Settling in nightmare =(

[NC83]

I have just-turned 3 year old twin daughters. I worked part time since they were born, and when I did work they were watched by my husband (his work pattern is as if he's self employed and his work is very flexible). They have an older sibling, but because of the pandemic they have spent half their lives almost entirely with us because our family lives overseas.

I started working full time again and we cannot get our twins to settle at nursery. They refuse to go through the front door (because of covid mitigation policy they have to go in without us). We end up up taking them around to the back garden - they play nicely and love the nursery staff (who are amazing), but they keep running and checking that we are there and they don't trust the nursery staff much (no bathroom, help with getting dressed, and they won't go where they can't see us). We have tried sneaking away, but they had a complete meltdown to the point they could have hurt themselves - they couldn't breathe because of the panic. We can't do that again. We've tried bribes, threats of taking away toys, everything.

We tried settling them a few months back, but had to give up because they were making no progress. We are now trying again that they are older, but they are still making no progress. We just have short 30 minute to 60 minute plays while mum or dad is on the other side of the fence. It's been about 10 attempts this time around and there is very little progress.

My kids are naturally a bit anxious, but the pandemic has really created some big issues for them. We had no issues with the older sibling, so I really hope this is just situational. For example, my in-laws came recently after not seeing them for almost 2 years, and the twins wouldn't agree to be left alone for the first couple of weeks but they are just fine now.

Has anybody been through something similar and is there any hope at all? Our nursery has been very supportive, but at some point l'm sure they will tell us it isn't working. We know they would love nursery if they can get over their anxiety, and they need to learn how to socialise. This has led to A LOT of tears and stress in my house, and my poor husband has basically become a stay-at-home dad on top of his usual work responsibilities. They are very sweet and fun kids apart from this one big issue. Quitting work or hiring a nanny is almost not an option financially - we are lost.

Any advice would be very helpful. Thank you all.

@Mid30smidlifecrisis

Hi op, I was just wondering if you have tried giving them each a "special job" to do for you while they are there, for example "today can you both make a butterfly picture together/read XYZ story with - key worker name - " then you tell them they can show you when you come back at home time.

Also maybe get a calendar (loads of nice printables online) you can decorate together and it will show them what day and time they are going to nursery. I know they are little and might not understand days of the week - I have a toddler - but imho it seems to help?!

Do you think that's any help?

I don't think any of this sounds odd, i have seen a whole spectrum of degrees of separation anxiety.

Establishing it as a routine just like you did when they were babies (sleep, naps, meals etc) will make it just another aspect of their day.

And smile, because I swear little kids can smell fear!!

That's a great idea, thank you. And thanks for saying it doesn't sound odd =) Some of the other comments have made me think we are crazy.

OP yes we have used this approach with very anxious children before and found it really works - it just takes a bit of time for them to build up trust and feel comfortable;

In response to another poster - I totally appreciate that it isn't convenient for many families and we would never insist on it - but in my experience this approach to is gentle and effective.

@NC83

Thank you all for the comments. I think you are right that we are making the problem worse by lingering.

The issue is, one of my daughters (it is one in particular) is extremely anxious and I don't think there is any way that she will go through the front door. A nursery worker tried to pick her up and she full on sprinted away, it's not going to happen.

We will start working on saying goodbye, but I am not optimistic unfortunately.

She's three years old ! Of course you can get her in So you hold her hand or stand behind her while the staff pick her up ! She will be anxious because you are clearly lacking in confidence with your approach Be more assertive with her and it will rub off on her You've been hovering around the fence so what are you teaching her. That mummy needs to stay and watch incase something happens. Thats giving the wrong message to her. You need to give her confidence by being assertive yourself

I don’t really think OP is listening to anything she doesn’t want to hear even though it’s in the best interests of her children 🤷‍♀️

She doesn’t seem to want to acknowledge that she’s making it worse.

@seaandsandcastles

I don’t really think OP is listening to anything she doesn’t want to hear even though it’s in the best interests of her children 🤷‍♀️

She doesn’t seem to want to acknowledge that she’s making it worse.

Where do you get that from? I think I did acknowledge I need to break away.

@seaandsandcastles

I don’t really think OP is listening to anything she doesn’t want to hear even though it’s in the best interests of her children 🤷‍♀️

She doesn’t seem to want to acknowledge that she’s making it worse.

I agree. There might be a place for a gentle settling in as a previous poster suggested but I honestly don't think this is an appropriate strategy in these circumstances.

These children have been left even more anxious and confused in regards to drop offs, settling in, which days are nursery days etc by lengthy settling in sessions and all the ideas the OP seems to have tried.

Id honestly recommend going back to the beginning. They need to know the routines and things need to stop changing so frequently.

Half of this child's anxiety seems to be coming from not knowing what is happening one day to the next and the rest seems to be a result of her parents showing her subconsciously that she should be anxious.

OP you need to bite the bullet and stick to the fact that on X, Y and Z days they go to nursery for the whole day. Your daughter will be much less anxious if she actually has a routine.

With dd, I sat in the car for 5 minutes the first time, next time was 10 and we slowly built it up that way. Eventually she was doing 2 hours but it took 7/8 weeks to do that. She goes in for her nursery days absolutely fine.

Dds nursery took @pinkpip100 approach. It's worked fine and she's in.

Gosh - not much empathy/sympathy on here is there? A 3 year old will potentially have spent the past 18 months mainly at home, it's perfectly possibly that this could lead to increased separation anxiety. Even without a pandemic / lockdown etc I have known children that find settling in at nursery incredibly difficult - there is no 'one size fits all' approach here and I am really surprised so many posters seem to think there is.

"I don't think you appreciate how severe of anxiety one of them has!"

How do you currently manage her anxiety?

How does it present itself?

I still think practising leaving and coming back at home will help, alongside simple explanations of what is happening next.

Will they go every day? I had this trouble with my eldest because she was a smart cookie and as soon as she realised she didn’t have to go every day she equated that to it being optional.
The nursery advised me to make it every morning rather the 3 days (same number of hours) and it worked. She knew she was going. Every morning I worked.
I was also advised to do the firm ‘goodbye’. I remember one time she clung onto my leg and I literally had to kick her off.
Ah good times.
Can laugh about it now. What do the nursery advise? I’d be guided by them.

@00100001

"I don't think you appreciate how severe of anxiety one of them has!"

How do you currently manage her anxiety?

How does it present itself?

I still think practising leaving and coming back at home will help, alongside simple explanations of what is happening next.

We don't very well! It is only an issue of separation from mum/dad and we have never been confronted with it until nursery settling in.

We have an upcoming consultation with a parenting specialist that should be helpful.

What do the nursery advise?

This is a good question. OP did the nursery suggest the 30 / 60 minute sessions with you staying, or was it something you decided to do when you saw the children getting upset? It doesn't seem to be working if this is the second attempt at settling in, and it's been 10 sessions. Have you tried a firm but cheery goodbye and leaving the nursery?

@pinkpip100 yes I have to agree...every kid is different and add in a pandemic and there's an additional layer of feelings to take into consideration potentially.

I also really enjoyed reading a book with my little one by Emma Chichester Clark (something with school and blue kangaroo in the title?!) It's about a little girl going to school rather than day care but it seemed to get the point across to our kid.

@00100001

"I don't think you appreciate how severe of anxiety one of them has!"

How do you currently manage her anxiety?

How does it present itself?

I still think practising leaving and coming back at home will help, alongside simple explanations of what is happening next.

Thank you! It was half their life in lockdown and we live on the other side of the world from our extended family. So it was really just us for half their lives.

I know we aren't making it any better, and we need to take on board some of the comments, but I don't think it is as simple as everybody says.

@CyclingIsNotOuting I agree about the every morning thing - it's obviously not feasible for everyone but we definitely find 5 mornings or afternoons are the 'optimum' all round.

My daughter took months to settle with her childminder. I just had to leave them to get on with it. It's horrible leaving them crying but if you have to go to work there isn't really another option.

@pinkpip100

Gosh - not much empathy/sympathy on here is there? A 3 year old will potentially have spent the past 18 months mainly at home, it's perfectly possibly that this could lead to increased separation anxiety. Even without a pandemic / lockdown etc I have known children that find settling in at nursery incredibly difficult - there is no 'one size fits all' approach here and I am really surprised so many posters seem to think there is.

Thank you! It was half their life in lockdown and we live on the other side of the world from our extended family. So it was really just us for half their lives.

I know we aren't making it any better, and we need to take on board some of the comments, but I don't think it is as simple as everybody says.

If her anxiety is as bad as you say, what help have you asked for to manage it?

What do you currently do to help her?

Thank you! It was half their life in lockdown and we live on the other side of the world from our extended family. So it was really just us for half their lives.

I know we aren't making it any better, and we need to take on board some of the comments, but I don't think it is as simple as everybody says

The thing is this is true of most small children with or without the pandemic. Separation anxiety is perfectly normal and in many ways they have it easier as they have each other, they are not totally alone.

Nurseries will be well equipped to help children who find separation tricky and it really isn't unusual for children to find starting nursery unsettling.

I don't know any 'anxious' three year olds that don't have SEN.

And because your children have only been with you they won't have had a chance for anyone impartial to take a look at them.

Three year olds aren't just anxious, OP. There is always something more going on.

OP I think you should trust your instincts. Adding more anxiety provoking situations isn't going to make anxiety better. I know some twins who were premature and had a hard time in hospital and one in particular has had severe anxiety and I know it's very different to normal separation anxiety. Normal separation anxiety might be best dealt with by a firm and cheery goodbye/hello, but I don't think that's true of a child in a higher state of arousal.

I'd speak to the nursery about seeing if you can hang out with one of the staff along side your children. Children make secure attachments by observing the parents' attachments - if the parents are attached then they will be attached too.

It won't take long with this method and you'll have much happier children if you naturally build attachment with other adults, rather than enforcing a separation.

@hocusspocuss

I don't know any 'anxious' three year olds that don't have SEN.

And because your children have only been with you they won't have had a chance for anyone impartial to take a look at them.

Three year olds aren't just anxious, OP. There is always something more going on.

Illness / time spent in hospital / invasive medical procedures - these would all count as adverse childhood experiences and could potentially lead to anxiety - yes even in very young children. Just because you haven't seen or experienced if doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

@hocusspocuss

I don't know any 'anxious' three year olds that don't have SEN.

And because your children have only been with you they won't have had a chance for anyone impartial to take a look at them.

Three year olds aren't just anxious, OP. There is always something more going on.

Some adults are far more anxious than others and some kids are far more anxious than others. We are not concerned about other aspects of her development

@hocusspocuss

I don't know any 'anxious' three year olds that don't have SEN.

And because your children have only been with you they won't have had a chance for anyone impartial to take a look at them.

Three year olds aren't just anxious, OP. There is always something more going on.

Ah well, because @hocusspocuss has never personally come across a child with extreme anxiety, that must mean they don't exist!

Hurrah OP problem solved

In the mean time, have a chat with the nursery, work together to solve it.
3 is still very little and it's all very confusing, she'll get there in the end

a little idea for you
Draw a heart shape in the middle of their hand and one on yours they can look at it and think of you - you think of them
You do need to say bye and go , hanging around does no good at all for you or them
ive had this at our nursery, screaming- kicking the lot
they settle eventually