August Babies

[Katherine]

Wills, Marina, Musica etc I miss us all chatting together. Time to pass on the mum2be moving on thread - so shall we start up again, and anyone else of course.

Still in cloud9 after last night. Poor DH had to spend the morning getting the holiday cottage ready and then I had to go and help him!!!!! But its OK because I feel great. Not even a little bit sore down there. Just these dratted afterpains to contend with - always think this bit is so unfair! You go through all that and get the reward of a lovely baby but the afterpains don't really give you anything do they. Oh well mustn't complain. MW said I'm back to a third already so thats why it hurts so much.

Wills how are those stitches doing? Hope you are not too uncomfy.

Well just changed 3 merconium nappies so no problems with Bea's bowels at all! And the cloth nappies are doing great - just ordered some more girly ones. Even my cloth sanpro is bearing up - much admired by the MWs.

Oh well better go and get the tea ready. Packed DH off to the park with the kids for half and hour for some peace and quiet so just been wallowing in a lovely bath. Time to return to domesticity now

I always feel tired, just reading what Katherine gets up to....

Oakmaiden, I agree. During my pregnancy I burnt off quite a few calories fretting about how much Katherine got done compared to my own lethargy. I agree with the others here that you deserve a bit of a break, Katherine. I read an interesting book Baby Wisdom (Deborah Jackson) recently, which surveyed childbirth and rearing practices from different cultures. Many encourage women to take about six weeks out to relax, get to know their new baby, recover from the birth etc, while extended family and friends run the home and look after any other children. Not very practical in the UK, but how I wish we had more of this sort of ethos. This time I have been quite a slacker, frankly. I have been pacing myself and just refused to do anything more than the bare minimum round the house in the first few weeks. I am now starting to get my zip back and am appalled at the 27 mile school run, dog complications etc. Print this thread off and nail it to dh's forehead, Katherine!
(Now I must confess that our "school run" is staggering 200 yards to the school gate and I still feel knackered/dishevelled when we arrive...)
Have also derived comfort from news that there are other handbag babies on this thread (never happier than over a shoulder). Dd is downstairs watching Seven Wonders of the Industrialised World and then QI with dh as she and I had a disagreement about who could wail loudest at about 9pm
Wills, Musica, do you feel unwell in any way (slight temp, achey etc)? It's just that bleeding that returns after the lochia has tailed off can occasionally be caused by not all the placenta etc coming out...really not wanting to be the voice of doom, I just remember poor Enid ending up quite unwell for this reason.
Good luck with postnatal checks, everyone.

Thanks all but I'm not sure what the answer is. I my sound like I blame DH and I suppose for some things I do but he has to leave for work before 7am and doesn't get home till 7.30pm so there is a limit to how much he can help me. All these things need doing after all. I don't mean to sound like superwoman - I certainly don't feel like superwoman. In fact I feel like I'm being swamped by a list of jobs that gets ever longer. Beleive it or not I am doing the minimum I can though.

The worst thing is finding myself feeling guilty about some things like not doing reading with DS (he gets a book every night) and constantly rushing the kids everywhere.

I was really looking forward to a holiday at half term. We were going to hire a cottage somewhere but with a £200 vet bill looks like thats off now. How can it cost £200 for an ear infection?

BTW I bled for a week this time and then it stopped for a week. Then it came back. Very light but enough to wear a towel. The MW said it was OK as long as it didn't get heavy again and was probably a sign that I'd been doing too much so slow down

Lots of love, Katherine.

Handbag babies - love the term. Mine's one too!

Well, HV came on Thursday, and Harry has put on a pound in the two weeks since he was born, he now weighs 9lbs 5oz!!!
Although he seems to have been poorly with one thing or another since he was born - first an eye infection in both eyes, then an unexplained temperature for a couple of days, then on Thursday he was sick. Not just a mouthful after a feed, quite a lot of mucusy yellow stuff.
Needless to say I was pretty worried, but he seemed okay for the rest of the day. Then yesterday he was sick again, and had a temperature.
The Doctor has given him antibiotics, so hpefully they will sort out whatever is wrong, but it's so horrible him being ill when he is so little. Ds1 was hardly ever ill until he started nursery a couple of days a week.
So I have spent the last day or two nursing him as he seems really unsettled, trying to pay Ds1 some attention and on the phone in tears to my mum as I am so worried.

Hopefully I will be able to post on a more positive note in a couple of days.
Hope everything is going well

Neen99, you have my heartfelt sympathies and I'm sending you tonnes and tonnes of cyberhugs. I'm finding it hard enough to look after two and so far both of mine are fit (excluding the wretched thrush). Trying to split yourself so that each child gets the attention they need is really difficult. Hugs hugs hugs. Sounds crazy but don't forget to get some sleep - I find my coping mechanism drops dramatically everytime I have a particularly bad night with dd2.

Oh, Neen, I'm so sorry to hear the poor little guy is unwell. B/f him will help any infection disappear more quickly (as well as the anti-bs) and you might find that if you take lactobacillus (plenty of live yogurt or those Yakult/Actimel things) they will help your milk settle his tum.
Big hugs from me too. Dd has had a MILD cold and I have been whingeing on about a bit of snot, you are having a much harder time.

marina - are you using an alternative to Infacol??? If so how are you getting on with it? After diagnosing Thrush I immediately stopped giving her infacol because I thought I'd found an alternative reason as to why she was fretful however although both of us still have the wretched thrush its really obvious now that she still has big problems with wind. If the alternative is working for you I'd rather use that than infacol.

Wills, I'll keep you posted. I finally have an appt with the relevant GP on Tues and am going to beg for some Colicynth then. None of the others at the practice will prescribe homoeopathic remedies. We are having wind problems with dd too, not much fun, are they? No-one I ever knew got results with Infacol so we have not even opened the bottle to be honest - whereas apart from Mears' recommendation I know three babies for whom Colicynth worked.
Other friends swear by cranial osteopathy too. There is a practice in central London which specalises in babies and charges very modestly - let me know if you want the details and I'll post them.
We have just returned from a "happy family outing" to Hever Castle. All went well until we decided we really needed to get home and then dd decided to wake up, holler the place down and deposit her own weight in poo in her nappy simultaneously. It took us an hour to get out of the car park as after all that sociable effort she was ravenous and fed for AGES.

Hever is so close to me... but I went to Wakehurst place today - I would have loved to meet your DD!!!!!!!!!

Just a quicky - Wills I finally managed to get some Daktarin Oral Gel on Sat. By Sunday morning DDs bum was alot less angry. Its still not gone but I feel that in attacking the thrush at both ends we are finally making progress.

After all my winging last week DH announced he would have to work on Sat. Can you beleive it. Had to take the kids to a party and rushed around to get there for 12 only to discover it started at 2 instead so had to dash home and do lunch then dash back again. So much for a quiet weekend - and just taken 3 weeks more bookings for the cottage. Shouldn't complain I suppose. Hope I can persuade DH to take half term off though even if we don't manage to get away. Anyone else going on holiday?

Hi..

Intruder from the september babies thread here..

Could you do me a favour please and just give me a brief rundown on what a typical day and night is like with your babies at the moment!?

Im starting to get worried im making a rod for my own back as harvey often feeds very frequently and often falls asleep at the breast, i have also started offering a dummy sometimes - the last couple of days he has been more unsettled and not sure if its because he is looking for these comforters all the time or that my milk is not satisfying him!

Anyway, any reassurance would be appreciated!

Thanks

Becca
xxx

hi Beccaroll, not sure if dd is typical, but here goes: she is unsettled in the evening, with wind problems and generally grizzly and wanting to be held. The unsettled stuff starts at around 7pm and sometimes, but not always, can go on til 11pm. She feeds a lot at this time but not very happily. Once she has gone off, though, she is usually sleeping til 4am, having a quick feed then, and then going through til about 7-8am when she has a big feed and stays wakeful and comparatively happy for an hour or so after that. Thereafter she is not really in a routine as yet...it varies from day to day. She is often quite sleepy and happy in the morning, feeds well at lunchtime and then EITHER goes back to sleep or fusses for England. But this is not consistent yet. Her nights are far more predictable.
If Harvey is putting on weight, seems alert when awake and is doing yellowy poos and wetting his nappies well then you are surely satisfying him with your milk. Little babies are often sucky in the late afternoon/evenings and if he is your first, hang the housework and cooking and take to the sofa with him! Even with another child I am finding I have to sit with dd quite a lot after 4pm. But I can promise that this fussy, heavy feeding phase does settle quite soon, and disappeared with ds by the time he was 12 weeks old.
I haven't used dummies myself although I know plenty of mums who find them a boon. I think it's maybe not a good idea to try them with very young babies while you are still establishing breastfeeding, but others will hopefully advise you properly on that. HTH.
Katherine, I really hope you get that holiday and that it is a proper restful one not involving tents. My goodness you deserve the Ritz in Paris!
We are visiting my parents for a few days and I therefore do not count that as a holiday...

Oh Becca I'd been just about to start a thread called breast feeding blues and try and invite you to join in. I always find sharing the hard times makes it a little easier. I too am still unfortunately having problems. Both dd2 and I still have raging thrush issues and the cream doesn't seem to have stemed the spread. Went back to my gp who has decided that I'm obviously one of those unfortunate people that thrush really likes and is difficult to shift. She's given me bucket loads more creams/gels and now prescribed nysastin (even though my bf councellor told me to ask her for fluxo.. (something or other)) to take orally. The pain is constant and I'm unfortunately getting tearful! .

Last week I went to a breast feeding councellor who took one look at my latch and told me that on the rhs at least it was completely wrong and that that was why my milk flow on that side was so poor. She helped me to get a better position and whilst the milk in that breast has definitely increased dd2 is now feeding every 2hours and under and most evenings is now extremely collicky. Also the pain is permanent now and I'm at a loss as to where the thrush pain starts and a bad latch stops. Going to phone her again tonight because honestly I'm close to giving up and although I wouldn't hesitate to say to someone else " a happy mum and baby is better than anything else" I'd sort of got my heart set on managing to bf dd2 to at least 6 months and I really really don't want to give up yet. Also trying hard to find someone to look after dd1 so that I can get more sleep (because I always handle things better when not knackered) however dd1 is starting to get very weepy and clingy and its obvious that she needs my attention too.

I too have considered a dummy however I've been warned that its a bad idea with the thrush and to try and stay away from it until the thrush is cured. With dd1 I found the dummy bought as many problems as it resolved so I'm not unhappy at not giving it to her. As for feeding at the breast and falling asleep I find that dd2 does that as well, especially on the weaker breast. I tend to change her nappy mid feed as a way of waking her up. If she continues to sleep then I conclude that she's very very content and has had enough and put her down for a sleep, although I do agree that recently there have been plenty of times when she slimply wakes up 10 minutes later and wants to go back on .

Don't think I've really helped but thought you might find reassurance that others are having similar struggles. Like I said above I am definitely going back to the bf councellor and will let you know if she has any sage advice. Are you still in pain? Do you feel you have mastered the latch? If not the bf councellor I've got in contact with was through the NCT website - try phoning 0870 444 8708.

Would you join me on a seperate thread if I started one?

WILLS!

I would love to join you on another thread - reading your post has just made me cry (hormones) and feel really reassured as well.

Just had a nightmare night with DD1 (age 3) and just feel like such a crap mam right now!!

My boobs feel soft and not full to bursting with milk like they have for the last few days so Im starting to doubt my supply...

On the upside my nipples are no longer sore at all - does that mean my latch is ok?

Thanks again, it helps to know that what Im feeling is normal.

becca
xxx

Ok Becca - thread created called Breast Feeding Blues and its in Bottle and Breast feeding section.

Becca - dd was extremely fussy in the afternoon and evenings - she's starting to be more settled now, but after about 9 she is on a feeding marathon through till bedtime at 11. The rest of the day she is fairly placid, and feeds about every 2-3 hours, which is still quite close together. I'm really lucky in that she then sleeps till about 6 or 7, or even 8 if she's really tired.

Wills, I'm so sorry you're still having problems - you sound like you really care about the b/feeding and I really admire you for carrying on despite the pain - I'm sure I would have given up by now. Well done you! I hope it improves soon. Wills, can I ask you, you know you said you thought you had had a period? Well, I'm a bit confused, because I thought I was having one, but it was only a bit of 'spotting', but was red. I get it if I go out and carry dd in the sling, so I'm wondering if it could be a 'doing too much' bleed. What do you think? Have you had your post natal check? Mine isn't till October, because they couldn't fit me in before that. If you have, what did they say?

Katherine - I think you definitely deserve a holiday! We're going away next week, and also at half term for a few days - I can't wait!

Heres me winging about feeling swamped and guess what has happened - I've been offered a nanny 2 days a week from xmas to Easter. Woppeeeee! Let me move my PC while I dance on the desk.
Someone I know's daughter needs a baby placement to train for her nursery nurse qualifications and she's asked me. Spring is my busiest time workwise as well and she's so good (she did a placement at DD1's nursery so I know her well). I'm so thrilled.

DD2 started smiling properly today so I think she must be picking up on the mood!

Wills it sounds like you are having a really rotten time. I'm so impressed you are sticking it out and still BF. You deserve a medal. I hope your new batch of drugs helps sort it out. I really feel for you. We still have thrush too but the Daktarin gel is really helping and luckily I don't have any pain myself.

Becca _ I think a lot of mums worry that they are not producing enough milk. Its cos BF babies tend to feed more often and because you can't see how much they are getting. But if your son is growing and healthy then don't worry. The reason your boobs are not engorged anymore is because your supply is settling down to meet the demands. Try missing a feed and they will soon go hard again!

Oh don't admire me, at the moment I feel crap. I'm shattered, sore and bad tempered and don't have half the work load of Katherine. The house looks permanently crap, I'm putting on weight, my first daughter spends way too long in front of the TV - I could go on....

I need to ask some questions and hoping you have some ideas.

DD2 is distinctly suffering each evening/night. I'm not sure what it is. The easy thing is to say colic but there are times when I'm not convinced. She wants to spend most of the evening on the breast whereas I'd read that collicky babys aren't even placated with that. During the day its easier, she comes off the breast and is often awake for 20 minutes or so. If you play with her she gets to a point where she is obviously tired i.e. she wants to go back on the breast and I merely rock her to sleep, put her down and walk away. In the evenings its not so easy. If I get her to sleep she wakes up within minutes. If I put her back on breast she recently doesn't drift back off but stays the sucking like mad. This can go on all evening - surely she can't be that hungry? Marina, you seem to be having a far tougher time than me in the evenings, how do you cope? DD1 ends up getting ratted at and then I feel guilty. She insists on "bouncing" all over me and dd2 whilst I'm feeding. Since my nipples are incredibly sore and dd2's reaction to this is to either yank herself off or to bite hard to hang on I normally end up raising my voice to dd1. This is a little unfair, she's a normal healthy exburant 3 year old and I'm then racked with guilt. Her reaction is to stomp off and create havoc somewhere else, again resulting in me raising my voice. DH has taken up a fitness regieme which means he walks in and walks out again within an hour, either to go running or to the gym. I could refuse to let him go but... this results in him becoming really sullen. By letting him go when he is around he's helpful, but nevertheless I'm left literally holding two babies!!!!

You all seem to be coping really well, how? What are your coping mechanisms? Marina, how the heck are you coping with your dd crying? What are you doing to relieve the colic? I'm in a fair amount of pain and I know this is not helping. My bf counsellor has recommended using ibruprofen as not much (miniscule) goes across so I'll start that in a moment. I can pat dd2's back for ages but don't get any burps so could it be something else?

Also - I was initially using infacol. Since everyone is now of the opinion that I've had thrush pretty much from the start does this mean the infacol needs to be thrown away? Its been in her mouth and then back in the liquid so presumably its infected as well.

Any thoughts on how to cope better would really be appreciated. Thanks

Oh Will you've really got it tough haven't you. Small comfort I know but DD2 goes mad in the evening as well. Last night it started at 4.30 which meant making the kids tea with her on my shoulder. She will latch on, feed for a minute or so then fall asleep only to wake screaming again an hour later. The only time she is happy is when I'm cuddling her.

Forunetly the kids are in bed by 7.30 so I bath her when they are in the bath and then juggle like lad to try and do DS's reading then DH gets home so I can just cuddle her while he cooks dinner. I don't mind really as I'm always so busy during the day that this forces me to give her the attention I want to give her. However I can imagine that if you are coping with your DD1 and getting dinner etc it would be a nightmare.

Small comfort but I think its quite common and is not necessarily colic. I certainly don't think my DD2 is in pain although my initial reaction when she was like this was "oh it must be colic, she won't settle" but if you read through everyone esles message then there are loads of babies which are demanding in the evening. Maybe they are stocking up for nighttime, tired at the end of the day or just picking up on the fact that WE are shattered.

I would talk to your DH - don't stop him going but perhaps suggest he goes later or during lunch time and just explain you need help in the evenings more than any other time. And then put your feet up and cuddle! Not much use really am I but it won't be like this forever. They grow so quick.

Sorry don't know where that hour later came from - meant to say a few minutes later.

Oh Wills, I was just reading yours and Beccaroll's posts and thinking I am pretty lucky as thrush sounds appalling and very painful, I'm so sorry you're both having such a tough time.
We have an older child who bounces onto the bed when I'm feeding too and yes, poor old ds has been getting the rough edge of my tongue sometimes - I think that goes with the territory, although we always kiss and make up and I explain (for the nth time) why what he's doing is so unhelpful.
Coping with the crying? Ho. About ten days ago I got a pompous telling off from dh for "looking hatefully" at dd. As this was at about 11pm and I had been stuck in the bedroom trying to soothe her for nearly three hours while he lurked downstairs with the listener off, I let him have it big-time and it has had an impact. We take her for an hour on, an hour off on her shouty nights until she settles. We have only had four outright screamathons, but the knowledge that any evening might turn into one means we are all on edge from 7pm onwards.
These are some strategies that have worked for us: sitting with dd on your chest with your back to the running dishwasher (has worked on three of four really bad nights); rocking and patting her back and bottom gently at about sixty beats per minute; singing quietly along to the radio with dd on your chest so she can feel the vibrations as well as enjoy a varied repertoire courtesy of late night Radio 2; and, more than once, making her comfortable, putting all the lights out and LEAVING HER ALONE for a few minutes until you recover your equilibrium.
We were not planning to bath her every night as I don't think small babies need it but we have definitely noticed she is easier to settle on nights when she was bathed, so she is now done nightly and that has worked well.
But frankly, I AM ratty too, the house is not too bad because we have a cleaner but is still dusty, cluttered and full of ironing, I feel zonked and then guilty half the time for not being glad, glad, glad to be alive. My health visitor thoughtfully passed me the "Edinburgh post-natal depression index" questionnaire. You self-assess on the basis of whether you think you are a crap mum a) all the time b) some of the time c) never. The first question is "Since you had your baby, do you feel you are able to see the funny side of life more or less than before?" and I found myself welling up. I passed on a lunch with friends at the weekend because I was convinced they'd take one look at how I was coping with dd (who'd have had to come too) and think I was cracking up. I'd have KILLED for that lunch...
I think we all need to send a very large cyberhug round the country to each other. I bet we're all coping better than we think we are, if you get my drift.
Re the colic: my GP appointment was moved back to this Friday so I still have no colocynth, alas. So I can't report on whether that has worked but if it doesn't it's the cranial osteopath for us.
Re the infacol: if the dropper has touched her mouth lining, I'd bin the lot: thrush sounds incredibly hard to eradicate and it might be on the dropper.
Katherine: that is fantastic news about the free nanny, what a boon for you!
Long post - sorry. Side effect of having dd go to sleep before 11pm...

hi marina, hugs, bk xxx

I think Marinas point about not being afraid to leave the baby to cry for a bit is a really good one. I think we all feel we have to respond to our little one's cry ASAP but if you have older children sometimes this is just not possible.

Last night I'd been cuddling DD2 for 1.5hrs trying and failing to settle her. It was 6pm and the other 2 still hadn't had their evening meal so in the end I put her down and left her to it while I got on with dinner. I felt bad but I can't let my other children suffer too much after all. After a few minutes she fell asleep anyway and stayed asleep.

It reminded me of DD1. Ds always used the breast to fall asleep. He'd never go any other way but always went really quickly so it wasn't an issue. When DD1 came along I struggled every evening to nurse her to sleep but she just screamed and writhed with my cuddles. After a couple of weeks I was so worn out one night I just dumped her in the cot. She immediatly went to sleep. Next night same thing. It turned out that DD1 did not want to be nursed to sleep and when she was really tired she didn't want cuddles either. She just wanted to be put in her crib. The car seat wouldn't do either - she wanted her bed. Even now at 3.5 she will sometimes ask to go to bed if tired and if she wakes in the night she'll have her cuddle then tell you to go away so she can go back to sleep.

DD2 seems to really like her cuddles but on the occassions when I've just had to leave her she has settled down. I think she takes what she can get but if its not coming then she goes to sleep anyway.

At this early stage I think we feel guilty either way - we are guilty of neglecting or shouting at the older ones or we are guilty of ignoring the baby. But it is a complex juggling act at this stage. We shouldn't feel bad about leaving baby to cry sometimes and they might even be hapier if we do. I still like my cuddles though