Nursery regression / copying behaviours

[IrredeemablySo]

I feel awful even writing this because I grew up very poor, ‘did well’ and have always been a huge champion of state education and genuinely believe in children from all walks of life mixing. But I’m really struggling at the moment and would appreciate some perspective.

My DD started at our local school nursery in September (city centre). It’s our first choice for Reception. I didn’t really “shop around” as it’s our catchment and I liked the leadership team when we visited.

However, I’m starting to regret it and feel like I’ve failed her.

For context, I’m a former teacher so I’m probably on high alert for anything that feels “off”. My daughter has met all her developmental milestones but does have some communication difficulties around eye contact and peer interaction. She’s a happy little thing, but play tends to need modelling and scaffolding…she doesn’t naturally join in complex social play without support.

Since starting school nursery, staff have said she’s “come out of her shell”. I know that’s meant positively, but I can’t shake the feeling that she’s masking and heavily mimicking other children in order to fit in.

Some examples are:

• She was fully toilet trained at 2, but has started intermittently pooing herself and asking for nappies, saying “Seb does it” or “James gets a nappy change”. She keeps saying she wants a nappy like X child. I know most children in the class aren’t toilet trained at 3 as nappies are handed over by parents at the door.
• Lots of gross toilet humour- pretending to poo on the floor, making fart noises, “spreading” imaginary poo around. Again, “so and so does it.”
• Intermittent screaming for no clear reason…“X does it.”
• Spitting, same reason.
• Coming home repeating things from TikTok (I work in marketing so I recognise the trends). I assume it’s older siblings, but it still feels jarring in a nursery context.
• Wanting to play games centred around killing and shooting. We have NOTHING at home that would have influenced this.

I completely accept that she is choosing to do these things. I’m not blaming other children, but I do see this play and behaviours in the corridors and she is telling me she is copying her friends. And she struggles socially and tends to copy as a strategy, I worry she is absorbing and mirroring behaviours without understanding them. She was at a Montessori nursery between 2-3 and had no issues like this, at all :(

Separately (and this is the bit I’m nervous to even mention), the general environment feels chaotic. On the walk to school there have been multiple loud domestics, lots of vaping at the gates, etc. I grew up around that sort of thing and maybe that’s what’s triggering me- I’m suddenly very aware that I don’t want my children thinking some of this is “normal”.

I feel conflicted because ideologically I believe in our local school and mixed communities. But emotionally I’m worried this particular cohort just isn’t a great fit for her needs.

Am I overreacting? Is this just normal nursery boundary-testing and I need to calm down? Or would you be concerned about regression + heavy mimicking in a child who already finds social communication tricky?

Please be gentle… I’m genuinely trying to reflect on whether this is my baggage or a real issue. 😕

Could she go back to the Montessori? I know that our children will and should have all kinds of exposure and influences but she too young to apply any kind of filter and I wouldn’t like her mimicking these behaviours either

i doubt it. It’s so competitive. But our son is there so I can at least ask.

We don’t get any funded hours (apart from the universal 15 from age 3) and have two kids to be in childcare. DH earns a bit over £120k and has so no facility to salary sacrifice in his role. We naively thought he’d be able to drop down to 0.8 but it was denied.

The childcare bill is bigger than our mortgage so starting a term time contract was to get her in the rhythm of school and also save a bit of money on the holidays as I run my own business and can cover the time they are off. I feel awful for that now as she was happy there and none of this :(

You're going to have toilet humour and shooting games at any nursery.

The shooting and killing is because lots of preschoolers enjoy superhero stuff like Marvel and Star Wars or know about computer games with shooting and killing.

Toilet humour is very annoying but normal.

If you go back to the Montessori, you’d still have faced this in Reception. She would have picked up on swear words and all sorts which are sadly the norm in some households.

I completely get that toilet humour is common at this age. I’m not naïve about that and I’m not expecting a Montessori bubble where nobody ever says “poo”.

What’s worrying me is the intensity and the regression.

This isn’t just the odd joke – she’s pulling her trousers down and showing us her actual bottom because “X does it”.

She was fully toilet trained at 2 and is now intermittently pooing herself and asking for nappies because other children are in them. That feels different to normal silliness.

The screaming/spitting etc is also very “X does it so I do it”. Because she struggles socially and tends to mimic to fit in, I think she’s copying behaviours without really understanding them.

Re Marvel etc – she watches Spidey on CBeebies which is very gentle and about helping people. I’m genuinely surprised to hear 3 year olds are watching full Marvel/Star Wars films. Maybe it is older siblings, but it still feels quite big content for nursery age.

i just questioning whether this particular cohort/environment is a good fit for a child who already finds social communication hard and copies heavily.

Maybe it is just nursery culture everywhere and I need to recalibrate. But it doesn’t feel like the previous setting she was in (which had 3–5 year olds mixed) where I didn’t see this level of behaviour.

It does sound like maybe the issue is more about the intense/extreme 'copying' (or using copying to do naughty things?), which will presumably continue to be an issue wherever she goes to school.
Could you speak to the school SENco or her teacher about some more support for the social issues?

But is this a problem everywhere?

Are children showing each other their anuses and pretending to curl one out on the carpet?

Are loads of kids nearly 4 and not toilet trained?

Loads of posters have said that Marvel themed shooting games are normal but I don’t know a single parent in my social group who is showing their 3 year old their three year old the Avengers?

Again, none of this an issue at her old nursery. No copying behaviour. It’s literally like she’s had a personality transplant.

I have had a meeting with staff when she has been bitten by other kids and they have admitted that it’s a challenging cohort.

Children showing each other their anuses isn't normal and if you believe that is happening then you need an urgent meeting with the nursery.

3 year olds not being toilet trained is very normal.

Small children knowing about popular culture is very normal. Even if they haven't seen Avengers, they will know about them from older kids, adverts on TV, youtube videos etc.
You can only keep your first child in the Cbeebies bubble. Once they go to school or if they have older siblings then this becomes totally normal eg. children playing 'Squid Game'. They probably have never seen Squid Game but siblings or friends might have played themed Roblox games or seen youtubers playing it on Roblox.

Every class will have children with SEN.

Most of the things you mention are normal. Children hear the word killing from siblings. Mine learnt it from a simple game of snake, where the snake ‘kills’ itself. Little boys like gun toys, although perhaps they’ve seen movies and video games that are too old for them.

Same with toilet words, that is a normal part of childhood.

Spitting, gross but not concerning for a toddler, it does not mean any of the children have learnt it anywhere, they are exploring and testing boundaries. As long as staff deal with it appropriately, naughty behaviour is not something you can avoid.

Nappies at 3 is normal, and if your DD is asking for nappy changes, that is for you to deal with, not other parents.

Screaming isn’t unusual from young children

Repeating tik tok nonsense and people vaping nearby I would not like, but is it really that harmful? Your child will see people vaping and smoking in public. She’s too young to know what tik tok is so whilst annoying to you, isn’t doing any real harm. People having domestics nearby… isn’t that just a problem with your area if this is a local setting?

Having said all of this, you should absolutely move your daughter if you do not like the setting. You’re paying to put her here so you need to happy with the choice. Just be aware that many of these problems are going to be exactly the same at the next place and school, so manage your expectations.

I have a reception age child and absolutely we have poo wee type humour but killing? Do we just have a very sheltered primary? Because that’s NOT normal in my eyes!

No that isn’t normal for nursery children not to be toilet trained but is it as many as you think. In my school it’d be 3 out of 25 with at least another 4/5 who have occasional accidents.

Why don’t you talk to staff and maybe visit school during school time to see what you think?

If a firm we don’t do that in our house because x, y and z doesn’t work id be looking at your daughter and the level of mimicking.

Following with great interest and in a similar situation to you. Sending hope and strength.

Re: our local area, we live in an apartment in the city centre- so it’s very mixed anyway. Million pound houses and tower blocks backing onto each other sort of thing.

There are two primary schools near us, but we went for this one because it had a school nursery and we liked the idea of her going there for nursery to help with transition to primary.

I'd move them if you can. I think a lot of poor behaviours like this can just as likely happen in private schools tbh, but not the vaping and arguing outside the school, but this does sound a bit more intense. When my son started reception he came home with a drawing of that Huggy Wuggy scary monster with teeth from a kids horror game, and he was frightened of it but said he was copying another child. That was the only issue I had in his school, he didn't ever get into guns or toilet humour or any toilet issues.

If you can't get a place at the Montessori, then it might be worth trying the other school that was nearby, or visiting it. The parents you are friends with now, are any of them local? Where are they sending theirs?

Ex teacher

toilet humour normal. Kids being in nappies normal.
copying others fairly normal. Usually it works to move the child on (Freddie and George use the toilet so I will too! But not in this case).

exposure to marvel and the like completely normal outside middle class bubble. Some parents in addition either have no concept of age ratings or just don’t care and their kids play and watch 18 rated movies and games.

this is what mixing with all walks of life looks like.

My daughter has been through nursery and now reception in a poorer area of London. There are some quite unruly kids. But she has always been a rule follower and shrugs off this behaviour as wrong rather than copying. I think its not uncommon to have toilet regression at times around this age... we had a few months recently where we had some poo accidents every couple of days out of the blue... I think she was becoming distracted. It's possible its not a conscious effort to get nappies back that it may seem. I think you'd be wrong to move her again if she's settled. Work on encouraging in the good behaviour and away with the bad. We do have to keep asking our kids not to say 'poo poo' it bugs the hell out of me.

Thank you. Re Montessori, people travel in for it from all over, so it’s not really a “local cohort” thing. Of the families we know who are local, most already have older siblings either at private or at the other nearby state school.

We’re pretty much the only ones we know who’ve chosen this one.

It isn’t normal in my experience for a general cohort. Is there a child displaying the toileting issues like smearing?

Fighting and shooting is a game some like to play at this age. Occasionally a child will start pulling trousers down in a curious sense which then triggers others to copy. We usually speak to the children about keeping our pants area private and keep an eye on ring leaders.
You would be best to speak to management at the nursery about your concerns in case this has been missed.

It's not normal for my DD's preschool cohort (private day nursery). There's only one who isn't fully toilet trained and they have SEN. No one is pretending to poo on the floor. Some of the kids like superheros but they have older siblings and aren't re-enacting killing. There is a violent child (no SEN as far as we're aware) but nursery are dealing with this appropriately. I'd hate this OP.

I don’t think it’s normal behavior at nurseries everywhere, and I wouldn’t be happy sending my DCs to an environment like that. Some toilet humor is normal, but showing bums, pretending to poo on the floor, shooting games, tick tock trends, and lots of kids in nappies is not normal and not my experience of my DCs nurseries and school. I wouldn’t be happy with the behaviour outside of school either with the vaping and domestics outside the nursery, kids shouldn’t be witnessing that especially at this age. I’d move her and not send her to that school reception either.

Could you speak to the health visitor?
because if anything it has highlighted even more how she copies and potentially masks etc, which could happened anywhere I guess and you will never know what will happen and where etc - maybe good if staff are aware how she copies before starting school etc ?
so speaking to the health visitor maybe can mean things are in place with transition and teachers knowing how best to support her etc.

As someone with two older children and a four year old, I don’t think this is normal behaviour. My children go to a primary school which is well regarded and popular, but nonetheless in zone 2 London and therefore naturally has kids from a mixture of backgrounds. I have two boys and they don’t play killing games - football and other ball games, tag or “spy” type running around games are on the menu at playtime. The only non-toilet trained children in reception are those with SEN and children are taught from the beginning about the importance of keeping private parts private. Spitting is “red” behaviour and would be dealt with appropriately. My oldest is in Y5 and I have never heard of a child spitting at school - pushing, hard tackles, biting yes but never spitting (and my middle child LOVES to report on all their classmates’ transgressions at the end of each day!).

I would say this is probably a problematic cohort and to be honest OP I would look at sending DD back to the Montessori and/or moving her to the other school for reception. You don’t want to be stuck with these children for another seven years.

None of my kids did any of the things you describe. Believing in comprehensives and mixing with different types of people doesn’t mean you have to be ok mixing with everyone. Some people are scummy and exposure to domestic abuse, smoking at the school gates and neglectful parenting is not doing anyone’s children any good.

I sent both my girls to a pretty rough local state school in south east london. I come from a very posh, white part of the UK and was horrified at first with some of the parents' behaviour and worried that what was normalised at school would undermine my parenting.
I was totally wrong: I now have 2 really well adjusted, empathetic teens who are doing well and can get on with everyone. Not easily phased or influenced by others, they seem to understand that everyone's different and make their own choices. Having experienced a wide range of behaviours has set them up for real life, and being around real people, not just a privileged few. Think ahead!!

Not that common in my experience too. Not all were potty trained at 3, but no poo jokes or talk of killing. Maybe the odd toilet joke when but older at school but not at this age, and then they were testing boundaries. I live in a quiet area but DC went to city centre nursery near work. Cannot recall any of this behaviour. They played superheroes but I cannot remember talk of killing at that age. No spitting. There was biting though but dealt with. I’d hate any exposure to domestic abuse, smoking or vaping.
Move her or keep her there but discuss with staff and DC too encourage good behaviour. Research / ask nursery if they have skills to deal with fitting in / copying behaviour. If nothing improves, look to move her.