Tell me some good stuff about having a toddler and a newborn (please...).

[luckysocks]

DS is nearly 3, DD is 5 weeks.

I am going a little mad.

Just returned from visiting PILs. I am hot and flustered (and smelly ) and starting to wonder what I've done.

Physically, there's been no time to recover from what was a difficult birth, or even to process it really, and I'm on my third UTI with a really nasty stomach virus over the weekend just to break it up a little. I'm exhausted and generally wrecked.

I'm grieving the relationship I had with pfb DS and he's really starting to play up, particularly when in company (such as lovely but slightly judgy PILs) or when I'm feeding DD. He's also become incredibly clingy this week and my evenings tend to be torn between DDs need to cluster feed until 11pm and DS standing at his door crying 'mummy mummy mummy snnuuuuuggggle' which breaks my heart.

Despite wishing it didn't, breastfeeding stresses me at the best of times. I don't find it easy and I find it embarrassing having to get my boobs out whenever I need to feed my baby, regardless of where I happen to be. So this is exacerbated by DS going slightly loopy every time she's feeding.

I read two shoes...no hairbrush and it made me feel less alone, but didn't do anything to make me feel any more upbeat!

There have been a couple of threads on this subject recently so at least I know it's not just me. But I'm sinking and I need some positives to keep me going, can anyone help?! I hope they'll get on and that will be lovely but... that seems like light years away.

Can't offer much in the way of advice but I will have a similar situation in about 8 months time so am interested in tips too!

My rational head tells me you are still in the early days of this and it is new to you all and will take some adjustment. Your DS is bound to be feeling a bit unsettled but, long-term, it is a good thing for him.

erm, if you can live through it you can cope with anything?

Thanks puffpants!

Lubilee I know exactly what you mean about routine for DC2. And most of the time, I sort of hurtle through the day without any real clue who slept or ate when.

I noticed DS's lower teeth today and they've got yellow plaque lines around the bottom. His trousers were too small and his top was too big. :( I just feel so shit at this at the moment.

I'm wishing the time away too, which is pants.

reikizen - ha. That almost got a smile out of me (there's no grimace emoticon :) )

We had a very similar HV moment! They must see more naked dishevelled toddlers than I realised :)

Right. Positives.

1. DS is still really excited to see DD in the morning / after nursery. He strokes her head and tries to hold her hand and says 'don't worry, baby' if she cries.

1. DD is just starting to interact and smile a tiny bit and it's lovely - it reminds me that we actually do have another little person and I'm excited about getting to know her.

1. DD still sleeps quite a lot so I imagine I'll look back at this 'free' time fondly in a few months

1. The space between feeds is getting longer in the day, so I'm planning a short trip out with just DS to give him some much needed mummy time - I'm looking forward to that.

There. That wasn't even too difficult.

ah, we're in a similar situation - 2.9 yo DS (tantrum supremo), 3 week old DD.

there is not enough wine in the world...

good stuff - DS does love cuddling his sister, stroking her hair, also tells her 'don't worry baby' if she cries.

um.

she's a good sleeper so far, which means I can spend some quality time with DS every day.

he still naps too thank god so I have had a few half hours with neither child to allow me to regroup.

she feeds well and efficiently and tends to cluster feed after he's gone to bed.

it will pass though. it will.

The first 6mths are the hardest!

DD and DS have 14mths between them, DD was 14mths old when DS arrived. I bf'd DS and DD cried, DS went to a bottle at 4/5wks and DD cried for a bottle, eventually we got a routine though and it worked brilliantly, they napped (2hrs) at the same time during the day, and went to bed at the same time - sleeping through till the morning when the mayhem begun!

I am a single parent, I don't think much housework/washing got done in those first few months, do what needs doing and enjoy your children! They grow up sooo fast!

Kveta - so similar! Same age gap, too. DS sometimes naps, sometimes not. He does go to nursery 2 days a week though.

At the moment bedtime is silly. Tonight DS is part crying, mostly fake-crying, while shouting muuummmmmmy down the stairs and getting himself into a right state. Today I feel that I've got to get a bit tougher, as he's really trying it on with the tantrums/fake tears at the moment. So I'm using controlled fake crying and being the softy that I am, it's killing me. Things do seem to be winding down as I type though, fingers crossed.

I think I feel guilty for turning his world upside down and in some subtle way he's starting to pick up on that... need to put a stop to that

Claire, I am in absolute awe of anyone who does this by themselves.

I know how you feel ds was 18 months when I had ds2 & was worried he wouldn't adjust to the situation but he did in time what I did was get him involved with everythink I did with ds2 & while was breastfeeding ds2 I used to read ds1 a story & when ds2 was asleep used do things with ds1 so he didn't feel left out which seems to have worked cos now a year on & they love each other to bits, I know its tiring & it will be for a while but trust me it will get better the best of luck

To help with the behaviour it sounds like pfb needs more of your/DH's attention (easy to say), can you make breastfeeding a time you read together (place book on pillow and have DS sit with pillow on his lap next to you (feels snuggly with pillow, without being ON you).

Get someone to take baby for an hour after a feed (PIL?) so you can have undistracted time together. And maybe you can have some time in bed with baby and DH have some 1 on 1 with DS as well?

It will get easier (and then harder, when baby gets on move and eldest starts getting uber possessive of everything baby approaches!).

But to give you hope, here's a poem I've posted before that is quite touching about more than one child:

---------
Loving Two

I walk along holding your little hand, basking in the glow of our magical relationship. Suddenly I feel a kick from within, as if to remind me that our time alone is limited. And I wonder: how could I ever love another child as I love you?

Then she is born, and I watch you. I watch the pain you feel at having to share me as you've never shared me before.

I hear you telling me in your own way, "Please love only me." And I hear myself telling you in mine, "I can't," knowing, in fact, that I never can again.

You cry. I cry with you. I almost see our new baby as an intruder on the precious relationship we once shared. A relationship we can never quite have again.

But then, barely noticing, I find myself attached to that new being, and feeling almost guilty. I'm afraid to let you see me enjoying him--as though I am betraying you.

But then I notice your resentment change, first to curiosity, then to protectiveness, finally to genuine affection.

More days pass, and we are settling into a new routine. The memory of days with just the two of us is fading fast.

But something else is replacing those wonderful times we shared, just we two. There are new times---only now, we are three. I watch the love between you grow, the way you look at each other, touch each other.

I watch how she adores you--as I have for so long. I see how excited you are by each of her new accomplishments. And I begin to realize that I haven't taken something from you, I've given something to you. I notice that I am no longer afraid to share my love openly with both of you.

I find that my love for each of you is as different as you are, but equally strong. And my question is finally answered, to my amazement. Yes, I can love another child as much as I love you--only differently.

And although I realize that you may have to share my time, I now know you'll never share my love. There's enough of that for both of you---you each have your own supply.

I love you---both. And I thank you both for blessing my life

I'm due DC2 next month, DS will be 2 and a half years old.

I'm worried about all the things you all have said, but also really looking forward to it! Especially excited now that I've read the poem Jenny posted >wipes away tears

I have about 2.5yrs between my two and that first year was hard work! What was amazing though was the relationship that started to form between DS and his baby sister right from the beginning.

Once we passed the magic 6 week mark DD would sit in the bouncy chair and watch DS do silly dances for her. Her biggest smiles and chuckles were all for him. He really tried hard to be gentle, but obviously was still a toddler so it was a bit nervewracking sometimes.

They are now 3 and nearly 6 and are (mostly) good friends. There is of course some bickering but they share a room and it's lovely to see them together.

Congrats on your new addition

Here are some positive things about having a baby and a toddler;
1. They have especally cute feet, hands and necks.
2. They smell nice ( often)
3. Babies have the most adorable look on their faces when they are feeding.
4. Toddlers can be extremely funny and happy for no reason at all.
5. They are asleep for some of the time
6. They have the whole of their lives in front of them and you will be able to
be part of it

I could go on...... I hope you get the gist.... It's just that is bloody hard work at first. Try your hardest not too wish away the time easier said than done Good luck.

Well firstly, Jenny that poem is so touching and has just had me sniffling into my laptop. We're on line 5 at the moment.

Thank you all for the encouragement :)

The good news is that I survived last night - DD slept until 10pm (unheard of - we are still cluster feeding in the evening) and eventually I caved, crawled into bed with DS just because I could and stroked his back until he went to sleep. It was lovely and just as his breathing changed I could hear DD begin to stir downstairs.

Today we are beginning to get on top of the tantrums and actually, we've had a really good day. Hooray!

Well done lucky

I am due in 4 months with my 2nd DC, slightly dreading it!

But I just wanted to remind you that you are only 5 weeks past birth. Remember with your first that the first 6 weeks are tough because you are so tiered and your hormones are all over the place. Surely this is the same with your second. If I remember correctly about 12 weeks life feels normal(ish). So you are half way through and I am confident that you will get through it.

Good luck!

Lovely poem jenny exactly describes my feelings during the last few months :) lubilee we are in the same boat! DD1 is 2yr3mo DD2 is 15.5 weeks! We have also potty trained since DD2s arrival! I don't feel that DD2 has much of a routine as we need to fit in round DD1 playgroup playdates meals snacks nap etc etc! DD1 seems to set out to wake her sister too ' I wanna see baby sissy' top of her voice! 'oh she's awake' hmmm she is now! DD2 likes to be held alot! She will go in her chair or playmat more and more but I do spend most of the day holding her! It's lovely to watch them together DD2s first real laugh was at DD1 my heart nearly burst! It can be hard when they both want me but mostly it's good going out can be stressful between feeds and toilet stops I do feel like I'm a flustered mess all the time! But my goodness I adore my girls!

When your children are school-age, you won't remember much of this crazy-time (except that it was a crazy-time) and in a few months you'll be able to put them both to bed at the same time and have late, quiet dinners with your partner. In the meantime, it's baby bootcamp and you're in survival mode. Make sure to take a little time to take care of yourself. Hope you feel better soon. X

Poor you, it's really hard, I know.

All I can say is, it gets easier. Mine are 2 and almost 4 now and it's got easier to the point that, in all honesty, I'm a bit bored.

Whatever it takes to get you through each day, just do it (within reason, obv!)

dGood luck, but it will be fine, and get better and better. They will become so close - so close they won't even need you ;) and you can just drink wine and let them get on with it
My dd1 and dd2 share a room and they sang and giggled for an hour after going to bed tonight. they sounded so cute - and completely happy in their on world, no wailing for mummy or daddy.

When you go out as a family you can go to places they will both enjoy, instead of having one who wants to go to Day Out With Thomas and one who wants to goo to the London Dungeon

When dd2 was weeks old I just wore her in the mai tei. All the time. She needed me physically, dd1 needed me socially. It worked.

5 weeks is a terrible time. You should maybe get some help to get a good nights's sleep, or a nap - maybe pay for it if necessary - just to re-set your world view. Get someone to take them both away, or two people to take one each away. Potter around the house alone, wash your hair, fix things up, feel better. But this is the worst time. Really. This isn't how it is going to be. This is just the bit you grit your teeth through.

to echo tracey's point, my eldest are 4 and 6 and I am so glad we had a close(ish) age gap. They have each other to bug and fight with and of course have fun - tonight they were wrestling in a way that I found alarming but they found hysterical!

and they can talk about poo with each other in a way I just can't get in to.

I also have a newborn and I know it is damn hard with a toddler - the tantrums, nappies and night waking.

One good thing about having a baby and a toddler is that it forces you to just be, in a way you just can't do when it's just you and your PFB. I learnt that sometimes, everyone cries and sometimes somebody just has to wait to get their needs met (and I mean that in a nice way). there were plenty of times when it was me crying and both children had to just wait; such is family life.

Honestly, this phase is so short in the scheme of things

I'm new to mums net and already getting lost in abbreviations etc will someone please explain Ds and D1 and other jargon that may be helpful to a novice. I have a son who is 19mnths and I'm expecting second child in 8 weeks. My son is non stop and I'm struggling to keep smiling right now as just feeling so tired and weighed down by everything. I dont have the easiest of pregnancies and disciplining my little boy at the moment is like banging my head against a brick wall. Any suggestions of appropriate forms of disciplining and or punishments for a very smart toddler of 19months?? Is he too young for the naughty step?? Just feel like I'm repeating myself again and again and that nothing seems affective in getting through to him. Can anyone identify?? I honestly believe with a newborn and a toddler it will be easier then coping with being heavily pregnant with a toddler. SOS (hmm)

Becca here is a list of MN acronyms:- help for you

In terms of your question I don't have many tips... but I do have empathy! I'm due in 7 weeks and struggle some days with 2.5 year old DS. I've started to put him on naughty step, but only in past month, don't think he would have understood at 19 months. Just taking a deep breath and counting to 10 in your head can help you keep your cool.

I've also had a rough pregnancy, and am also hoping that toddler and newborn will be easier than toddler and being heavily pregnant.

Thank u so much for your reply that list Of acronyms will be very helpful... Never imagined there were so many. Also it's nice to hear I'm not alone in this stuff as its easy to feel that i'm the only one struggling with my Ds and my bump too.
Today feels a better day, I think we all have our off days of which yesterday was definitely one of them for me!!

I feel your pain, in fact

I read two shoes...no hairbrush and it made me feel less alone

Has just reminded me tgat I got this book cause I felt like this and it was recommended, I've just realised I haven't read it yet and have no idea where it is....ds is now 10 mths!