I would like to know why it is that we are so different today...

[UCM]

from mums in the 50's & 60's. Apart from the obvious timesavers like washing machines/dishwashers/cleaners etc.

I was talking to some older women recently and they never ran around like headless chickens over their kids, whom have all done remarkably well.They used to leave them playing in the dirt whilst they carried out the ardous task of housework. And in winter, the children, played with wooden spoons & saucepans. They didn't worry whether their kids were 'learning the 100 words' etc and to my knowledge none of the children have grown up to be AHDD/Depressed/stressed. It simply didn't exist in their worlds.

do you think we are going wrong (I speak as a mum who worries about every stage of development)? adn sort of got told off for doing so, yet I don't think I am over the top?

Very intersting topic UCM. My mother is torn between implying (daren't actually say!) that mothers of our generation are lazy and yet at the same time she'd hate to be a mother of young children today, mainly because she thinks we have a lot of peer pressure to do the right thing, we over analyse everything and don't particularly achieve much as a result

oh I am always talking to my friends about this our mothers seemed to have so much more to do than us but seemed to be more efficient at it than we are

Maybe because the vast majority of us have worked...as has been said to me before - women of today treat their kids like a precious project (I do to a lesser extent - I hope).

From what I can see with my mum and women of her generation (she was a new mum in the 1960's) - you just got on with it. You didn't expect to be seen as some sort of saviour of mankind, it was just what you did. You had your kids, they grew up and that was it. I think she (my mum I mean) believes a lot of mums today see themselves as being on a 'mission' to create the perfect next generation, pouring all their own energy, talents and ambitions into their kids. It's a lot for kids to live up to!

I remember asking my mum how she managed 3 kids under 3 with no disposable nappies and a twin tub, and she said 'I never went out!'. She thinks it's crazy that I spent so much time socialising with the kids and other mums.

To answert your question, I think we put a lot of pressure on ourselves to be perfect - approaching motherhood like we approach our careers, when in reality it's something quite different. i think our mums' generation probably understood that.

Not necessarily feistybird. My mum has a degree and worked a fair part of my childhood

Wordsmith - aptly named.

Mercy - glad you said that as I could actually rubbish my own argument there. My mum worked full time in a professional occupation from when I was 2 onwards. And I am in my 40s.

Apparently we were all potty trained at 12 months, too! However I remember that meant we were sat on the potty for hours at a time in front of Playschool. I seem to remember most of my childhood sitting on a potty. There are countless photos....

I spend most of my time feeling torn between tasks and guilty. I have a never ending list of 'things to do' (a saying which drives DP mad!) which I feel a great need to get done along with a need to spend as much 'quality' time with DS.

...that's Playschool on the TV I mean. (Black and white too!)

Exactly Floss, I think our mums just got on with what needed to be done and the quality time took care of itself.

Didn't they achieve a lot of stuff by putting the baby in a pram at the bottom of the garden, leaving them to "exercise their lungs" etc? (ok, this is more 40s and 50s than later, I think).

My MIL is definitely of the view that books can't teach you anything about babies (she reckoned ds was smiling at 10 days old, and scoffed when I tentatively suggested they couldn't smile until 4 weeks because that's what it said in my Penelope Leach book).

Also my parents didn't expect to have much of a life beyond early parenthood and there was less disposable income then. A night out at the pub was a treat

well, after thebaby stage was over, kids 'went out' to play. they werent entertained by tgeir parents.
im only in my early thirties, yet i remember always going out to play in the street unless it was raining. dont eever remember mom sitting down with us to do anything.

i think women of our parents' (and grandparents') generation had children as a matter of course rather than a life choice which is more what we do really. Many of them also didn't work, or at least gave up work when they had children. In this was housework became their full-time job and less emphasis was put onto them to raise their children in a certain way - you just got on with it, the kids fitted in and you did your best. These days we have more gadgets round the house to 'save time' so houseowkr isn't as labour-intensive, but more women work out of the house and with that comes the GUILT. Therefore, we worry that our children will suffer from the lack of attention in a way our mothers/grandmothers never had to, and we put more effort into the quality of our children's lives, and analyse the effects our choices may or may not have on them.

My mil said to me the other day that although young mums to day seem to have more freedom and material things, she doesn't envy us as we seem to be constantly running around trying to juggle everything. She thinks she had it easier as at least her role was well-defined. Personally, i think i have got a good compromise: a career i trained for and can fall back on which is part-time at the moment and enough income to allow for a certain standard of living and a roof over our heads.

I think we worry more and know more(?) due to internet etc, they were too busy washing dishes, cooking meals from scratch to worry. I mean I don't think our mums committed murder for the latest xmas toy fad, you got what was in the shop.

We have a lot more choices today. However that just makes it all more difficult IMO - you always feel you have chosen the wrong thing (ie going back to work, feel guilty about leaving your baby; being a SAHM, feel guilty about 'wasting your talents').

I was left at the bottom of the garden in my pram, only brought in when it snowed! (and then only into the porch!!). I have put both my boys as babies out in the garden, with an insect net over the pram. DS1 now hates being indoors when he could be out. Don't know if that has anything to do with it.

and i know it sounds really smug or critical or whatever and i don't mean to, but i look at a clutch of the mums at the pre-school gates every tuesday, waving their 4 year olds off and each of their toddlers clutching a pink and orange monkey ready to go to Monkey Music, then they all trundle off in a huge Monkey Convoy. One of them said to me the other day she doesn't really like it but feels that she can't back out now as so many other mums go and it would make her feel guilty if she didn't go as her eldest child had gone 3 years ago and she doesn't want to disadvantage the youngest! Go if you like it but fgs go home and have a cuppa while the littlun watches a bit of cbeebies if you don't!

Exactly Moomin. i swore when I had DS2 that I would never do another mums and toddlers again. I hated every minute of them with DS1 and only went because I thought it was good for him. He seemed to hate it too.

Lordy - I say this to dd all the time

no school tables for me (70's mum) you went to the nearest school, end of. You all worry far too much.

I too grew up in the days when yu could ride a bike all round the streets for hours on end an no-one would worry. There was always someone to look out for you.

On a more serious note, not long before I was born it was common for a GP to ask a woman if she had her husband's consent to use contraception when the pill became available. I know of one case where the husband's written permission was required!

My mum also worked in the days before the equal opportunity pay thing existed, a woman couldn't get a mortgage in her own name etc etc.

My mum would love to hear that Mistletoo!

I'm a child of the 70s and my mum's biggest regret is that she didn't spend more time with us. She just did the chores and left us to play. I went out to play in the street with the other children from the age of 3, and my big bro looked after me. There were no preschool clubs that I went to, so in effect mum had all day to do housework whilst I entertained myself / played with otehr children in the street. Later on I went to playgroup and then Ballet, but that was it really. Simply mum didn't have the money for too many clubs/ groups.

I think priorites are different these days... my mum would never have a messy house, whereas my house is never tidy, I'd rather spend the little free time I've got playing with DD / doing things with her. Housework is way down on my list of priorities!

And incidently, just because we didn't have words back then to describe things don't mean that they didn't exist, only today my nan was telling me that she was always told she was a bit thick at school because she could never remember her b's and her d's and confused her 6's and her 9's. She was told she was thick and lazy, today we'd probably call it dyslexia!

I agree Rarrie that things like depression and dyslexia did exsist but not always indentified and many kids were institutionalised that would be treated much differently now. Alergies and hyperacivity are probably more commen now though due to changing diets and other factors. I sometimes feel it is played on a bit though and I do mean sometimes.

My MIL was a childrens nurse in the 60/70's and they had a whole ward outside on a veranda all winter even a night, they only brought them in if it was really freezing and even then they were only brought in to a hall that still had windows open all night. All the other wards were wheeled out on to the verandas during the day too to aid recovery.

Thanks for your replies. I have been up for a while with DS (Cough/cold). I remember my mum having time to stay up with me.

Someone said we worry too much. I think they may be righ.