Nurseries are ripping you off (top up/consumables)

[OPH7719]

Hello,

I'd like to debunk the myth that nurseries are underfunded. It's simply no longer true.

This article covers the changes in funding to childcare providers in broad detail - https://www.gov.uk/government/news/childcare-settings-receive-cash-boost-as-funding-rates-increase#:~:text=Nurseries%20and%20childminders%20across%20the,hour%20they%20provide%20to%20parents.&text=Nurseries%20and%20childminders%20will%20benefit,investment%20in%20childcare%20in%20England

This link will provide you with exactly what is being provided to your providers from the government per hour: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/656638f3750074000d1ded9a/20231127_Early_Years_Funding_Rates_and_Step-by-step_Calculations_2024_to_2025_Funding_Output_Tables_-_FINAL.xlsx

This is important because childcare providers are continuing to insist on charging additional fees listed as 'consumables' even when parents provide consumables directly.

These charges have always been optional, as they are mandated legally to be optional.

Stop appeasing these nurseries profiteering from what was supposed to be parent's savings. Just because you're "up" overall doesn't make it right for them to be stealing a piece of the pie - because they are doing just that - stealing.

There's no transparency in this industry. Call them out, and stop paying them these illegal fees. Report them to the local authorities if they insist.

Ahh.. so thats why loads of nurseries are shutting!

I'm also a childminder and would love to be able to share my books with people who really believe we are rolling in cash!

Last year 39% of my income was expenses. I provide food and nappies and everything included in my price and our outings. I am trying my very best to continue that through the new funding but some parents still aren't happy because I only accept children for full days. They want to start chopping and changing their contracts and I just can't make it work if they do that.

I still need to be able to pay my own bills and provide for my own family.

Last year I earned c£27,000 (before tax, my take home is less) It's not a bad income but I'm 43, been a childminder for 14 years and so let's be honest, I'm not rolling in money! I work 10 hour days and don't get paid for holidays/sick and I don't have an employer paying in to a pension for me...... do you really think I'm in this to rip parents off and run away with all their money?

If we as a society want two working parents per family then we as a society need to ensure the children in the family have proper care. We as a society need to pay for that.

The info is all online. The government set the rate and each LA take off a percentage which they decide. I think the age 2 rate from the government is just over £11 per hour (so this is the rate parents see if they google it) but the LA here is £7.37 or something so the difference is £5 per hour, per child. There were major complaints to our LA about the amount because our 3 year funding is not my hourly rate, it's less.

This.

Our childcare setting charges £8.60 an hour. A massive shortfall from the government funding.

Did you read my post and look at the links?children are funded differently depending on their age. It’s based off of area, but generally speaking
9 month olds: £11/h
2 years old: £8/h
3-4 years old: £6/h

non funded hours are charged, in my area at about £6.50 per hour

anyone with an ounce of logic and understanding of math can see they are profiting

What is the actual shortfall - have you actually compared it or are you going off what people say?

Local authorities don’t take anything from what the government dictates within the region.

fake news

And did you read and digest any if the responses,?

The sector has been chronically underfunded for years, decades.... maybe now they are being paid closer to what it costs but it still isn't great. Minim wage is rising, rates are higher, gas, electricity and food are all through the roof...

Maybe they are getting more per hour but that's just to catch up to years of no rises in the funding rates - its not a sudden windfall!

Could you be even more ill informed?

The government might put nonsense news item about huge investment in childcare on gov.uk but the reality is the DfE ‘free’ places scheme is incredibly poorly designed and childcare settings are underfunded. Parents using more than the ‘free’ hours end up having to pay far, far more for the other hours to subsidise the poorly designed scheme.

Meanwhile the staff get minimum wage or close to it and settings struggle to recruit and retain staff.

anyone with an ounce of logic and understanding of math

Ah would you prefer something like American daycare then?

Shouting ‘fake news’ because people disagree with your selective ‘fact’ picking, doesn’t make you correct.

No. The profit they make from 9 months to 2 year olds will cover the small deficit for 3-4 year olds

they will then add profit on profit but charging for “consumables”

greed, theft, Callie what you like.

They’re already profiting, which is why they’re so forthcoming to offer funded spaces - but never have they told you what they’re actually being paid by the government (I wonder why)

Why would you support a top up? They’re already being paid over what you would pay privately.

What does this have to do with Americans?

just read the post, and then compare your numbers. Post it - what you/your provider makes per hour per age group

So op what about the lots of nurseries you have worked in in order to know all the details, how are they going?

I read the first link but I can’t read the second as it links to instgram and I don’t have instgram. Based on these government figures https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/656638f3750074000d1ded9a/20231127_Early_Years_Funding_Rates_and_Step-by-step_Calculations_2024_to_2025_Funding_Output_Tables_-_FINAL.xlsx

my area will receive

9 months old £9.86
2 year old £7.27
3-4 £5.47

minimum wage is still the same rate as elsewhere.

for non funded places it’s around £9

In many places, nurseries cost £100 a day. Or more.
Taking that to be 10hrs, that's £10 an hour.

None of those funding rates cover that.

Unless nurseries from "birth" (i believe the youngest is around six weeks old) are bought into the state education system, with childcare workers paid directly by the government, the nurseries will continue to charge what us sustainable for them... including a profit.

You realise the 9 month and 2 year old funding hasn't started yet? Nobody's been paid anything yet!

Try this link - https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/656638f3750074000d1ded9a/20231127_Early_Years_Funding_Rates_and_Step-by-step_Calculations_2024_to_2025_Funding_Output_Tables_-_FINAL.xlsx

go to your age group at the top/bottom, then find your area

The profit they make from 9 months to 2 year olds will cover the small deficit for 3-4 year olds

So you even recognise that NOW there is a deficit for every hour for every child that attends. If you’re so great at ‘math’, have you actually considered how 50p x 30 hours x however many children x all the weeks x all the years actually adds up?

Also have you considered the very different ratios for 2 year olds and 9 month olds?

Or are you just determined to tell us it’s all a scam and we’re too stupid to understand it like you?

Yes, but they’ve no announced they don’t intend to cancel/abolish consumables, have they?

all my local ones intend on continuing, some raising it.

profit on profit.

check out your local rates - https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/656638f3750074000d1ded9a/20231127_Early_Years_Funding_Rates_and_Step-by-step_Calculations_2024_to_2025_Funding_Output_Tables_-_FINAL.xlsx

Just read the data - https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/656638f3750074000d1ded9a/20231127_Early_Years_Funding_Rates_and_Step-by-step_Calculations_2024_to_2025_Funding_Output_Tables_-_FINAL.xlsx

You know they're a business though? They exist to make a profit. Or would you want them to be made public? Because if it's so lucrative why aren't there more and more nurseries opening?

Sorry but when your paying your cleaner more than your paying your childcare service provider I can't take this seriously....

I don't know why here in the UK we are so annoyed at paying a decent wage to someone looking after your most precious thing! It is such an underfunded area.

my area will receive

9 months old £9.86
2 year old £7.27
3-4 £5.47

minimum wage is still the same rate as elsewhere.
non funded is currently about £9 an hour, how is this profiteering?