remember major media storm over Fergie leaving her baby to join her dh overseas. She said something like 'my place is at my husband's side'. Whereas everyone else seemed to think she should have stayed with the baby. For me, ds definitely comes first (hope dh hasn't worked out my chat name)!

Lavender, I have a messy house too. My standards have raised slightly recently (!) but it's low priority. I'd rather spend the time with my children.

It's funny though, as far as family size goes, I'm the opposite. I'm one of 2, my mum wanted more but wasn't young when she had us so decided to stop at 2. She herself was one of 6 and my dad one of 4. Having grown up alongside a sister who I never got on with, I desperately want a big family so my children don't suffer that. My parents families have their problems (which appear to be worsening as they get older, sadly) but I would still rather have a big family than the agonies of just 2...

For me, most of my childhood was based on negative discipline. Name calling, over reactions, and very little encouragement, though plenty of pressure to 'get it right' (whatever the 'it' at that time was!)
When my step-father came along, my mum turned our back on us totally - she no longer devoted the same time she used to, to us (in the early days she was quite creative and hands on, but that changed). We no longer ever received praise or physical comfort, or love. We felt hated! He abused me physically (even before they got married, he fractured my knee cap,) he went on to fracture my jaw and give me head injuries and also attempted to suffocate me, amongst many other things (most of these injuries were discovered at a later date, as I wasn't allowed to seek or receive medical attention), emotionally, mentally (extreme control over every aspect of my life), and possibly sexually (this may sound a strange comment to make, but my sister and I are discussing our childhoods a lot at present, and some supressed nasties are coming to the surface, for both of us.)
:mears, please excuse my rambling, it seems a lot of this wants to get out here and now!:
My mother wont admit what he did, possibly even to herself, and we no longer have contact.
The effects of this on me as a mother are,
.careful selection of my husband! He's a gentle giant, and I couldn't have had children with anyone else. I trust him.
.Initially an over protectiveness, which verged on major anxiety and depression. I've had to work hard to move away from these feelings in order to allow my DD to have a normal life, eg. enjoying creche and the company of other adults and children.
.Very positive parenting (IMO ). NO smacking, or physical restraint of any form (unless to avoid danger!), and no shouting apart from the same exceptions. We don't make an issue of minor issues.
.A lot of physical contact such as kissing and cuddling, a lot of encouragement and praise.
.As much time doing activities such as reading, drawing, painting, sticking, making, etc. as possible!
.Making extra efforts to make my DH's family as much a part of my DD's life as possible - they are a great family.
.Always giving DD the respect of offering an explanation for why she may not be allowed to do certain things.
.Oh, and if my DD ever came to me to say that someone who is meant to hold a caring and responsible role in her life had treated her badly - God (or whoever) help that person!!
-She will always receive the utmost respect, love and care that my DH and I can possibly give

I have no idea if any of this is any help. But thanks for the opportunity to waffle on!

stupidgirl, I know the predicament you are in so imagine having more children isn't as easy as it sounds, but if it was an ideal situation would you have any more? I have 4 sisters and get on well with 2, the other 2 not as well, but would you be able to handle not giving them the attention, as more than 2 sounds like hard work...emotional involvement must be harder the more children you have?...do you really want more than 2?

stupid girl i dont think it matters how many children you have if they dont get on they dont get on i was a only child and my partner came from a family of five and out of all of them he gets along with one brother where as i was an only child i had lots of cousins which was great because i could escape them where as if they were my brothers and sisters i would have been stuck with them
my flat aint a realy messy but you can certainly see it everywhere you look i used to panic about keep the flat clean when ds was first born then i thought stuff it i can clean any time hes only young once

....and attention. As in paying attention to her needs as an individual, asking her about her day (though she's under two, she enjoys chatting about her friends and places she's been )
We've also decided that one of us (either DH or I) will always be a SAHP, at least until DD and her future siblings are at school full time.
(I'll shut up now! )

levanna i was just reading your post and on one hand i want to say how sorry i am for what you went through as a child but on the other hand i want to smile that things have worked out so well for you now in your relationship and a beutiful dd
and i think that would be a god post to start how did you feel having a child even if you had the worst upbringing and how has it affected relationships now for you

Yes, mummytojames, I grin like an idiot nearly all the time - see?! I really do. If anything, maybe my childhood has enabled me to really, really enjoy the wonderful life I have now, and to avoid all those pitfalls with my child, and make her happy. I know I'm gushing, and of course there are those odd problems we all encounter, but in comparison....well, you know!

Levanna ... totally agree with mummytojames .. it is wonderful that you are so upbeat and positive and such a great mummy after such a terrible childhood ... Hugs to you ...
In terms of my own mother. She was and still is the best mum in the world and like Jasper I feel that if I am half as good a mum as she is then I am not doing badly. She is also a fantastic grandma ... and it is a physical ache for me that I live on the other side of the world to her.
She was utterly selfless ... never got cross with us for waking her in the night ... was always at home for us ... always ready to listen ...
I don't remember her ever playing with me though ... getting down on the floor and tumbling about like I do with DS ... and I don't remember her ever reading me a story ... I believe it is a generation thing ... she was a housewife - if we wanted to play we had to play with eachother ... she was busy washing and ironing and cooking etc. I leave all of that because I would rather play with DS than do the ironing
Because Mum was such a good mum I did feel very inadequate as a first time Mum when DS was born ... and partly it was because I felt I had a lot to live up to in terms of my own mum. I also felt I had let her down when it was discovered I suffered from PND. It wasn't until DS was 6 months old that she admitted to having similar feelings when we were little but 'in my day, Post Natal Depression didn't exist. We had to get on with it.'
I think that there are definitely things I will do differently though ... especially when my children are teenagers. I hated the '... because I said so, because I am your father ...' type of parenting that my dad had. I was never allowed to do what my friends did and was never given (IMO) a good enough reason why. "While you are living under my roof ... " blah blah blah etc etc drove me insane and led to me being grounded for most of my teenage years ....
I hope not to just lay down the law when my children are older but to tell them why and negotiate with them ...
Sadly I see DH doing the 'Do as you are told because I said so ... ' thing with DS and I hate it!!!!

Yeah, I really, desperately want more children, despite the practicalities. I would love at least 4. I know that's not a guarantee, but I feel at least there would be a kind of buffer. I dream of those idyllic images of the big noisy family round a big farmouse kitchen table (not that I have a big farmhouse kitchen...!). I would have more tomorrow if I could.

Yes, I promised myself that I would be the total opposite of my mother. We get on as adults, but she was the most awful mother to me. I get a certain nasty sense of satisfaction when my ds throws his arms around me, as I know that it makes her feel something. Not sure what, but she always looks away from me and ds. I am strict with ds, and sometimes do hear my mum's voice creeping in. However, we have a fantasitc relationship, and he is a bright, happy and confident child. I feel that dh and I cannot have done too much wrong so far.

Mears, you asked about feeling inadequate as a new mum? My mother and one of my sisters made me feel very inadequate. Really bossed me about, harangued me about all my decisions, everything I (and dh) did was wrong, apparently. Really stupid things like having a bath seat (suitable for newborns, FFS) insead of a baby bath. And taking him in the bathroom where there are nasty germs, instead of in the sitting room with a bath on a stand. Very upsetting at the time. And very sad as pre-birth had been extremely close to them. Ds is the first grandchild so I'd expected this to bring us even closer together. Am now rebuilding relationship with mother (8 months later) but don't know what's going to happen with my sister.
Having said all that, I do want to be the same kind of mother as mine in lots of ways. Was always clear that she put us first and that we were loved. Also had lots of fun, made up lots of silly games, talked to us as if we were grown ups about important things (feminism and human rights, for instance) instead of talking down to us. And she taught us to question authority (including her. Don't think she spotted the mistake until we were bolshy teenagers). She was never the sort of mother who was irritated by us making a mess, more important to play and have fun. And handed on lots of family stories. Oh, and we were lucky enough to know lots of interesting adults through her, lots of elderly people who had done fascinating things, people from different backgrounds (not quite dustmen to dukes but close). And we got to talk to them instead of being told to go off and play and leave the grown ups alone ... we were kind of included.
Will do some things differently: no smacking (I hope, can still remember the humiliation); make sure ds does his homework; hopefully not move house as often so ds doesn't have to keep starting a new schools and making new friends (although that's probably taught me something useful).

Fascinating thread!

I wonder what all our children would say in years to come. Best not dwell on that!!

I have a really good relationship with my mam but there are a few things i will try to do differently.

The three most important will be, not to criticise even tiny things, my mam does and has always done this alot. I think it's a character trait rather than directed at me.

Another thing is not to constantly refer everything to another sibling! I have an awful memory of buying a dress at 15ish,(was chubby and self concious), and my mam saying, "Oh that would look lovely on your sister". HOW insensitive?!!!!!!!!!!

My third is pretty specific, not to move to another country where my dd does not speak the language at the age of 12/13 !

Also, i hope i make dd feel as though this is OUR house where she has the right to bring freinds back. I was hardly ever allowed and when i was it was a hassle!

One thing i also remember, as a REALLY vivid memeory, was sitting in the car waiting for my mam to come out of the bank. I was 7ish and my sister would've been 9. A lady walked past and we smiled and waved and she gave us a filthy look!
I vowed then at that early age, I will always be nice to kids when i grow up!
Honest! It's just one of those defining moments