DS (3) says he doesn't like DP

[threeleftfeet]

Well I think DS probably does like DP, but he tells him, often "I don't like you, I want mummy!" "I don't like you daddy, I don't like you at all, I want mummy"

We'd heard from friends that their little ones had been like this and had grown out of it, and had assumed the same, but the older DS gets, the more eloquent he is at saying it.

DP had said he didn't take if personally and knew he'd grow out of it, but he let slip today that it does really hurt him (and I don't blame him, it would upset me too!)

When DS says stuff like that we don't make a fuss about it. Sometimes DP might say "well I like you" in a nice way. Or we continue as if he hasn't said it. (we thought making a big deal out of it might encourage him!)

I have some ideas about why DS feels like this, but before I start with the attempt at analysing this, I wonder if any of you have had a similar experience, what happened? Is there anything we can do to improve this situation for DS and DP?

Universal experience, I would say. Ds loved daddy best from 9 months. He still does- he's 10- but he has learned over the years to be more tactful about it! I tried not to let it get to me- even when he leant round in the pushchair and said "I love you, mummy - but I love daddy, Gracie and the kittens more"

Same here - ds1 over the years has told me he doesn't like me/hates me/likes his other mummy more. It's gutting but I have to remember I'm the grown up and I always tell him well I like you/love you and always will...

He's 10 now and has chopped and changed a bit over time - I think he pretty much doesn't like both of us at the moment...

Sugar so this can last for years :( my friends' DS who did thi grew out of it by 3.

See I reckon it could be because:

I am busy - too busy - with uni work. DS misses me and feels daddy is taking him away from me (I am taking a year out next year, but have to finish this year, till June)

Because we're so busy we don't get to do much as a family, DS is usually with me or DP.

I BF very late, (still feed to sleep although winding down now, won't be feeding much longer) and DS sees his mummy as a source of food, comfort, and well everything. How could DP compete?

I reckon once I'm home more and we do things as a family more it might change, what do you think?

i think it's old enough to start telling him, 'that is not a nice thing to say and you will hurt daddy's feelings' etc.

when i get this from ds about a relative i've tended to point out how he likes the way they do this or that for him and what he enjoys doing with them etc.

tbh at 3 he must know it's not a nice thing to say and i think you do need to start reacting to it constructively.

We had his a bit with our ds but it wasn't exclusive to one of us.

Our way of dealing with it was to present a untied front. So if ds said he didn't like me, my dh would say 'that's not very nice, don't say that to mummy, say sorry' and if he said it to dh I would say the same. Once he saw he wasn't going to divide us by sayings this it stopped.

I think sometimes they say things like that in an attempt to kind of play you off against each other (not in a nasty way, perhaps even subconsciously).

We never got cross or made a big deal, just calmly told him it wasn't nice and didn't take it personally.

yep no need for cross but i think you need to say stuff - i think if i was the partner being told i was not liked i would want my partner to challenge it or i would feel very unsupported tbh.

if ever ds says he doesn't like someone (grandma, grandad, aunty, whoever) i remind him that that is not a nice thing to say and that that person loves him and is very good to him and give him examples of the things they do for or with him. ESPECIALLY if he does this in front of them. as his mum it's my job to train him to be considerate of other people's feelings and appreciative of what they do for him.

time to stick up for dp and make clear that this is not nice and can't go on.

Actually now I think of it, it's more than just saying it. DS says "mummy" excitedly and runs to give me a cuddle when I cone home. He doesn't do that to DP. He's will rarely give DP a goodnight cuddle anymore (he used too). He gets really upset when I leave sometimes (not always) but never when DP goes out.

I have started challenging DS sometimes when he says things like that but not consistently. Thanks for the advice I think it's a good idea if we do that more consistent about doing that, and presenting a united front.

FWIW we never get cross with him, it's getting DP down but DS doesn't see that.

Oops I see I can't write coherent sentences! I blame the small box on my phone

Is there anything we can do apart from challenging what DS says?

I think this kind of behaviour is rude, manipulative and attention seeking. On that basis, I believe that a parent should deal with it quite firmly, as in any other naughty behaviour. If my son (and he does) ever says "I don't like Mummy", I tell him quite firmly that I know he does like her and anyway he is not allowed to say that, as it is rude (and hurtful). Or, alternatively, "well, if you don't like Daddy/Mummy, you won't want him/her to take you to soft play today/make you a lovely dinner etc". I think that they need to learn that what they say, as well as what they do, can have consequences.

They do grow out of it though. My oldest used to be a real Daddy's boy, now it is about 50/50, much to both of our relief.

never thought i'd say this but i agree with larry.

the child is 3 - he wouldn't be allowed to go around nursery saying, i don't like so and so, continually as the behaviour would be seen as mean and unpleasant. it is time to put a stop to it.

i do the same as larry - oh you don't like granny? oh well you won't want her to take you to x on sunday then will you? and you won't want her to do y anymore etc.

3 is plenty old enough for manners and consideration. i think you've made a mistake in ignoring this for so long and giving him the message that it's ok to say this and ok to hurt daddy's feelings. and of course he knows it hurts.

It's hard to know what to do in these situations. I don't think any major lasting damage has been done though. He'll soon get the message if you let him know it's unacceptable.

The running to you when you get home might simply be that he see's you a bit less. I spend more time than my dh does than my dh (just) and he always gets the fanfare when arriving home but I just get that sometimes

Regardless of this I always steal a hug when I come in whether they want one or not

larrygrylls - wow that's harsh!

I agree totally his behavious is rude and it's up to us to educate him that it's not on, but I'm really not sure I like the description of "rude, manipulative and attention seeking" for any 3 year old!

Good to hear yours has grown out of it though.

Dd was like this, and DH did find it hurtful. He had an older DS from a previous relationship who adored him so was secure about his role as a dad, thankfully. I would sympathise with DP, tell DS that is not nice but generally take as little notice as poss. My dd opened up to her dad when she started school - I think that is quite common once they are out in the wider world. They have a very close relationship now (she's 7).

DH is grieving at the moment, and is feeling pretty down. That's how come it slipped out that it does get to him. (The bereavement is recent, DS saying he doesn't like him started ages ago).

I really feel for DP at the moment, he's feeling shitty about the world (he's usually a very positive person) and I'm sure it really doesn't help to have your otherwise lovely child tell you he doesn't like you several times a day

coronet that's good to hear, thanks

then support him by correcting the hurtful behaviour.

I have a 3 year old as well and he does this a lot. I think that at this age they are very much living, thinking and feeling in the moment and that when they say "I don't like X" they actually mean "X is making me feel cross/sad/scared right now". If he's doing a lot of the care and he's more attached to you it might well be related to that, he just doesn't understand how to express this so he's saying it in very simplistic terms. If you can try and keep this in mind and think about what might really be behind it it really helps with not taking it personally.

I think it's fair to tell them it's not a nice thing to say and that it might hurt someone's feelings, but I don't think it's ever okay to tell them that they are wrong in their feelings or that they don't feel the way they do. If you know they feel the opposite way, they still have a reason for saying what they do, whether it's clumsy expression or something else, like expressing an "acceptable" emotion instead of one they know is discouraged, e.g. if they say they're scared of the dark when they aren't at all but they just want you to stay in bed with them, or if they say they are too tired to tidy up when actually they just find it boring.

It can sometimes help if you try and second guess the real feelings behind what they're saying and feed them back to them, e.g. "Aww, you don't like Daddy? That's sad. Are you feeling a bit cross with him?" and then once he is more used to telling you what's really happening you can just shorten it to "Why don't you like Daddy?" and he will probably come out with "Because he made me put my coat on" or something else trivial. And if it's not trivial, it gives you a really useful starting point to try and remedy it.

Thanks for your constructive and insightful post BertieBotts, I really appreciate it.

"I don't think it's ever okay to tell them that they are wrong in their feelings or that they don't feel the way they do."

I agree absolutely. He's trying to express something, and I suspect it's not as straightforward as he doesn't like his dad!

FWIW DP says DS says this kind of thing mostly when we're both there, he's fine when it's just the two of them. He does it if DP takes him to bed, or goes to brush his teeth, or whatever. He's espressing that he wants me rather than DP. DP also says DS's behaviour is much better when I'm not there, he "plays up" (for want of a better word) when we're both there.

When DS is upset about something he will say "mummy I'm sad" and if ask him why he can usually tell me. Sometimes his answer makes sense and sometimes it takes a bit of interpreting ("I'm sad because I'm scared about you talking" means he didn't like getting told off, for example! Sounds terrible tough doesn't it.)

I think what DP is doing to upset him is keeping him away from me (he's not, but I suspect that's what it seems like to DS).

That seems like the most likely answer to me anyway, although I do wonder if I'm going for that as the cause because I feel guilty about not being there for him more (and I am changing everything, so that I can be).

My DSis used to say there was mum and there was anti-mum (ie dad)! I think that is true, and that it really applies when the child is little - if you have a healthy family dynamic then it just shifts naturally. Just be extra nice to your DP and reassure him that he is a great dad and DS will catch on soon!

I often say to my ds (4) that I always love him, even when I'm cross I still love him. I'm hoping this helps him see that just because you're cross with mummy for not giving you a her biscuit, your feelings for her haven't changed!

Hmm yes that is hard. If me and DP are both here then the only way DS will settle for DP is if I am sleeping or ill, so literally incapacitated. Because DP isn't his dad and only moved in 6 months or so ago, and he's obviously closer to me because of this, I've always just accepted that I am the one who puts him to bed if I'm here. I am hoping that as he gets older and more able to understand that although I'd like to put him to bed every night, I can't always do that, it will become easier, and in the meantime if there's a reason I need to not be around at bedtime then it's easier if I can make myself seem more unavailable - is there another room you could go into to work to kind of separate it, or even go out of the house, to the uni library etc? Unless you feel you are really not seeing him enough then I wouldn't be trying to cut it down necessarily but just trying to make it easier on all involved, you deserve to do your own stuff too :)

"larrygrylls - wow that's harsh!"

I am being harsh about the behaviour and not your son. I think that all children go through phases of exhibiting bad behaviour, however intrinsically lovely they are. One of the most important things is to separate the behaviour from the person, so you can strongly condemn a behaviour whilst making sure that your child is secure in your love for them.

I disagree with Bertie that you have to accept all "feelings" and try to explore them. That gives far too much power to a toddler. If your toddler says "I hate blacks" for instance, are you going to try to explore his feelings, or merely explain to him that it is a totally unacceptable attitude to have. It is noticeable from several posts (and our own son) that this kind of behaviour is most prevalent when both parents are present. This shows that it really is attention seeking, as they end up getting both parents totally focused on their needs, often at the expense of siblings.

I notice that most against dealing with this firmly tend to be the "preferred" parents. I think it is hard not to be a little flattered by being considered so special in one's child's eyes. On the other hand, I know how hard it is for the other parent and destructive of a healthy family dynamic, however hard one tries to be adult and rise above it.