How am I going to survive a second?

[DameFlatYouLent]

I'm 23 weeks pg with DC2. DS is 19 months, so will be about 23m when this one's born. This is exactly the age-gap DH and I wanted, but the reality of it is terrifying me.

I have no family support apart from DH, and really struggled with DS. The first 6m of his life were probably the worst of mine - I didn't bond with him, never slept and struggled to come to terms with how my life had changed. I found leaving the house an overwhelming, monumental challenge and was permanently terrified that he might cry while we were out, or need a feed, or a nappy change. He had colic and spent much of the day & night resisting sleep and screaming. Thinking back to that time makes me feel physically sick and sends waves of adrenaline through me.

I suppose the only reason I'm having a second is because I'm holding on to "the plan". If I had any sense I probably should have changed the plan. I'm in a permanent state of fear that I won't cope.

Can anyone help me see the first months in a new light, so I'm not filled with this overwhelming dread? Or give me strategies to cope? Especially with an extremely lively toddler to deal with on top of it all. How do I survive with no sleep? How do I do everyday things, like have a shower?

Well, talking from experience (DS1=21mo, DS2=1mo)two siblings can be quite different: DS1 was very easy, DS2 is not quite so... So your second might be like my first.
Can you sign up DS1 to nursery for 2/3 days/week? DS1 is at nursery full time till DS2 settles a bit (colic....) and it is a (expensive) godsend, I will drop the hours later on in the summer. I feel a bit guilty about it, but there DS1 gets the stimulation he needs and I get some bonding time with DS2.
A sling was also helpful.
Take one day at a time is my advice.

I'm 3 months pg with the same age gap and also had PND. I'm worried about this time but I'm planning to send dd to a friend I made through NCT whose daughter is the same age as mine a couple of days a week. It'll give me some time with dc2 and a chance to catch up on the housework.

Once dc2 is three months or so I'm hoping I won't need to keep doing it but I think it'll help with the early days. It's just a short time in their lives and with a small age gap I'm hoping they'll play happily together and bother me less I'm not a natural parent but every day dd gets bigger I get on better with her and I can't wait until she starts talking.

I'm also going to pay for some classes (monkey music, baby sensory etc) so that dd can play with kids her age and to encourage me out of the house.

All the best.

Thank you for your replies.

DS goes to a childminder 2 days/week at the moment as I work, but my contract comes to an end as I go on maternity leave and I don't know how long we'll be able to keep paying for that, realistically. And it's still 3 days/week with 2! It's the same with paid classes - finances are going to be seriously tight. On top of that it's going to be winter - what do you do with a 2 year old in the winter?!

I have some local friends from NCT, but nobody particularly close, and have failed to make real friends at any baby groups. My self esteem isn't great and when I make conversation I bore myself, let alone the poor person I'm talking to. God I sound like a right desperate case.

There was 2 1/2years between my 2 and I had similar fears to yours. Tbh, the baby just slots in and generally gets ignored a bit more than the first. A day at a time, you will have hard days but take it slow. You will most likely find it easier this time and act quicker if you're feel down.

Btw I bore myself too there was an interesting person in there somewhere...

Thanks, weedoll. I think it's one of those things where the anticipation is killing me, and it's such a long time to anticipate! I'm not very good at taking things one day at a time but I need to get better at it.

And yes, DH and I have both realised that I had PND last time and will be on high alert this time. There's nothing quite like a proper night's sleep though, is there?! It's amazing what a difference that makes.

Try to get out where possible, cheap toddler groups, singing at the library, local children's centre events. Cbeebies a lot. Take one day at a time, in some ways the second is less of a shock and you are more aware of how short every stage is. I am sure you are not boring, when in doubt ask about other people, everyone finds themselves fascinating...

tholeon I hope it will be less of a shock. I suppose it depends on how complete and successful the memory erase was last time?! Whenever I go to local children's centre groups, everyone seems to have just one baby. Where are all the mums with 2?

You might find the next one is a better sleeper - my DC2 slept much much better than DC1 (22m gap). She also needed less entertaining as she just sat in her bouncy chair watching DC1. In fact assuming you want 2 kids at some point, I don't think a 22m gap is harder than (say) a 3y gap, as you're likely to have fewer jealousy issues - at 22m, they tend to adapt to changes very quickly.

Does your toddler have an afternoon nap? Try to get the baby into that habit early on, then you can sleep too!

Re showers, personally I used to have a bath instead, bring the toddler in with me (unless he was happy doing something else) and let the baby watch.

Think positive thoughts! You will be fine!!

Admittedly I have a 3yr gap but I've found number 2 much easier than anticipated. Dd2 sleeps, watches dd1 play & slots in around the trips to Playgroup & the park we were making already. There is none of the bombshell that having your first is, or that staring at a 8 month old all day wondering how to entertain it.

I think showering the night before is a good idea. Not one I enjoy particularly but I suppose it's not forever!

One of my biggest worries is what to do if the baby wants to cluster feed or scream constantly during DS's evening meal. I'm quite a highly anxious person and I know it will make me snappy and impatient with poor little DS, who will no doubt push all the boundaries known to man.

I'm also worried about establishing bfing - it was a huge struggle with DS as I had the worst case of over-supply I've ever heard of, and he used to bite, choke, refuse, scream...it was painful and wet and so difficult (I'd tuck a muslin into my bra and literally wring it out afterwards - it would be totally saturated). We didn't get the hang of it properly until about 4 months, when he caught up with the speed of my milk. I'm aware that I won't have the time to dedicate to it this time round, and it seems that toddlers immediately want 100% attention as soon as the baby's being fed

issimma I can relate to the sleep deprivation seeming to affect you more than others. I am a total gremlin when sleep deprived - it's a bit Jekyll and Hyde.

mrspepperpotty my toddler has an absolutely legendary 3 hour daytime nap. I'm worried about that all going tits up when the baby comes & he's all unsettled by it.

I'm desperately hoping that, like mrs & rilla DC2 will be easier, but I'm a total pessimist and am expecting the absolute worst!

Yeah I think I need to take a more rational view of getting the baby fed (the NCT is a bit militant about bfing ime, and I don't think that helped my PND) - but the convenience of bfing makes it appealing. I'm hoping it'll be better this time but one midwife ominously told me that supply increases with each child. I hope she was lying . DS also had 100% tongue tie so will be on the look out for that with DC2...

I'm planning on both slinging and double buggying - covering all options! DS hated slings but I plan to be more persistent with this one. Double buggy-wise I'm going to get something 2nd hand off Ebay just in case we don't use it for long, as I can see the benefits of being able to strap both children in (DS needs restraining sometimes when out & about!!). If DC2 is a big fatty and I end up with postpartum SPD like last time, neither option is going to be attractive though!

I think a lot of people feel like this so you're definitely not alone. It is hard work with two or more but I think sometimes the fear of it isworse than the reality! Do you have any friends/family with a newborn and toddler who you can spend a few hours with just to see the reality of it (and maybe get some tips?) and it might stop you worrying so much?

Also, I'm no expert on PND but did you get any help/support with it last time? It sounds like you only realised in hindsight that you were suffering from it. Might it be worth trying to get some counseling or CBT before the new baby arrives so that you feel more emotionally/mentally equipped for it? Also you mention anxiety, low self-esteem, negativity etc so maybe this would help a lot with how you're feeling now?

Downtherabbithole I think you're right - I've been feeling for a while that I need to get on top of how I feel and my anxieties. I didn't get any help last time because I realised too late (although sometimes I do wonder if I am completely out of the woods). I need to get off my arse and do that - but it can be difficult when I don't have family to rely on for childcare and finances are tight, so we can't afford to have our CM look after DS while I go to appointments.

I've got a friend who's due end of July, so will be watching with interest!

I don't know about having two but entertaining a toddler stuck inside in the winter I have just done.

Can you re-arrange house so you have a playroom, you can set up even outdoor toys or ballpool or have space to push big trucks to each other or have a trainset. Alternative is having different toys in different rooms (plus comfy beanbag/beds to feed dc2 on) that you spend an hour in then switch. Rotate your toys, books so you don't get bored.

When the weather is half decent go out (baby in sling under your huge ski type jacket) even if it is just to splash in puddles for a bit. The palava of getting coats and boots and hats on/off makes it a lengthy activity so you will feel you have achieved something. Plus when it is exceptionally awful you won't feel so bad about not going out.

Re pnd see if you can do counselling over the phone (ask gp) or just chat to one of the parenting / pnd helplines. You can do this while dc1 naps or even in the evening. Better than nothing.

I've had a 26 month gap (twice) and will have a nearly 3 year gap for this last one .

You will cope. The thought of it is worse that the reality, honestly. Once they're here you just get on with it. With the second one, most people find themselves wondering what on earth was so time consuming about just having a baby! Although the baby will be different from your first, which if you're anything like me will come as a constant and repeated surprise , you will know what you're doing with babies in general, and most people worry a lot less about the small things. Your focus will also still be on your todddler, and they will certainly stop you getting bored.

I found a good sling an essential piece of kit. Not the high street ones, but good ones from the internet. Lots of people like stretchy wraps (e.g. Kari-me), though I don't get on with them. I used a BabyHawk Mei Tai with head support from v early on, then later moved to a connecta baby carrier. Newborns nap frequently, but often not for long, so it can be easier to let them nap in the sling while you get on with things. Also, you can go to the loo with them in there, which is handy, as you'll need to take them with you, because no matter how delightful your toddler is, they are unpredictable, do not understand consequences and could potentially hurt the baby. I know one baby tipped out of its pram by a sibling, and of another hit hard over the head with something, both unexpectedly whilst mum was out of the room .

The afternoons can feel very long when you are tired. I used to use cbeebeies judiciuosly , as well as favourite DVDs. We tried to get out every morning even if only to the park, or have friends over, and then take things easier in the afternoon.

Breastfeeding sitting cross-legged on the floor while playing with the toddler can be great. Some people keep a bag of toys just for those times, so they are special and interesting. Having lots of toddler snacks stashed around the house can also be helpful. Most toddlers can manage water in a bottle with a sports lid, which is easier to keep handy and less messy than cups. Likewise with changes of clothes if potty training. If your toddler likes reading stories together, then this can easily be done with them next to you whilst feeding.

Change nappies downstairs. We keep a changing mat under the sofa and just slide it out when needed. Nappies, wipes etc close to hand in the living room.

For us bedsharing at night maximised sleep.

I stocked the freezer up as much as I could before the birth, which was a big help in the first weeks as we got used to the change.

Try to be kind to your DH/DP and agree that any arguments in the early months will be forgotten quickly. You will both be very tired, but you will survive and you know it won't last forever. Don't forget to take photos -the time passes much more quickly with subsequent babies!

Finally, lower your standards. About everything, but especially housework.

Have fun!

Also, try to remember that your LO will have changed quite a bit by the time the baby arrives. Some bits will be more positive (e.g. learning to do stuff for themselves -encourage this!! Teach to put on own shoes (velcro)/wellies, ask them to be your helper and fetch and carry stuff for you). Some bits more challenging, as they become more wilful and argumentative/tantrummy. This will happen, and it will not be anything to do with jealousy or the new baby, even if it happens at the same time. They all go through it at some point. I found giving countdown warnings before changes of activity helped (e.g. in 10 mins we're going to stop playing and get ready to go out, repeat at 5, 2 and 1 mins). Toddlers can get v engrossed and kick back if their views are not respected. Making things into a game or race can help too. e.g. if won't put coat on, pretend to put it on you or put socks on hands. They'll soon correct you and want it on them. Don't sweat the small stuff. If they want to choose their own mismatched clothes let them. If you can say yes then try to (no causes a bigger reaction usually). Try to head-off tantrums caused by tiredness or hunger by offering regular snacks and factoring in quieter times to rest. I often got the toddler to sleep on the move, e.g. in buggy when baby in sling.

Indoor activities:

The post-it game. Buy a pack of post-its. Issue them one at a time to the toddler with an instruction on where to go and stick it. Once lots of them are spread throughout random locations throughout the house, challenge them to collect them all up and bring them to you. Repeat. I though it was mind-numbing, but not for a 2 year old apparently .

Chuck all the cushions off the sofa all over the floor. Put on your favourite music. Jump!!

When you get really desperate, run the 2 year old a bath! Sounds crazy, but it's like warm indoor water play. It can really keep them entertained for quite a while. Can be done more than once in a day if you get desperate .

Declutterbug thank you thank you thank you for all you've written - such practical help. I shall print it out and keep it so I have it to hand when DC2 is born!

issimma I know, I seriously hope she's wrong. If not I can just lie in bed and feed DC2 in his/her cot in a completely different room, if I work on my aim...

You will all be great . Not everything will be perfect all of the time, but it will be OK in the end.