do fathers have rights?

[jamesp4542]

Just a question but why do women believe they have automatic rights to decide a father cannot see his children. You seem to believe women are automatically good parents. And that it's right to deprive the father of equal access, and in my experience, not because youre worried about the welfare if the child or what's best for the child but more for a childish vendetta, and control. To me that's far from a good parent. I was deprived of access for one reason and one reason only control. Not because Im a danger to them or couldn't look after them.

You sound like you've already resolved this one in your head and that if children weren't involved you would be gone.

Has she ever been violent towards the children?

Has she ever been violent towards you?

Have you ever been violent towards the children?

Have you ever been violent towards her?

I feel very sad for you that the vast majority of women you have mixed and socialised with think along those lines.

They are not the norm James. Most women do not think that way.

hmm I do know someone who has been in a dreadfully unhappy relationship for about 20 years because of the threats made by his partner, and my own experience made it fairly terrifying for me to leave my ex because of the threats he made and continues to make, but honestly if you keep your nose completely clean and don't give your ex one single excuse she shouldn't be able to keep the kids from you.

I guess the thing that made my decision in the end was that I couldn't let our son grown up thinking the relationship his father and I had was what he should aspire to. But that was me, and I'm not saying it's easy :(

I'm a staunch believer that there are 3 sides to every story: yours, mine and the truth, and it's easy to mask the truth, or middle ground, when you're full of anger and animosity.

My mother always told me that the opposite of love isn't hate. It's indifference. And when a relationship breaks up and you gradually learn that indifference it's liberating.

Its bad that you feel you're in a position where you daren't leave as you're worried you wouldn't get to see your kids again. Children should be put first by both parents and not dragged into arguments and used as weapons to fight the other parent with. Its very sad.

Do you think she'd actually do this or might it be a threat?

As a child of divorced parents I agree that regular access and non-toxic attitudes to new partners, transgressions etc is the way to go.
I am sorry James if you have had a rough time as I would be sorry if a woman also had no access to her kids.

My DP and I always argue about who would get custody..you can have them, No you! but I appreciate in reality it is no laughing matter and the situation for eg Bob Geldof was painful and ludicrous and the aftermath of all that ironic.

I think that often the idea that girls stay with mums, boys go with dads, women are the primary carers etc tis a shame that situations are always as unique as the children themselves.

I don't know. I think the idea of Hell being a woman scored and a philandering partner not allowed rights is a cliche but that's not to say it doesn't happen.

Rachel Cusk came in for hell on this forum for admitting she felt her kids were naturally primevally hers - despite saying my husband can have the kids I kind of know what she meant unpalatable though it is to admit to. Just because the visceral birthing and having them in me for 9 months means I am bound to them for life no matter what they do. But I am still a crap mum a lot of the time and believe their father to be the better more patient parent.

I do not know if you are from F4J or not - i don't care one way or another.
I asked Goldie Hawn her views on that the other day when really I wanted to ask why Bill Hudson claimed he had not been allowed to see or establish a relationship with his kids (and had paperwork to back up his fight to see them) but I was too chicken shit to ask directly.

I believe that kids need both parents where possible and in a split as much bloody support as they can get from wherever and whomever.

So yes, fathers have rights too.

But if either parent walks out when you are small, hooks up with someone else and was by their own choice a Sunday parent they cannot neccessarily decide they want to rewrite history, call all the shots and expect unconditional relationships with kids/grandkids decades later. Ultimately your child will know or find out what went down and why.

Good Luck

The question really, should be do children have rights to enjoy a loving relationship with both of their parents, even after the end of a relationship.

Sadly no -one really bothers to try to enforce that right and it might be unenforceable. It's all about the grown-ups rights - bearing in mind that with rights, come repsponsibilities.

The responsibility to care for your child when they need you, irregardless of your opinion of the other parent, even if it is inconvienient for the adult. The right to expect a financial contribution from a non resident parent so that the child can continue to have the financial security they enjoyed prior to the end of the relationship. The right to not be used as a mechanism of control (that one goes for both parents, although in my experience the control aspect seems to be more about what the non resident parent wants or thinks (s)he is entitled to.

Whilst there are non resident parents who have been treated unfairly by the family courts system, there are far more children who are treated as an after-thought at the end of a relationship, who are treated as second-best by the non resident parent, who are not seen, who have their birthdays and christmasses forgotten and who have little opportunity for 'extras' like after-schoool activities or trips to the cinema because the Child Maintenance Enforcement Commision can't trace the non-resident parent, or they creatively account their incomings...

So if we're talking about rights, let's go back to the child (and I'm not really addressing you OP. I think you sound as if you are in a very difficult situation)

I would not wish to tar all NRPs with the same brush (and you will note my extremely careful gender-neutral language) For every parent fighting to see their child, there are tens of children who are forgotten, who are treated as a liability, who are convieniently pulled out to massage the NRPs ego when they proclaim what a wonderful parent they are and who grow up with one parent trying to do the work of two and wondering how someone can walk away from their child.

I am by no means a perfect parent, I'm extremely stressed at the moment, i have a boy who will not even acknowledge you unless you shout, stressed with work, relationship its all just getting to me. I feel i need some time away but thats just not fair on her. Its not like she can do it. I just dont want to leave and be the smallest part of my kids life. I love being able to wake up with them every day and being able to spend time with them eery day, but the stress ruins it. I'm not necessarily stressed out with the kids but thats what it feels. It isnt their fault but sometimes i do shout.

I think one of my biggest worries is turning into my dad

@mrsarchie
No violence to the kids
but violence on her part towards me in the past

The only way your ds will listen is of you shout? I think you need some help.

James, keep posting and tell us more :-) There is loads of friendly advice on MN for relationships, "difficult" children, not turning into your parents etc.

You do sound stressed though, try and tackle one thing at a time, and be positive about small successes, rather than focusing on what goes wrong.

Interesting first post and also on a post where another poster is going through awful time with her dh. Bit odd

Mama, lots of parents go through tough patches with their kids ignoring, disrespecting etc. It does not make you a bad parent, it just means you need to maybe try some different strategies or just wake it out, this too shall pass etc etc

Wake = wait obv

I know that itsallgoingtpbefine. Just my spidey senses tingling esp with all the ffj crap. I shout at times too

Even if he originated from F4J doesn't mean we can't still help him out, and unlike the other F4J posters he seems to still be engaging.

my cunning plan re F4J is to be nice to them and maybe they'll stay and realise that we are actually quite nice

aren't we discussing sweets?

I have read up in f4j do agree with certain aspects of what they want e.g. Making it easier for willing, worthy fathers to have access. But not what's been goin on recently, it's a bit ott, un every community, or forum there are going to be people with opinions not held by eeveryone, all this posting about posts made in mumsnet with women hating on men is silly. A little Like my op, generalisations are made in the heat of the moment.
Any opinions I put on here are my own.

In regards to shouting and difficulties with kiddy no1. I can literally be in front of him saying his name and he'll ignore me. Other times he Is the best behaved kid in the world he's so good and cute it's unreal. Like Jekyll and Hyde.

I never said the actual word MNHQ

How old is your son?

Kids do go through very annoying stages of selective hearing and I'm sure they do it on purpose. DD normally ignores me if watching the TV, so I turn it off - she starts listening then.

2y+6

Normal at that age. Crouch down at his level and male eye contact with him when he's not listening. Talk calmly and clearly and praise him when he has listened well