Unum Income Protection Challenge feedback thread

[AnnMumsnet]

This thread is for the 50 or so families taking part in the Unum Challenge.
For more information on Unum please visit the Unum pages on Mumsnet.

The families taking part in this challenge have been asked to see how they can cope if one wage earner in the household had their income dropped down to the level they would be entitled to if they became unable to work due to illness or injury and were receiving Statutory Sick Pay (SSP). We have a range of families taking part - those with only one income, those with 2 incomes, and a range of family sizes and income levels.

We'd like challengers to give feedback across the week. We'd like to see feedback at least 3 times (diary-style) plus a roundup of your thoughts at the end of the week.

The aim of the challenge is two fold:
~ to show how families cope with living on this amount - the challenges faced and to explore what families see as priority expenditure and what can be dropped. Those taking part also need to consider other resources they may have access to including savings, benefits, loans and family support. Obviously this varies from family to family so they will need to have a think about what would apply.

~ Unum say "above all we want you to think about how you and your family would cope if this was real life situation and it wasn't just for a week, but for a prolonged period of time. Does the challenge motivate you to put plans in place (if you don't already have plans)? Does it make you more likely to consider asking your employer about the sick pay policy and whether they offer Income Protection?"

Of course Unum know that every family is different and that circumstances will vary. They're asking folks to do this for a week just to get a snapshot of what their initial thoughts and actions are when faced with this challenge.

They want you to think about the following when adding your feedback...
~ What cost or expenses are easy to change and what's hard? What's impossible?
~ What sort of benefits do you currently get from the state / your employer?
~ What do you think you'd be entitled to (and when would they kick in) if this happened to you in real life?
~ What fixed costs do you have? Housing, childcare, utility bills - how would you cope with these in the short term and in the longer term if you had to live on SSP?
~ How are children affected by cutting costs? What do they think about the challenge?
~ What sort of family support do you think you could get?
~ Any other issues/ comments?

As a thank you for taking part there will be a prize draw of £100 of Amazon vouchers to 10 lucky challengers who add feedback as required

Thanks and good luck
MNHQ

Day 5: total spend was about £3. I had to get some tablets for my stomach. Apart from that we never spent anything and had to have a home day because of rain. On a usual day at home like this we would go to soft play, but this would have cost £10, something we barely have left. Out total left for the weekend is £12. And I will probably need that for food as we are running quite low on fruit and milk and bread.

If this was for real, we would be very much a family who could do very little. We already walk quite far so we use the car as little as possible, but this is a compromise we make to be able to afford kids clubs etc. but our general monthly outgoings are £1600 a month, dp earns a basic pay of £1900, but this is supplemented with night rates and overtime, so general take home pay is more. So we roughly have £130 ish a week to live on. Which doesn't doubt much, but this takes into account all clubs and bills being paid. We only need to get food from this and pay for incidentals. We would struggle to pay for everything on £85 a week, if we had to cover bills out of it. Even with assistance we would struggle.

I will be quite glad to see the end of this week. Although we are not rich by any stretch, I am now grateful for the little extra we do have.

Day 5...........I spent £1.50 at the school lolly sale but aside from that nothing further today (I would have said no, if we were in receipt of SSP). The children are very good about accepting we cannot afford certain things.

I was talking to my MiL today about this challenge and she said she would support us if we were in a difficult position financially, this was very reassuring, although I would be mortified to take it. We are very fortunate with DH's sick pay policy (as posted previously) it would be a considerable amount of time before we would need to seek support from family and if he were off work long term sick, it would give us time to prepare for a much reduced wage.

I've failed day 5 and we've spent £96 in total! I had to pay £8 to after school club, which we may not have to pay if one of us was on ssp and able to look after a 3year old!? I had to put £30 petrol in the car to get us to my sisters house tomorrow for my nieces birthday party, if this was real life then we would've probably said we couldn't make it, but how awful to be forced to miss a loved ones birthday, I also had to buy some top up shopping, bread & milk & fruit. So that's it! All gone and the dd's have dance class in the morning which is £5, although this would be stopped in real life situation. It's such a hard challenge and makes me realise just how much all these things add up to and how quickly the money goes....

Day 5: Spent £9 in Waitrose on food to cheer me up after a hospital appointment and DH went shopping and spent £69 on food for the four of us for a week (which is more than I usually spend). The Waitrose spend would disappear were we on SSP. I suspect we are very close to the £85 and will go over with the weekend still to go.

Got the gas/electricity bill today and it was £200. We pay 3 monthly and it would require strict budgeting to ensure we would put enough aside over those months to pay for it. Perhaps if we were on SSP we would switch to direct debit to make budgeting easier and to cover us over the winter months without a massive bill in January.

Day five. Didn't spend anything today as had lunch with my Mum and she paid. Need to do a big shop tomorrow which will use up the rest of the budget I guess. Have managed to get through the week without putting diesel in the car by walking to work. I hating not being able to browse the shops even charity ships as I will end up buying something I don't really need. On the plus side British Gas paid us back nearly £200 as we'd overpaid. Can I go shopping now

Have not yet spent any money today, but we are about to head out to Lidl and Aldi for part of the fortnightly grocery shop and I am not sure we will be able to stick within the budget. In fact, I know we won't!

Also, earlier tonight dh said he was planning a daytrip out for tomorrow. But by the time we looked at the cost of getting there, entry fees, food whilst there, it added up to nearly £50. We don't have £50 left this week so we gave up on the idea. (Dh suggested we should stay home and do gardening instead )

Friday - Day 5 of challenge. Today the kids attended a home ed ice skating session. For £4 each, they got a lesson, skate hire, a parent free inc skate hire and as long as they wanted on the ice afterwards. My youngest son was struggling so we gave in and hired a 'penguin' skating aid for him which was actually expensive at £3 for 30 mins hire! The other big 'no no' was that because of the strict timings for the lesson and the long journey there and having a tiny baby to feed, change, sleep etc we bought some sandwiches to have for lunch and a copy of this weeks paper but that was only because it had a full page feature on my son "Autistic boy thrives after leaving school" and we needed to get that as a keepsake for him after all the negativity he experienced when at school. We also needed a bit of top up shopping (bread, milk, bananas) so total shopping spend was £17. The boys have boys brigade on fridays too but this only averages out around £2 for both of them each week. Dinner was spag bol made with store cupboard ingredients plus mincce i had frozen in the freezer so approx cost of dinner would be around £5. So total spend for today £35. All of today would be considered a luxury with the exception of the bit of food shopping i suppose even though the skating was really good value (it would normally cost around £30 to go instead of £8 that we paid today).

It was my dad's birthday today and we sent a home made card plus a photo that we printed at home for him but that got me thinking about the kids birthdays, and the children's friends birthdays and how we would never have enough to buy gifts if we only had £85 income!

I have also realised that (primarily because of our commitments to activities) we have now exceeded the budget. Taking mortgage and bills into consideration then this £85 a week budget would be an impossibility for us at the current time because our mortage alone is over £250 per week. However, it has definitely helped us think about what is essential and what is not and one benefit of that has been that it has helped my waistline as i have eaten far less treats and snacks this week.

I am pleased with how far I have managed to stretch the food - we started the week without stocking up to make it a fairer experiment and I have not done a main food shop this week, but by using various storecupboard ingredients and other bits and pieces that i would have bought when they were on 2 for 1 offers etc, we have managed a whole week of dinners. We also have avoided a takeaway this week, which sometimes we resort to if i haven't had time to cook and we have not had a meal out - not even macdonalds.

I also haven't filled the car with petrol this week because that would also cause another huge dent in the budget. we have reduced journeys where possible but again our pre-exisitng activity commitments for the kids have created the longest journeys. I feel that they would be the ones that would have to give up the most if this situation was real.

It has also helped me realise just how resourceful and creative those with this level of income have to be and i am really glad that this is only a weeks challenge for me as it does require far more forward planning e.g. for meals and a lot of self control to not give into getting treats. I hope that it has also helped the children realise just how lucky they are too!

Day 5
Everything gone to hell in a handbasket as my dear friend and colleague has died.
Spent £ 40 on flowers and £ 60 on food for the funeral tomorrow.
Don't regret this spending for a heartbeat. Would borrow if I hadn't got it.
sad sad day .

Back to day 1.

Tesco shop was a bit more this week - c£55, but we were shopping for our holiday which luckily was all paid for before dh went off sick and I've managed to put away some spending money. I've been really, really looking forward to it and although we'll still have to be careful with the cash we'll be being careful on a beautiful Scottish island for a week - here's hoping for some dry weather!

Cremola very sorry to hear that

Oh Cremola, I am so sorry to hear that...

As for the challenge, well day five continued with a trip to Aldi / Lidl. We go every other week to stock up on their cereal, chocolate spread, biscuits, shampoo, showergel, toothpaste, cleaning materials etc.
Total spend spread between the two shops was £76.24. I only had £45.78 left to spend so I am now over budget.

I cant' think of areas we could have cut back on. I chucked a packet of pastel gel pens into the trolley as a shopping filler for dd (cost £1.49) but other than that, we need cleaning materials, we eat breakfast cereal and thus buy cheap at Aldi/Lids and ditto the biscuits, they are cheap (45p for bourbons, 39p for fig rolls) and the kids and dh like them for a treat after school / with a cuppa of an evening.
Yes, we could cut them out but the money they would save would be negligibe.

I have now failed the challenge but will carry on trying to be frugal and logging out spend.

I will also answer the questions at the end of the challenge in my summing-up post.

But fo rnow, the thought of having to live on £85 pw fills me with fear. It is simply not feasible. What if a tyre bursts on the car, the dc need new school shoes, what about money for clothing? There woudl be nothing. It would not be possible to have any sort of life, surely?

so sorry cremola

Just to point out that if a Lone Parent is off sick from work on SSP, they DON'T have an additional income in the household to cover mortgage, utilities and food. The £85 coming in is all they have.

And critical illness cover doesn't always pay out - it pays to check the small print VERY carefully, as some critical illness policies will say that "If symptoms of a disability or illness are present before this policy is taken out, and that disability or illness is later diagnosed during the duration of this policy, it will be classed as a pre-existing condition and will invalidate this policy."

I fell foul of that one - my epilepsy was misdiagnosed as depression symptoms, and when I was diagnosed and the NHS admitted they had misdiagnosed me in the past, my critical illness policies refused to pay out...

Please check the small print of your critical illness cover with a fine-toothed comb.

Oh - and to the poster who said that Uniform is free if you are on a low income but not in receipt of Working Tax Credits - that is NOT TRUE in some LA's. My LA doesn't help ANYONE with school uniforms, and Free School Meals are only for those with a total household income (including Tax Credits help with childcare and Housing Benefit...) of LESS THAN £16,000. I would check with your school office for your LOCAL rules on those two issues!

BehindLock - that's true. Which is why people on Income Support/JSA who receive a maximum of £71 a week (IF they have no debtors, who can apply to have their debts paid from the source, taken out of the IS/JSA before it is paid out to the claimant, thus leaving them with even less) say they are struggling.

Yes, they may get Child Tax Credits and Child Benefit for their DC, but in essence, for themselves, they are surviving (Note, surviving, not living ) on a maximum of £71 a week...

Erm, you don't RUN a car on £85 a week. You walk or use public transport.

Your DC's need new shoes? You either go without food for yourself AND the DC to pay for them, or you go without food AND you don't pay at least one bill to pay for them...

But we're all benefit scrounging scum who are raking it in and stealing taxpayers money, aren't we? We all choose to be this hard up, because it's sooooooo enjoyable telling your DC's that for the 50th week in a row that no, they can't have a comic, because you just DON'T have the money.

Yesterday DW went £16 over budget because she did go out for lunch with her friend in the end. She fully accepted that she just wouldn't be doing this on £85 a week budget, but as I said, as she only sees this friend rarely for catch-ups, she felt it justified.

I spent £4.50 on a bottle of wine for the evening - felt it justified as it's been a long, tiring week with lots going on for DCs and at work. That leaves me with £4.50 for the weekend ;-(

I guess if there had been lots of 'heavy' demands on our money for emergencies or unforeseen circumstances, the wine, the lunch out and even the new school cardigan would have been off the agenda for sure. But the school cardigan would still need to be bought at some stage so that would count as a 'put-off till another time' expenditure rather than an unnecessary one.

Usually DW wouldn't be spending £4.60 on public transport either and would always consider whether she would really be justified travelling into London or out to a larger town to do shopping etc.... We are lucky that we/she can relatively easily walk to about four different shopping centres.

As CouthyMow points out living on this amount would mean constant juggling and probably 'robbing Peter to pay Paul' type of finance management that would be a total headache.

It would also be very difficult to properly maintain friendships - although I know friends will be generous and provide treats once or twice, I think even rich ones would be reluctant to be always picking up the bill! Also, pressies for birthday parties for DCs' friends would become an impossible luxury and that would be extraordinarily hard on friendships - it wouldn't be long before the invitations would just stop rolling in. Making a family even more isolated and depressed.

Perhaps Mumsnet should challenge a few CEOs and MPs to try this out!

Friday turned into a no spend day again for me. MIL had DD, so I spent the day indoors painting. I had bran flakes for breakfast, jacket potato and cheese for lunch, and chicken Kiev, potato waffles and frozen veg for dinner.

DP did spend £5 again, taking the weekly total to £67.

This weekend will be hard I think. We don't need food but we often visit DP's family on the weekend, so spend a lot of petrol and often need to get sandwiches from a supermarket.

Couthy, you may still have a car which you had from before times became hard. And it may only be an old banger but it may be something you have hung on to because public transport is so expensive?

You would not buy a car if you were on £85 a month, but if you had one before you were made redundant you would probably, in the first instance, try to hang on to it. (to get to job interviews and the like if nothing else...)

Today we are going to a swimming lesson which has been paid for in advance so no cost there. We have hardly any food left though so its left over casserole for dinner tonight. Hoping to not spend any money today as we have only £10 left and we are going to a friends for dinner tonight and do the last £10 will be spent on a gift for them.

Day 6: well the fruit bowl is looking very empty. Milk we are rationing for tea and coffee as we are almost out too. I had £12 but had to put £10 petrol in the car as it was running on fumes. So we have spent £83 this week. Leaving us £2 until Monday when the challenge will be over for us.

We are not doing much today. Kids are bored and want to go to the cinema. I had to say no to this obviously as it costs us almost £40 for tickets alone. So we are making a castle out of the cardboard we usually take to the recylcling centre. See its little things like that we would have to stop. Our local collections take bottles and wheelie bins. They don't take cardboard, despite our local council having a container for it at the tip. So we(being as green as we can) take a trip with all out cardboard, once a week, to the tip. It's a bit away from us , so we drive. But the would have to stop if we were on £85 a week as we couldn't afford the petrol(or the car).

I will be glad when this is over tomorrow. We will need no shop tomorrow and technically it will take us over budget but it will be for next weeks shopping, so I won't include it as part of the challenge. We have just enough food left to see us for our next two dinners. Thank god for menu planning, it makes it so much easier. Lunches will be soup that I am making with the leftover veg that's started to look a bit sorry for itself. Dessert today will be apple crumble with the slightly bruised apples the kids won't eat out of the fruit bowl. I will take my last £2 to asda later and see how far I can stretch it on whoops items for a treat tomorrow.

I managed to get my son back from school yesterday, but the little petrol light is on on the dashboard. No going out this weekend as I am over budget already thanks to the puncture. We usually have a roast dinner on Sunday, so we will tomorrow as normal, but we have no roasting joint, we'll have 2 chicken drumsticks each which I will roast. The only veg that's left is 1 carrot and frozen sweetcorn so they'll do. I said at the start that I wouldn't use stuff up from the freezer, but we have to.

This is no fun, and I couldn't do this for more than another week. This has been very hard, and we still have tomorrow to go. I don't know how people with mortgages manage if they go onto SSP, because £85 per week may not even cover an interest-only mortgage. With nothing left for bills and food. I assume that people on SSP get other benefits like council tax benefit etc, and people surviving on this income have my sympathy and respect.

Friday visited Dm with the children so needed bus fare, had dinner there so didn't cost anything. Later did weekend shopping with Dh, he was worse than shopping with Dcs, picking up lots of snacks and wine. As a result I now have £10 left for the weekend.
Saturday kung fu lesson for Dcs and school fete today. Could not afford to do both so Dcs chose the fete. Went for a walk to the beach instead of kung fu.

You don't keep the car. You have to pay for Tax, insurance, MOT and any repairs. How would you manage that on just £85 a week?

You rearrange your entire life around public transport and walking. You move your DC's school to an accessible one. Even if they are settled and happy, and the closer school is a failing school. You move jobs to one that is accessible.

The party invites for your DC's DO slow down or stop if the presents you are buying are from Poundland as that's all you can afford, or even NO present if the party is at short notice.

Clubs and activities for both yourself AND your DC have to stop - they are outside the budget, unless you have kind family to pay for them for you.

School trips, even those essential to their education, have to be done, at least the essential ones, but if it is short notice, then the money comes out of a food budget that is already pared back to less than the minimum. For trips that you get notice for, you scrape literally pennies each week to pay for them, or you get loans from doorstep providers (the only ones offering you credit) at roughly 200% APR. Or more if you have to resort to Wonga and the like - approaching 4300% APR. (!)

Clothes - supermarket or Secondhand shop (if your school has one), worn until so small as to be useless or worn out with holes that have been patched 3+ times. You get very good at make do and mend.

Shoes - You take out a loan. At the aforementioned horrific interest rates.

A Social life just doesn't happen.

Mobiles for your DC? Doesn't happen. Or they can have one, and get £5 credit for birthday & christmas.

Internet -only if it is paid for by a family member, as mine is.

So you can become completely Socially excluded.

Even a chocolate bar for your DC's becomes a 'considered purchase'.

Pets - a Luxury. I REALLY want another dog, I miss my Ozzydoggy, but the food, insurance, vaccinations, flea treatments and vet bills are just out of budget.

On SSP, Eye tests aren't free, and neither is Dental treatment. Root canal treatment costs £450. A tooth extraction costs £47. Good teeth are a luxury. As are glasses.

My glasses cost me £200, as I have to have flexy titanium frames so that they don't snap when I have a seizure. I have had the same frames for 5 years now, they just put my new lenses in them. For the last year, I have een trying to save for new frames, as they are on their last legs. I have managed to save £100. I won't get the new glasses I need NOW until this time NEXT YEAR.

And that's only if none of my essential equipment (crosses fingers and touches wood that it doesn't happen) breaks down. Because if my washing machine needed repairing, or my cooker or fridge freezer needed replacing, that £100 saved for my glasses would have to be spent on repairs or replacements.

If it isn't possible to afford to repair or replace that large item, with the demise of the Social Fund loan coming in April, then I would have to resort to a pay-as-you-use place like Brighthouse. Again with extortionate interest rates, and you are likely to need a replacement just as you have finished paying for the first one. So you are FOREVER paying Brighthouse for your large equipment, with high interest rates, which pushes you FURTHER into debt.

When my disability was diagnosed, I had £20k savings. That lasted just 8 months.

This is what real life is like for thousands of people. Surviving rather than living. Robbing Peter to pay Paul. Constantly getting harassed for bills and debts they haven't paid. When the only place left to take money from is an already over-stretched food budget...

And people wonder why the riots happened? How dispossessed would YOU feel after a year of living like this? Two years? Five years? I don't condone the riots, far from it, but I can understand WHY they happened...