Are you patriotic??

[luckymum]

We currently have a George Cross flying from the front bedroom window and a car flag courtesy of my footie mad dh & ds2. I wouldn't otherwise think about 'flying the flag' and was wondering what others thought - as a nation should we be more patriotic?

We have the flag out when there is a match on. Haven't bothered with the car flags cos they'd just get nicked.

Yes i do think we should be more patriotic.

Nutty.

They get nicked here too - a couple of years ago someone hacked down the flagpole in the local park and burnt the Union flag - I'll have to watch where I park.

I am Scottish patriotic. Have a wee saltire and European flag on the car's number plate.

I can't really complain about the English finally getting enthusiastic for the George Cross - after all, we complained for long enough about the English supporters using the Union flag, thinking that that was synonymous with England.

Hmm, depends on what kind of patriotism you want. I for one could do without more of the mindless xenophobia which acts as a total blight on the culture and discourse of Englishness. It really depresses me that literally every single time a football match is played with Germany or Argentina, the imagery and language of war is evoked and it does make me wonder what is going on in the national psyche. I think there is probably some of that vulgarity and idiocy in the rest of Europe, but it is not as consistent or vicious as in England, and it does not have such widespread acceptance. Even normally well-balanced, well educated liberals turn into obscene racist morons when confronted with the German football team ? I?ve seen it happen before my very eyes!! That type of aggressive nationalism is simply not the voice of a confident people at ease with itself, it is the voice of someone with an enormous chip on their shoulder, and I think we hear quite enough of it.

What I do think is interesting about the St. George?s flag is that it has emerged as a result of having the best football team since the sixties, and that for me at least, it has massive overtones of Owen, Beckham et.al which have very positive, young, confident, glamorous associations of Englishness, unhindered by the ?two world wars and one world cup? baggage. People like Beckham are such global icons that their Englishness is almost secondary, but it is definitely part of their glamour. But that kind of Englishness is a very modern, cosmopolitan and outward looking type, which yeah, I could go for. If only there were more of that and less of the other, I?d be up for a bit of patriotism.

I am proud to be patriotic but have only become so since the St George cross has better connotatins than just as symbol of Right wing extremism I hope the media do not use inflamatory language and ruin it all again It is time normal ENglish people whatever creed, colour etc can be proud of this country its heritage and flag (all stand for national anthum - now that should be changed to reflect England and not Queen or Union)

I'd be happy to see us be more patriotic as a country, and not just for football, last night of the flippin Proms etc. I don't think there's anything wrong with a bit of flagwaving per se - it's just when it shades into nationalism rather than patriotism that I feel my stomach turn...

It's a shame (well, more than a shame but YKWIM) that some people (and the right-wing media especially) can't seem to tell the difference between saying 'I love my country and am proud to be a part of it' and saying 'I'm better than you, Johnny Foreigner.' I love England but hate Little Englanders.

If patriotism is caring about your country and feeling pride at the achievements of your countrymen and women then yes. If it's belligerence and a stupid ignorance of the rest of the world, no.
Personally I'm very proud of the history of the various civil rights movements in this country, from the Peasants' Revot to the Tolpuddle Martyrs, William Wilberforce to the Suffragettes, to the founding of the NHS and welfare state. Just wish there was more of it!

I lived for some time in Ireland, and while there it struck me how proudly people displayed the tricolour and the sense of solidarity it encouraged (as an english person I felt included at all times and never came across any form of animosity other than schoolyard stuff while in education). St. Patrick's day there is fantastic! When I moved back here it was strange to rarely see a flag (St. George's cross or Union Jack, or any other for that matter). I was saddened that 'flying the flag' might be misconstrued. More so that flags have been used innapropriately to cause this situation. The lack of celebration on St. George's day was also surprising for me initially, but more so was that the St. Patrick's day celebrations here seemed to outweigh St. George's day celebrations by comparison!
I do find it a shame that people seem to be uncomfortable now about displaying or admitting patriotism in case it is muddled with and mistaken for nationalism. Free choice?

I love my country and am proud to be part of it. And I mean that. There!

Oooooo, could be controversial. I started a thread about this in 2002 and got rather heated.

Well I LOVE SCOTLAND! I am so very proud to be Scottish, I am proud that my DS was born here. I'm proud of the countryside, the people, the accent, the history. EVERYTHING!

I would fight for my country if I had to, and would proudly fly the St Andrews Flag.

whisper

OO Toothache - nothing like a bit of controversy .

I think the Union flag often is associated with hooliganism ( both footie and the beer swilling Englishman abroad image) and of course is the BNP 'logo' so that people often look at patriotism as a form of racism. The George flag isn't so tarnished for want of a better word.

I think its a bit of a shame that we need an excuse, the football, to show our patriotism.

I think the current trend for flying the English flag is a good thing! I think it's "reclaiming" the flag from the hooligans and making it for everyone. DS1 and I play spot the flag when ever we're out now!

nutty it is only a quid for a car flag you tight woman

dh puts the flag out for the football but I dont think we are apticually patriotic, not this morning anyway!

But how do you fasten them to your car? I keep seeing cars with 4 flags on, and I wonder how they do it...

they have clips on the pole and clip on the windows dd has decided of you have 2 you are awinner so we have 2 now much to her delight

i do have patriotic feelings when abroad or when footy is on, however i dont believe in the union and therefore would not allow a union glag in our house. i get embarrassed when dh wears an england logo t shirt on hols though ( strange isn't it) i just think its tacky - the t shirts and the car flags. i wouldn't put a flag on my car becasue of that reason but more relevent is the thought that i would be brandished a racist by collegues as i use the car during work hours for visiting. this is a shame i admit. but its tacky anyway!

When this new wave of George Cross flag flying started I had assumed it was something to do with UKIP - obviously it's not and I should have thought about it properly but there are still horrible connotations with BNP links and so on. I just don't like it. Locally, we have someone being prosecuted (or threatened with prosecution) because he is flying a Devon flag outside his house - national flags only are allowed it seems, without planning permission. A prosecution seems to be going much too far...incidentally, I heard the current England supporter's song on TOTP tonight. I was Horrified! It is all about WAR! Or so it seemed. "Our forefathers died for their country..." "no-mans-land" etc. 3 Lions on my Shirt was a fabulous song but this one is, IMO, beyond the pale.

How on earth did anyone know it was a Devon flag?!

goodness knows - he probably told everyone just in case no one understood the point he was making

I hate them on cars but not for aesthetics or non supporting reasons, try riding a horse when it encounters flags at its eye level... dangerous!
amazing that patriotism is measured by football...
be ok if they would actually win something occasionally...

I really like the Welsh flag (red dragon on a half-green half-white background if you haven't seen it). My dad's Welsh and I noticed it on his car by the bumper, where you'd normally see a UK flag if you are travelling abroad. Though it was lovely. And no connotations of hooliganism! It's not part of the Union Jack because Wales had already been annexed by England when Scotland joined the union (although the St Patrick's cross is there; does anyone know why a similarly forced member of the union was included and Wales not?)

After yesterdays result.... I felt a compulsion to ressurect this thread.

hehehe........

Oh Frenchgirl..... bet you're going to be popular on MN today.

I'm half scottish, born in England but if England played Scotland I'd shout for Scotland. I suppose it's because my dad was a mad footy fan and Scottish.
I must admit I feel a bit embarrassed when the flags suddenly come out. I'd feel more patriotic if we made more of St George's day and flew the flag more often. But I am proud of our people/culture and what's been achieved over the years. I'm even prouder though of being from the North East as I love the friendliness here.