Middle-class kids do OK in poor performing state schools - Really?

[mumofhelen]

The headlines say middle-class kids do OK in poorly performing state schools. This surprises me. We have two state comprehensive schools nearby, and no child from any social background has managed to get into a "Russel Group" university, let alone Cambridge, Oxford or Imperial College.

Call my cynical but it sounds like a case of what we desire most earnestly, we believe most easily.

Does anyone know where I can read the report more in-depth than the headlines?

"Personally I think a half-decent hairdresser puts a lot more joy and happiness into a greater number of people's lives than a lot of other occupations" As an accountant poppynic - I can't really argue with that

Kewcumcber - but if you had been i a school where such high expectations where the norm, and you hadn't had risked being "slaughtered" for wanting to - then things may have been different.

Ihave seen too many bright, quiet children flall by the way side a bit because of being surrounded by others with low or no expectations, andbeing in an environment where academic success is not seen as something to be proud of.

Anniemac, where are you now? I'm from NZ too and did have a taste of the "class" system, such as they managed. I think part of the problem about schools is not so much the education you get but the value with which it is perceived by some of the saddos who do the employing. I could see my school prizes being completely discounted by the large law firm employer who said in his snootiest voice at the interview, "So you went to .... [insert name of any state school}. That was in NZ and I guess it must be worse by the power of 10 here.

poppynic - I'm also a Kiwi, a lawyer, and went to a dodgy co-ed highschool, and I didn't have that problem at all (worked at two of the top 6 nz law firms and recently in the magic circle) - my experience has been that the big law firms are very meritocratic (going on law school grades and, as your career progresses, relevant experience). I think that's probably as true in the UK as in NZ (from what I've seen of the UK recruitment process) - I think that's less true in smaller outfits where individual partners / managers have more of a say / more chance to give effect to their personal prejudices. The one exception to this is that in the UK I think accent can make a bit of a difference (fortunately the English cannot interpret the nuances of the Kiwi accent )

when I started work at a major top three accountancy firm someone said to me (in all seriousness) "you went to a state comprehensive in Wales, and a second rate university? How on earth did you get a job with PW?" Amused me no end.

but I do have a posh'ish accent (perhaps thats how I got the job legalalien ) - which was a whole other problem in SOuth Wales!

(actually I don't I am defending them from a purely theretical point of view. Have a good oldfashioned CM)

Wow annimac, you're from Porirua? I'm from Upper Hutt.

I worked at a very posh boarding school in Scotland for a while (naming no names, but royal connections) The wife of one of the senior members of staff, on finding I had a degree said "Oh Canterbury University? I hear that's a very good one". Me and the other over qualified Kiwi kitchen staff all sniggered at that one.

And also "Mother living in London"! I wonder if I know you????????

I was 15 years in Wellington.

Hey, who are you, a spook or something????? eeaagghhhh

I worked in Wellington for five years (admittedly a decade ago, but that works...)

Maybe I know you.......

Sorry mumofhelen, it's got very off-track. I put it down to my inferior education. I will try and CAT anniemac and let this topic get back to where it should be....

But one more - as I don't have time to organise CAT right now - no Anniemac, judging by your picture I don't think I know you - very funny how similar the person you know is to me tho! - except my lawyer credentials are really pretty minimal. Go ahead legalalien - stalk away! I feel very famous.

LOL @ you lot stalking each other!

WRT the research, dh and I had 2 thoughts about this:

1. how on earth did they find a control for this research given that the group of people they were looking at (people who have chosen to send their kids to underperforming schools) were so unusual and likely to be so in many other respects?

1. one of the reasons they give for the kids doing so well is that they get extra attention from the teachers. So resources are still being taken away from the kids who really need them.... Can't win really, can we?