Mornings - miserable

[bridalBOM]

Does anyone else have mornings which start out nice then defend in to screaming and shouting? I don't think I can bear it anymore. Not that I have a choice.

I feel sad that she will remember this when she's older as her daily experience. She's almost eight now and after years it's not getting any better. She's with her dad a couple of days a week so I feel happy that she has that time away from me but also sad that she seems happy to get ready round there and her time with me is so fraught.
It's usually something like not liking what she's wearing that sets her off. Then I'm just looking at the time, panicking we'll be late. I ask her nicely and calmly and remind her what she needs to do in bite sized instructions, but it doesn't work and the only time she actually gets ready is ten minutes before we leave and after a huge rant/shout/threat from me. I shout so loudly it's disgusting, but it is the only thing she responds to.
Then she feels bad and I get this sweet apologetic sucky up child that just makes me feel awful.

I think it's once in every two weeks that this doesn't happen and we have a nice morning.

I wonder if it's because I went back to work when she was a few weeks old and I've always been busy in the morning. Maybe it's because she's always been at her dads a couple if days and we've never got in to a routine... But it's so sad. I do love her but I just don't enjoy her at all anymore.

One thing that works for us is no tv etc until they've had breakfast and are ready, could you try that?

If she doesn't like what she has to wear, could you both sort out her clothes the night before so that you know she's happy with them?

It is miserable when its like that - same in this house . It sounds like you are blaming yourself though so I just wanted to post to say my 2 DCs are exactly like this (only put shoes on if we are having screaming nervous breakdown etc) and I was at home with them for the first 2 years and we live in a nuclear family - nothing to do with you having gone back to work etc.

Thanks both. Queen - do you worry about how they'll turn out?

We stopped TV a year ago and now all get up and have a family breakfast together before getting dressed etc. we laid her clothes out for a while but it caused more conflict because she would change her mind over night. So then not only do we have to find an outfit to wear but we have the whole tantrum of not wanting to wear the first outfit. For the first month or so I would just wrestle her in to it but we are both quite strong so inevitably one of us would get hurt - cue more screaming. I just waved her off at the gate and she mouthed "sorry" to me with such a sad little face and I couldn't even manage a smile. I mouthed sorry back and "it's okay" but I know I didn't look convincing. And now a nine hour day she's of me

She was writing in a notebook all the way to school and wouldn't let me see. I hope it's not some story about what a shite mum I am to show her teacher.

Eight years... When does it end?

What does she say when you talk about it? Not at the time obviously, but when later on in the day, when you're getting on well and things are calm and you ask her about the mornings, does she give any clue what it's like from her perspective and how she finds it?

If she says sorry she obviously is upset it's not going well, and just wondering if she's able to tell you what it is that gets her so upset in the morning, and maybe if you try and pass the power to her - let her pick the morning routine, it might help?

I find it really sad that you say you don't enjoy her at all anymore - do you mean just in the morning or all the time? Do you think maybe she can sense this and it is making things worse?

She just says she doesn;t want to talk about it anymore. She usually says something like "okay I get it, Can we just drop it now” and if I carry on she just changes the subject or runs away.

Your last paragraph is what worries me to be honest.

The morning routine is Breakfast first. Then get dressed, brush teeth, make bed. She can do those three things in any order she likes or, if she asks me which she should do first, I tell her. She’s almost eight, surely three basic tasks like that should be doable?? She likes to come in to my room and get dressed with me which is fine too. But then. Like this morning, she just sits on the bed chatting and I’m constantly saying “yes, but get dressed now!” she ignores me and then it just goes downhill from there because her trousers will be too tight... or not tight enough... or her socks are scratchy, or her hair is poofy...
We do have enjoyable times together I guess. But they are few and far between. It’s just so tense all the time.

Get dressed before breakfast? Bed making and teeth cleaning are perhaps not quite so urgent.

Get her an alarm clock that goes off 10 mins before time to leave.

Explain what will happen if she's not ready in a calm time the day before.

If not ready in time leave without breakfast and in pjs if necessary (take an outfit in a bag she can change into later to give to the teacher (having asked them first of course)).

Give her back the responsibility of getting ready in time. She may surprise you. (After a few days of embarrassment/hunger!).

I'd say her responses to you (okay, let's drop it) etc, would indicate there clearly is something that is bugging her but she doesn't want to discuss it. Perhaps she thinks it will just end up in arguments again.

You mention she's in your room chatting - that is a nice thing (although not at the best time!) so maybe that is her time when she feels closest to you, even though it's probably the worst time of the day she could pick for this?

Is it worth setting up a day (at the weekend) where she gets to pick and decide everything (lovebombing?) - what to eat, what to do, etc and you just drop the burden of responsibility and just go along with her, focusing on her likes and trying to squeeze in as many cuddles (despite her protestations) that you can.

Not saying it will help your morning routine, but it might help you both start to reconnect without you having to be the 'boss' and ensure things need to get done, you can just be yourself and go with the flow and give her some responsibility.

Agree with pp that it could be worth just giving her the responsibility for leaving in time in the morning, saying you have to leave at 8:45am (or whenever) and if she's wearing pjs and havent brushed her teeth, so be it (take bag with jammies and toothbrushing stuff with her to school).

Agree that you won't nag her at all in the morning, you won't tell her to get stuff done or remind her of the time, that mornings have been too tense, you don't like it and you're going to stop getting upset about it. But point out that at 8:45am, you will both be walking out the door (whether she's in pjs or not).

Hi OP,

Surely she's at school so how much can she change her mind about an outfit? It's school uniform and that's the only option..I agree no breakfast until dressed - dressed, washed and hair done as soon as out of bed.

I feel for you and know it can be testing but the only thing I can say is to stop the shouting. I know it's easier said than done but when she sees there is no reaction from you, she will get bored and stop this behaviour. It sounds like she is pushing and testing you to see when you snap - don't rise to it.

Have a think what would work for you in terms of stopping yourself to shout, a friend of mine manages to just shut out the whining and repeats herself over and over and over again.

That wouldn't work for me, I remove myself from the situation if I think I'm going to boil over. Leave her upstairs, go downstairs put the radio/music on and take some deep breaths.

Then I agree with the other poster, take her to school in her pjs and threaten to take her into the classroom unless she gets changed. If she refuses to get changed in the car, take her into school in her pjs and tell the teacher she refuses to get dressed in the mornings. She will get dressed next time - she will not want a class of her friends staring at her in her nightwear!

I would also sit down with her and say the morning routine is making you very upset and you love her and don't want to carry on like this. Don't say too much, ask her why she won't get dressed in the mornings and what would she like you to do to make things easier for her. Almost, give her a feeling of control over this initially and see what happens from there.

Then if nothing changes, stop the shouting and put the 'OK, we're going anyway dressed or not' plan into action. It will be very boring for her to keep disobeying a calm, serene mother who is not getting angry and flustered by her actions.

Good luck - are you on good terms with Dad? Can you make sure the routine is consistent at both houses and get him to support you - this will help a lot.

I have one that can argue her way out of a pepper bag over which item of school uniform she will design to wear today. This can come down to socks/tights/trousers/skirts. Some will be too itchy, too baggy, too tight, too long, too sky blue pink with yellow spots. It drives me wild.

Then we have the argument about which coat/gloves/hats/ scarf v snood/bag/snack/shoes v boots/hairstyles.....I could go on!

However, I now say if you don't get ready you will be late. And sometimes we have been late because she wouldn't get ready. And she doesn't like that, because she loves school

So that has been much more beneficial in the long run.

Paper bag and deign to wear. Bloody ipad. It's as bad as dd being awkward!

Thanks everyone, I really do appreciate all the advice. Maybe I’m just feeling sad but I can’t see any of it working. They don’t have a uniform at school so she can literally wear what she likes.
We have tried the whole “It’s your responsibility to get ready and if you don’t then we’re leaving as you are” thing. But how do you make her leave? She’ll just say no. Then we’re back to brute force to get her out of the door.
She’s incredibly strong willed. Her dad and I have talked and he does say he’ll try the same routines, but inevitably they don’t continue for longer than a couple of days.
I would love to remove myself and go to another room but I just look at the clock ticking away and see what little time we have left and if she doesn't get ready then we're late for school, then I'm late for work.

The whole thing is just hell. Every. single. day. And the worst thing is knowing she must be as unhappy as me and not being able to do anything about it.

Do you worry about the level of arguements orangeanddemons ? I could put up with all of it if I could have a crystal ball that showed her to turn out normal and not scarred from years of screaming day in day out.

Well, the arguments have calmed down a bit under the new regime.

No, I don't like them, and I hate sending her to school upset, but I don't think they scar her for life. She just and awkward little madam.

However, I shudder to think what it would be like if she didn't have a uniform. Can't your dd choose what to wear the night before? Or get her to get dressed before her breakfast.

Everyone I know shouts at their kids in the mornings tbh. They all hate themselves for it, but it still happens.

It does sound as if she is pushing your buttons a bit.

Could you arrange to go into work a bit later and try the method of being late for school. If you're rushing to go to work, then maybe that is what she is picking up on.

I know this is damned if you do, and damned if you don't!

It does feel a bit like that. She would t care if she was late, she just blames me!

She is also an awkward little madam. We pick an outfit the night before, lay it all out nicely, then she changes her mind by the next day!

My ds is 8 and a flipping nightmare in the mornings.
Until I started using a timer for everything, now everything's a game to beat the timer, eat breakfast and drink juice 5 minutes, brush teeth and wash 5 minutes , get dressed 5 minutes, put coat scarf hat gloves on 2 minutes. It's great and I don't have to nag him anymore.

Ooooh a timer! Good thinking. That may be my last ditch attempt!

I think there's an app for the school mornings somewhere.

Does it do them for you???

i hate the mornings too i feel like a drill sergeant barking out orders to three small people, two of which are busy being octonauts and the third starts daydreaming about two minutes into every task.

dp takes them thankfully but its all he does - he usually appears about five minutes before time to go and the adds to the chaos hunting for his keys/phone/glasses/shoes - some how this is everyones elses' fault :l

when they all finally go (late) i usually end up sitting on the edge of the sofa nursing my (cold) cup of tea feeling like a trauma victim.

every. day.

i have seen my local tescos are recruiting for staff - hours 6am till 9.45am i have never seen anything more tempting in there in the history of ever including cake - seriously considering it...

Planning is key.

She has to have everything prepared the night before - bags packed and checked, outfit/hair clips etc chosen and NO changes alowed (unless it unexpectedly snows or something like that). You have to be firm and calm about that. She may try to kick off but stick to 'the rule'. She will soon find it fun to consider carefully and plan the night before. Can you plan some outfits and photograph them for her to select from? A bit like a fashion show board? She may enjoy that. Or find a school wit a uniform!

Realistically plan times for: getting up and to the loo, washing, dressing, breakfast, brush teeh, out etc and build in a sneaky 15 mins.

You need to keep calm and use subtle bribery. If she gets pocket money then you say to her 'you are a big girl now, so instead of getting it like a baby, now you will get it split into 5 packets of XXp. Every day you get to school on time you get the XXp. If you get there early, there's a bonus of 5p!'. Make it sound like a game. If she doesn't get homework just try a small amount of money - say 5 or 10p treat money per day she gets to school on time (a positive slant, so not 'for not being late').

You need to keep calm. The more worked up you get, the worse they act. They don't mean to, they aren't trying to upset you but its what they do! It is button-pressing at its most effective. We parents hate being late, but children really don't give a monkeys!

Don't react. If she is dawdling, remind her once that the XXp is dependant on her getting to school on time. You need to be super prepped yourself too though!

Make sure she gets enough sleep and is relaxed that she is fully prepped and ready to go in the mornings.

Good luck! We had this at its worst and now get to school early, have games and nice chats on the way and he gets to play with his pals before the bell. It took a little while but works well now. Ite key is keeping calm and almost blase - 'oh reading in the loo instead of brushing your teeth? What's that sound? Is that the sound of 50p jangling in my pocket as you won't get to school on time today?' Then its almost a game 'darn it! I thought you wouldn't make it today, thats another 50p I own you! Grrrrr!'

Maybe she has friends who you know get to school early for a chat/play and she wants to join in?

Dressed first, breakfast second. Teeth last. Bed if there's time to make it.

I'd tell her you aren't going to shout any more. She knows what to do, what to wear and what time school starts. You trust her to get ready by herself. Help her lay out clothes she chose the night before.

Then just wait until she's ready giving her all the time in the world, let her walk to school and sign in late.

I did this once with DS2 because all the telling in the world didn't teach him that time doesn't actually stand still for him. He genuinely seemed to have no concept that it kept moving, even if he didn't. Signing in late just the once was a big enough wake up call for him.

You could also say you love chatting with her and hate to ruin it by going on about the time, so how about saving chats for the way to school and leaving earlier so you can stroll and natter as you go. I used to do this and it was lovely. Much better than pushing them out the door and barking at them to hurry all the way to school.

What I still do is call upstairs with a time count down (15 mins to go, 10, 5 etc but these countdowns aren't quite true and usually have a surplus 5-10 mins added to them for faffing without screaming at each other before we actually leave the house.