Webchat with Daisy Goodwin, lunchtime, Tues 23 June

[GeraldineMumsnet]

As requested and promised, Daisy has accepted our invite and is coming on next Tuesday (exact time to be confirmed, but probably around 1pm). Get there early to bag your place.

Hello Mumsnetters,
Sorry to be tardy but had 18 year old daughter sobbing on the phone about her coursework mark. if anyone can suggest a way of teaching your child to deal with disappointment I would be grateful.

In reply to Priyag and her question about Truby King and Claire Verity. The aim of Bringing up Baby was to show that there childcare is not an exact science and that there are different methods which have been fashionable at different times.

When I had my first baby 18 years ago, the prevailing orthodoxy was led by penelope Leach and Dr. Spock and was baby centred - an approach we featured in the show. By the time I had my second baby ten years later, there had been a move towards getting your baby into a routine cf Gina Ford which iis based on Truby King.

Meanwhile my sister and my sister in law were brining up their children according to the Continuum Concept.

I wanted to show all these mthods and to let viewers make up their own minds about which method was best for them.

As for Claire Verity, well she came highly recommended by the mothers who had used her in the past. And the parents who used her in the programme were delighted with her.

I think Daisy talks a lot of sense both in her columns and her television programmes. She says what everyone else is afraid to and there are many mothers out there who appreciate her candour.

Are you working through the other Qs, Daisy?

Daisy - Welcome. Sorry to hear about your dd being upset.

Q. Have you ever posted on Mumsnet prior to just now?

In reply to Tik Tok and my article in the Daily Mail.

My point in the article was not anti breastfeeding. I was trying to say that breastfeeding is not the be and end all of mothering. Breastfeeding counsellors can be wonderful, but I don't think any woman should guilty becuase she can't breastfeed.+

when/if your daughter has a baby, would you be happy with her using Clare Verity's methods?

Verity's method may well have been common in the past, but so was, say, screaming at a 4 year old and making him wear a dunces hat etc. We use our moral and ethical sense to decide that it wouldn't be a good idea to do that to a child in the interests of entertainment - why did you decide that it was a good idea to do that to a newborn baby?

Why are women so horrible to each other?

Intrasexual competition.

The good news is women bitch about each other. Men tend to kill or maim one another. All in all I think we get the better side of that bargain.

And conflict is one side of the coin - on the other side is cooperation. One cannot exist without the other.

Thanks for your answer, Daisy. No one could disagree with you - breastfeeding is indeed not the be all and end all of mothering. No one should feel guilty for not bf. That was not my question

Never mind.

Forget it!

Aren't we all missing the point here? The issue isn't whether or not Claire Verity had qualifications, the real issue is the fact that you don't need any qualifications to be a maternity nurse!

Truby King recommended strict four hourly feeding as did Claire Verity. On the programme Claire Verity forced babies to go without food in order to get them going four hourly, she also dropped the 10pm feed at 12 weeks in order to force them to sleep twelve hours without a feed. Gina Ford does not recommend four hourly feeding until babies are nearly four months, and says babies still need a late feed until weaning is established at six months. Why do you not research these facts properly, before you make statements that are totally untrue ?

in reply to Rose of the Orient
if my daughter ever has a baby, and right now she says not, I hope I would support her in whatever method she chose to use. She would be the mother after all.

those os you who watched BUB will remember that Claire Verity@s routine method was one of three methods shown. In my own immediate family we have practised all three:
I am a wishy washy Spock mother
My youngest sister has a strict routien
and mymiddle sister and sister in law are full on co sleeping breastfeeding Continuum concepts.
all the kids are fine!

TS73 - CV lied about her quals. That is an issue. Being deceitful is not a good sign in someone making a living out of taking sole charge of an infant.

TS73 - Channel 4 employed Verity and allowed her to experiment on newborns without checking her qualifications. Most people know that "maternity nurse" is meaningless, in fact this is why the Nursing and Midwifery Council objected to Channel 4/Verity referring to herself with that title (and resulted in her dropping it).

No, the real issue is the commodification of babies and children, and their transformation into entertainment.

It's fischFrau btw.

I work/worked in television, and pitched to the same person that Daisy would have pitched that series to. I understand very well the pressure to get a commission at anyc cost, and the subtle pressures to push the line of extremity to its limit.

There was a rash of childcare/problem child commissions. After the fifth, you're running out of territory to cover. I understand.

But this really did border on the abusive.

and 'the children are fine' is a really lame answer.

You are an intelligent woman. You must be aware that the effects of a damaged childhood will not necessarily be visible for years to come.

Hi Daisy

You write for the Daily Mail. Do you see a paradox in writing about woman's issues in this women hating publication?

Claire Veity went beyond having a 'strict routine' though.

Can you see why her methods disturbed people? I believe even Gina Ford, who does advocate routine, was appalled at the treatment meted out to those unconsenting babies.

Refusing to cuddle them or look at them is nothing to do with 'routine' and everything to do with callous control. Not healthy at all for a baby.

"As for Claire Verity, well she came highly recommended by the mothers who had used her in the past. And the parents who used her in the programme were delighted with her."

Why did you use Claire Verity who no one had heard of, instead of Jo Tantum, Jo Frost or Gina Ford who have all written books about routine based methods that are used today ?

Why do you feel tha because all the parents were delighted with Claire Verity, it gives you the right to produce a programme that many said was tantamount to child abuse ?

Oh, I thought tiktok's question was really interesting. I wish you had answered it, Daisy. I am always interested to know the motivation behind the polemic articles in these columns. Are you thinking of the mortgage payments, or do you really believe in what you are saying?