Is this an illegal exclusion? Nursery

[MumTeach88]

My 3.5 year old son was kicked out his nursery. We have been working closely with the nursery throughout and he has additional needs. We have a SEND support arrangement in place as well.

We were called in for a meeting and they informed me they don't feel they can meet his needs and that he isnt coping and is "impacting the other children". My hand was metaphorically twisted and I said "is this you saying I need to find another setting?" Long story short, yes, this was what they were doing. I agreed i would and they agreed they were happy to have him until I found one.

2 weeks later (him having only been back a day and a half as we were on holiday), they called me. They were beating around the busy and I said "so you're kicking him out?" They tried to say words around it and that it wasn't they were kicking him out, I asked "So he can come in next week then?" They said no. My husband then called them later and they confirmed they were terminating his place immediately.

I have documents with that they have done (or not as the case was) against the Support Plan. Their main issue is he was impulsive and where he has SAL issues, he can grab and hit. Now, I totally understand that's difficult, but having received rhe behaviour logs under an SAR and shared with someone working in another nursery, they feel that it is actually fairly standard 3 year old behaviour to snatch a toy or hit a child when you can't communicate. Obviously I understand this is an issue, and would never want to have my son hurt someone, but we were working with them (so we thought) on this with social stories, support plan etc. Among other things, they have issues that he cant sit still for 20mins, can't use cutlery proficiently and needs his suncream applied 1st due to allergies. They also take issue that he is not potty trained (despite us trying twice and working with them on this).

The long and short of it, is this a legal exclusion? As far as I am aware they have not submitted to LA. The nursery is independent but under OFSTED. Thanks

Absolutely not. My son is 3. He both plays up and has behaviours due to his additional needs. Logically I would want support in place for the needs, with consequences as necessary and suitable to the fact it is to do with his additional needs. Ideally the support would help prevent the behaviour.
It is however important that these two things are distinguished between as they are not the same thing.

Thank you. Fortunately (or unfortunately) I am already used to the cr*p from others that comes with the territory of being a parent of a child with additional needs lol. X

Nursery school is a service. Services cannot discriminate.
I've been on Mumsnet for nearly 20 years under this name. Feel free to search. I've taken my DS school to tribunal for disability discrimination but it is irrelevant that it's a school, no service provider can discriminate.
I think I might know a TINY bit more about disability discrimination than you.

OP please post over on the SEN board. Less dickheads.

And I think I know the rules around nursery funding a bit more than you as I was admin manager for Early Years in a LA before I took early retirement. Nursery is not compulsory. It’s a choice.

I've taken my DS school to tribunal for disability discrimination

And? What was the upshot?

and needless to say… you are talking about compulsory school setting not entirely voluntary childcare

Nurseries can and will discriminate. So will holiday clubs. Pointless to fight it, they are allowed to.
Schools will discriminate, although they technically can’t. Doesn’t stop them from making your and your child’s life miserable.
EHCPs are a good start, but guarantee nothing.
Get prepared for a good 15 years of fight after fight.

They were found guilty.

Too right
Given the law that the LEA must provide your child with an education

Thankfully no such law that a child must receive childcare before 4 years old

Imagine a childminder being forced to carry on looking after a child that they simply can’t safely look after. A nursery and child minder in the eyes of the law are the same. Thankfully.

That was nothing to do with why they were found guilty.

Welcome to the world of being a SEN parent! In my experience , even a ehcp doesn’t guarantee things are better in the future. We only found success when you have a setting that truly wants to support SEN kids. You’ll find this with schools as well. There’s vast differences. The staff and their attitude towards SEN are worth their weight in gold.

What was? The fact that there was a legal framework about what they had to provide your child in an educational setting?

So @drspouse you believe a childminder would be required to continue to mind a child that she has openly said that she is struggling with and doesn’t feel is right to carry on?

That the law would step in and say… suck it
up and adjust

Why should other children have to put up with being attacked by your son?

@MumTeach88Some dc that are viewed as “playing up” at 3 will almost certainly have undiagnosed SEN. You really don’t know what you are talking about. Many dc don’t get a Sen label until well into primary school.

Kindly read the last 13 pages of posts if you feel that's my attitude. Cheers.

Erm... well obviously. My point is don't regard SEN behaviour as "playing up" when its already diagnosed... behaviour is communication after all. My point is very much the reverse of how yiu seem to have taken it... I would expect all behaviour to be explored for all children, especially if it is not "normal" developmentally.

I did and I don't understand why you think the nursery are 'illegally excluding' your violent nearly 4 year old who attacks other kids, still isn't toilet trained, can't use cutlery or sit down, like they clearly can't meet his needs and no other children should have to put up with this. As a parent of a child this age I'd be livid if it was my kid being attacked by yours over and over and the nursery just did nothing about it. Can you imagine how much attention needed to be diverted to him at the expense of the others?

Well thank the lord your child doesn't have additional needs. I've never said that he should have stayed their, simply about the process and the legality of kicking a child out with additional needs, despite the family doing what they are supposed to do. He can use cutlery, just not proficently. He isnt toilet trained (like many his age due to his additional needs) and the nursery were not implementing what they had said they would to support with the dysregulated behaviour.
I hope you are never in a situation where your child needs additional support, but if you are do remember to reflect on this response.

Does your child have a sibling op?

No, it is just him.

What purpose does the nastiness serve you?

Glad it isnt just me who feels this was unneeded.

The point is they have 30 odd other children to look after! Your son isn't the only one and he clearly needs to be in a special needs setting. The impact on the others outweighs your sons right to be in that nursery. If you can't see that it sounds like you're really gonna be one of those parents who thinks little girls should just put up with being attacked by little boys because they've got sen 👍🏻