My toddler is sucking the life out of me. Feeling very down

[bbface]

Ds, 2 years old. Defeats me most days. I just do not know where I am going wrong. I am full of love and affection for him, comes naturally, I don't think about it. I try to strike a balance between being a strict, consistent and loving parent. But it gets me no where. I am the mother you pass in the park whose child is having a screaming fit because he refuses to let go of another child's toy. And then you may pass me an hour later as you leave the park and yes, once again, my child is thrashing around on the floor, screaming blue murder because I spent five minutes telling him it was time to leave for supper and all the tasty things I was preparing, but all I get in response is screams and thrashes.

Out with coffee with friends with toddlers of similar ages. Yes, they occasionally have fizzes. My son? Every single frickin time he wails, squeals, shouts and is usually aggressive a couple of times. My friend said I had the patience of a saint. Little does she know that inside I am often boiling, and I do mean boiling, with anger and resentment.

I was desperate to be a mother, and know I wonder whether it was something that wasn't right for me.m I am 10 weeks pregnant, and scared senseless that I will have to deal with all this x2.

Dh supportive, kind of, but works away a lot.

Not sure what I am asking. Just feeling very down and totally incompetent. Why do I see so many mothers out with toddlers and occasionally one does see tizzes and tantrums, but not that often. For me and my ds, it is every bloody time we go out. I feel a shell of the person I was.

aw. Toddlers are hard work! I know that you compare yours to others but don't, they are all different, and certainly not in response to parenting, so - in case you are - don't bame yourself or feel you are necessarily doing something wrong.

your DS is just highly emotional, and good for you that he feels he can show these emotions instead of quelling them to please you. And maybe he is strong willed, and this again is all a necessary part of development and a good thing. Your relationship is strained because too often you both want different things, this is normal too and I totally agree, completely nightmarish when it results in meltdowns in public!

My DS is pretty chilled (at the moment, only at the moment) so I am afraid I don't have any advice about how to look after him - if that is what you want. But I didn't want to read and run. Know that you are a-ok though and 'this too shall pass'. It's not called terrible twos for nothing.

Feel free to come over to the UP thread if you want some advice, the ladies there are all going through testing times and we talk to each other to work out how best to deal with situations...

hth. Please don't beat yourself up... and DON'T think that any person passing you in the park is judging you; if they have had kids of their own they will only be feeling sorry for you! we know what 2 year olds are like :)

Looking after a stroppy 2 year-old is so much harder when you're pregnant. I remember crying with fear in my third trimester with DC2 when DC1 was only 17 or 18 months old. DC1 had the biggest screaming meltdown in the supermarket and I just had to leave my trolley there and walk away. You cope, you just do, and they change so much in such a short space of time at this age that what you spend your time worrying about now will have been replaced with something else in 4 months' time (sorry).

I have days where I wake up and it feels like Groundhog Day.

In practical terms, is DS signed up for pre-school when he turns 3, or do you have an option to send him to nursery for a couple of sessions before then? The Toddler Taming book has some quite good tips for this age - I found it useful.

You are not incompetent. You must try and play the long game here. Fortunes with respect to our DC's behaviour flip and reverse all the time I have learned. In a couple of years' time you may be the smug one, and then in a couple of years' time it may flip again. Don't see his behaviour as a measure of your competence, it's how you deal with it that counts.

Both such lovely thoughtful responses. Thank you so much, I really appreciate it.

We generally have lovely evenings and he sleeps so well, always has done. But the hours of 8 to 4 are bloody hard these days. He seems so defiant, and it really worries me.

My response is to talk and negotiate and love until I am blue in the face. And then I occasionally blow. Think shouting and man handling into his pushchair or car seat or dumping in his cot for a few injures time out. This iS not how I wish to parent, but honestly.... How on earth does one deal with a two year old point blank refusing to do something which needs to bo doing I.e. we need to put his top on! That sort of thing.

It is exhausting, and by the end of the day I do feel as though another little price of me has been flushed down the toilet. Dramatic, I know, but in many respect true.

Toddlers are hard work. Is it possible that you talk an negotiate too much with him? They aren't rational at that age and sometimes you just have to say no and stick with it. Negotiation might sometimes make them think they will eventually get their own way? It's not easy...toddlers can be very tiring.

Good point about the negotiation Es. Def worth considering.

Hi
I just wanted to say that 7 years ago I was you and it will pass. My DD was a nightmare 2 year old and no one could work out why. She is a delight to be with now and no 2 was the most chilled out toddler ever. You have all my sympathy, just remember it is not you and that it will not always be like this.

When my toddler lies on the floor screaming, if I even look at him, he thinks he has an audience and will continue. Ignore and he stops, then I distract but don't reward. They are all so different, depends on their strength of will, open mindedness and their ability to communicate. Does he speak much? Could he be frustrated? Or does he just like things a certain way?

The negotiation does not seem to get anywhere with my 2yr old and never did with my now 8 and 5 yr olds when they were 2. Once they are a bit older it gets a lot easier to negotiate and explain the reasoning behind what you are asking them to do. My 2yr old does not want to listen to any explaining and and will shout and stamp.

I don't know what the answer is to a stroppy toddler (? grit teeth and wait for it to pass) but just wanted to say it does pass

I have a 22 mo DS and he can be fairly trying at times. The tricks I have tried are:

1 - zero negotiation
2 - zero conversation when he is being stroppy
3 - 3 to 5 mins into strop attempt once at major distraction. If that does not work leave the physical space (if is safe for DC) for a few moments. If unsafe, pointedly do something very interesting yourself.
4 - talk loudly on the phone to someone and bring in some fake laughter - but No eye contact with DC.

5.I have also figured that over tiredness, hunger and thirst trigger things off more often than not.

6.If it is a simple battle of wills - don't give in, don't show frustration or despair. Carry on very happily with what you are doing.

Never doubt yourself - any public tantrums will bring you truck loads of sympathy from all us toddler-sufferers.

Hth

I had a very strong willed toddler. His tantrums were legendary. I could not ignore him, he would throw stuff. It was very very hard. He was also a bolter so I couldn't put him down anywhere, he would just run and run. I didn't go anywhere without walls for about a year

It passed, and he is now the most charming and thoughtful five year old you could ever wish to meet.

It sounds to me like you are doing a great job. Being pregnant with a toddler is harder than having a toddler and a newborn imvho.

It's called the terrible twos for a reason op!
My ds2 is very string willed and completely exasperates me at times.
But it won't last forever.
Repeat til hoarse....
"it's only a phase, it's only a phase"

Reasoning with a toddler is futile. 'Playful parenting' saved my sanity.

I recognise and sympathise with your predicament! But in my great experience of a 4 and 3 yr old, you just cant negotiate with a toddler. They are very black and white, and firm boundaries work best, even if it feels harsh. I can only just about negotiate with my 3 yr old, and even then she backs out on her half of the bargain pretty often! when will I learn

I really agree with holding back on the negotiations. Sometimes "because I said so" is actually valid - obviously better if you can say "we're leaving the park now because we have to shop for food for tea", i.e. give an explanation, but you have to regain a degree of control. So less "if you stop screaming and do what I say then X will happen/please stop screaming" and more "stop screaming and do what I say".

Preschool/nursery will help hugely - he'll follow the examples set by slightly older kids. And he'll have a surge of maturity and understanding suddenly and calm down a bit. But those boundaries have to be firmly in place.

I came on here not long ago when DS was being really testing (but now he is being lovely?! just goes to show...) because I felt at the end of my tether sometimes. I had wonderful advice. To summarise I had: make sure you have LOTS of time before you need to do anything so you aren't stressed when they don't get ready etc in the time you want; when you are reaching the end of your tether walk away and do something you like (I started walking off and making a cup of tea and scoffing a biccie, after which I had calmed down); let him do as much as he can/wants to - and if he goes out with his top on backwards and upside down but peaceful and chuffed with his efforts - who cares?! Even if he says point blank he won't wear a coat in the pouring rain, let him but take it with you :) Can he try to get into the pushchair himself yet? Maybe he just wants to do stuff himself?

Also I was asked if I know my 'trigger points', or what, in particular, would piss me off. Then when I worked this out i can know in advance/learn what will get my goat and end up in us 'fighting' and nip off for my kettle time before I blew and then got depressed for being a 'shite' (normal) parent.

Only thing I would say is - are you letting him KNOW that you know he is upset? I think this diffuses a lot; rather than me saying 'DS, you must do this' when he is upset, I say 'DS I know you are upset you have to do this, it is rubbish, I know' and have a pause for it to sink in and maybe a cuddle and sort of sometimes he is happier then, that he feels he communicated his feelings to me and I got them?

I also had: know that you are in no way alone in how you feel; and this too shall pass.

and being pg too?! arf, really, you are doing fine x

Totally agree about negotiation. Don't do it. He is to little to understand it, it gets you no where. Yes, I am all for them developing a sense of self esteem, ability to make choices etc, but a that age I don't think their brains are anywhere developed enough to use that level of rational thought.

Sometimes they just want to do what they want, regardless of how dangerous, annoying or tedious. A friend of mine, her son's dad tries to sit him down and 'discuss' how he is 'feeling'. The little boy is 3 and he just gets worked up into a bigger frenzy by this kind of technique. Utterly counterproductive I think and a massive drain on the adults involved.

my DS is the same. always has been. everything has always been a battle. he's going to be 3 next month, and no let up in the tantrums.

on the plus side, 7 week old DD is a dream baby so far. hope you get the same with DC2!

Wow, you have all given me serious food for thought. And I do not say that lightly!

ok, so it would seem that the consensus is negotiation is out. Thing is, that it does quite often work for us. But when it doesn't, he simply does not listen to me laying down the law in a 'we are leaving now. Period'. So I feel nervous at the thought of dropping it as a tool.

Thing is, I grew up in a family where there was no negotiation whatsoever. And you know what? It was a very happy childhood indeed. We totally knew our boundaries. I wish I could call upon my mum now actually, but she passed away 6 years ago.

Anyway, I digress. Point is that it goes against my grain to negotiate with a toddler, but because I often have success with it, I am loathe to let it go. But, and it is a huge, massive, quivering BUT, I am clearly doing something wrong, and I am not being a martyr when I say this. If you saw us in the park, playground, shops, you may well sympathise with me but I am almost certain that most of you would be alarmed at the scene and not relate to the intensity of it. My boy is very very strong-willed and plain defiant. He just does not seem to 'get' that he is not the boss.

Having carefully read all your responses (which I really thank you all for), I am going to cut down on the negotiation and be a bit more 'because Mummy said so and that is final'.

Can I just add that my boy is a darling. He is so affectionate and loving, funny and downright adorable (yes, he is tucked up in bed fast asleep!)

i do choices that aren't really choices eg. do you want to leave now or in 5 minutes? then give them 2 minute warnings.

works until they cotton on.

agree. no negotiation.

if they argue they get a stare and an eyebrow raise. or an explanation.

when it's up for discussion then i do the negotiation technique.

because sometimes i don't mind them having a say.

a bit of variation is good. but when i say no, it is ALWAYS no. unless they can think of a very good reason.

good luck. it does get easier.

You have my sympathy - it is a tough phase in parenthood, there's no denying.

There's no simple way of tackling tantrums as all children are different and the reasons for the tantrums are obviously widely varying. I try all kinds of tactics dependant on the type of tantrum and the circumstances.

Distraction (Oooh, look over there - quick - is that Mr Tumble?/ Wow, look what I've just found in my bag) - Good for quickly nipping potential meltdowns in the bud in public places.

Ignoring - good for those stamping, gnashing and yelling strops at home. ('No, you're not having another biscuit now.') Walk away and carry on whatever you're doing. If the tantrum starts to wane a bit try the distracting thing.

Cuddles - good for tired meltdowns. Firm holding, moving away from whatever is the cause of the tantrum and talking calmly. When the tantrum wanes and you can feel your child's body start to relax and there's just crying you can console and cuddle - but don't give in on whatever issue caused the tantrum.

My daughter who is now six used to have some stonking tantrums. One time in the supermarket she flung herself on the floor and tantrummed herself under the shelves. I had to pull her out by the leg and carry her out under my arm, snot and tears (hers) flying. I just ignored all the stares/sympathetic looks from other shoppers and staff.

My two year old daughter is just entering tantrum land and promises to blow like a volcano.

The most important thing to remember when your kid is chucking a wobbly is to just stay calm and not to shout or get angry with them. Stand firm and don't try to negotiate, but do give lots of cuddles when the tantrum is over.

I hope the phase is a short one for you, bbface :)

Worth giving the playful parenting book a read as well for some other ideas, eg 'yes wouldn't it be great if you could have an ice cream now, a huge one with sprinkles on the top. I wish I could too'. Totally foxes them, and sometimes takes the force out of the 'no you can't have one because it's lunch time in 5 minutes' explosion!

By negotiation do you mean bribes? Because they work! Not necessarily the first thing I would try though, I would save for when I really need to get them to do stuff.

Tbh a lot of it is down to the child's personality, so there might not be a way to eliminate all the tantrums right now, and it doesn't mean you have failed if you can't. But you might be able to find a better way to try to deal with it, that makes you feel less crap when it doesn't work!

Agree with claud. I am a softy mama but yep, no negotiation :) Like, i will let DS know that I know he is upset about what he has to do, and empathise with him, but he still has to do it! I do believe it is good for toddlers to know that you are in charge. not in a bullying or unkind way, at all, but it makes them feel secure in a changing world AND stops me repeating myself which drives me crackers :)

Hey, just wanted to add have you read 'French Children don't Throw Food?' It's not a a parenting manuel but it's interesting about boundaries. I have a defiant 3 yr old (but he's more plain disobedient than has tantrums). I have found that for some odd reason he nearly always responds to the do this by the count of 3 thing. I've always been a stickler for firm boundaries, my mum told me once 'never make a threat you won't or can't carry through' and I think it's very good advice.

Also I'd like to add to what everyone else said that it sounds like you're doing an amazing job in difficult circumstances and some kids are just tricky at different stages nothing to do with your parenting (how else would you explain why some kids within the same family are easy peasy and others are more challenging). Best of luck with the new baby (number 2 is wonderful!).

My dd is almost two and very very strong willed. I dont have any answers but am sending you sympathy and

By the way, can I also offer another perspective to those of you with, ahem, strong willed toddlers? That kind of perseverance, a couple of years on from where you are now, makes them stick at learning new skills (eg swimming) even when it gets tough, so they can then rightly be very proud of their achievements when they progress. Doesn't help you now mind