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Webchat with Jeremy Corbyn, leader of the Labour Party, Tuesday 30 May at midday

922 replies

BojanaMumsnet · 26/05/2017 15:38

Hello,

We’re pleased to announce a webchat with the leader of the Labour Party Jeremy Corbyn on Tuesday 30 May at midday.

Jeremy has been MP for Islington North since 1983, and has been Labour leader since 2015, having been re-elected when Owen Smith stood against him in 2016. Labour’s manifesto for the election on June 8 proposes ‘a Brexit deal that puts our economy and living standards first’, tax rises for the top 5% of earners, the renationalisation of the railways, free school meals for all primary pupils, the abolition of university tuition fees, and a £250 billion investment fund for infrastructure and the economy.

Please do join the chat on Tuesday at midday, or if you can’t make it, leave a question here in advance. Please do share the webchat on social - the more, the merrier!

As always, please remember our webchat guidelines - one question each, follow-ups if there’s time and please keep it civil .

(As we approach the General Election we will endeavour to offer you a balanced diet of webchats with politicians from different parties. More announcements coming soon.)

Thanks
MNHQ

Webchat with Jeremy Corbyn, leader of the Labour Party, Tuesday 30 May at midday
Thread gallery
8
Charmageddon · 31/05/2017 18:08

I would be really interested in your opinion on the LSE report

I think it's pretty fair - there's been an obvious anti-Corbyn theme running since he won the 1st leadership election.

Ironically, I think that it's had the opposite effect - people are fickle & contrary & will do the opposite of what they're outright demanded to - and it's been anything but subtle! It's been out & out ordering us to hate him.

Charmageddon · 31/05/2017 18:10

Ok, I'm done with talking seriously with you. Forget what I said above about being interested what you think about the LSE report. You throw extremely serious accusations around as though these things don't really matter or should be spoken about with precision and care.

He did!

But we'll never ever agree on that, so I concede.

muckypup73 · 31/05/2017 19:40

JanetBrown private companies on behalf of the government

muckypup73 · 31/05/2017 19:46

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/arms-sales-saudi-arabia-theresa-may-staunch-defence-keep-people-streets-britain-safe-a7230836.html

Theresa May has staunchly defended selling arms to Saudi Arabia despite the country facing accusations of war crimes, insisting close ties “keep people on the streets of Britain safe”.

Jeremy Corbyn called on the Prime Minister to halt those sales because of the “humanitarian devastation” caused by a Saudi-led coalition waging war against rebels in Yemen.

muckypup73 · 31/05/2017 19:48

www.amnesty.org.uk/how-isis-islamic-state-isil-got-its-weapons-iraq-syria

Irresponsible arms transfers by countries including the UK, USA, Russia, China, Germany and France have provided the armed group with a huge and lethal arsenal.

For years, weapons of war have been freely flowing into Iraq. Slack controls over Iraqi military stockpiles and endemic corruption by successive Iraqi governments have added to the problem.

When Islamic State (IS) took control of these areas, these weapons were theirs for the taking. These weapons, manufactured at least 25 countries, are now in the hands of ISIS and being used to commit horrific abuses, killings, rape, torture and abduction – and forced thousands to flee their homes.

‘Decades of free-flowing arms into Iraq meant that when IS took control of these areas, they were like children in a sweetshop.

‘The fact that countries including the UK have ended up inadvertently arming IS, should give us pause over current weapons deals.’

Oliver Sprague, Arms Programme Director at Amnesty 

Most of the arms date from the 1970s up to the 1990s, including pistols, handguns and other small arms, machine guns, anti-tank weapons, mortars and artillery.
How did this happen?

We’ve found ISIS use of arms and ammunition from at least 25 different countries – a large proportion were originally sourced by the Iraqi military from the USA, Russia and former Soviet bloc states.

The huge scope reflects decades of irresponsible arms transfers to Iraq, coupled with the failure to install oversight mechanisms during the US-led occupation after 2003.

Slack controls over military stockpiles and endemic corruption by successive Iraqi governments have added to the problem.

Among ISIS’s arsenal are portable air defence systems, guided anti-tank missiles and armoured fighting vehicles, as well as assault rifles like the Russian AK series and the US M16 and Bushmaster.

NettleTea · 31/05/2017 21:51

If you doubt that the UK sells arms, via legal loopholes, to restricted countries, then you should take a read of this book

www.amazon.co.uk/Used-Famous-Nelson-Mandela-Underground/dp/0091909228?tag=mumsnetforum-21

It was so easy to do he actually helped a set of convent school kids set up a legal gun running operation as a school project

NoLotteryWinYet · 01/06/2017 07:12

Old labour, new jam? Free jam for all!

horsemadmom · 01/06/2017 16:10

Beachcomber et al,
Just a quick explanation for how Corbyn supports both Islamist terrorists and the IRA- it comes down to his (and McDonnel's and Abbott's) Liberationist world view. Any movement or group which is seen as a Liberationist movement, no matter how vile, gets his support. This comes out of their 'anti-colonialist' activism and has become perverted over the years. This world view also takes into account the skin colour of both sides in any conflict. It preaches that darker skinned people are inherently disadvantaged . Notice that they have nothing to say about Assad in Syria? Except for McDonnel headlining a rally and speaking in front of Assad's baathist flag.
In Corbyn's view, the IRA were a liberation movement fighting colonial oppression, the Palestinians are a liberation movement against Israeli Jews (ignoring the still stateless Palestinians denied citizenship in a majority Palestinian country- Jordan. Both sides a bit brown so they don't care). No fuss made over Tibet or Kashmir- again, same colour.
Corbyn's world view doesn't care precisely WHAT is done in the name of Liberation. Oppress women- well we can't impose our morals. Throw gays off buildings- well it's their culture. Bomb, rape, drive trucks into crowds of pedestrians- well we must understand their frustration.

It would take you 5 minutes to google 'Corbyn antisemitism' and you will easily find his own words , both written and spoken, plus those of his associates. Please don't fall for the idea that Corbyn is some sort of peacemaker. He never speaks to the other side in any conflict. Just his FRIENDS.
I beg you to do some googling before you vote. My safety and that of my children is at risk if Corbyn wins.

YouWhatMate · 01/06/2017 16:50

It would take you 5 minutes to google 'Corbyn antisemitism' and you will easily find his own words , both written and spoken, plus those of his associates. Please don't fall for the idea that Corbyn is some sort of peacemaker. He never speaks to the other side in any conflict. Just his FRIENDS.
I beg you to do some googling before you vote. My safety and that of my children is at risk if Corbyn wins

I'm googling, but I just can't find any direct quotes of anti-semitism from him.

Could you give us some links?

JanetBrown2015 · 01/06/2017 18:27

I am a Tory but even I do not think Corbyn is anti semitic. he is a fair man with good principles. TYou also get mud slinging in elections.

No Government sells arms - I see now people agree with me. Private sector companies sell arms under both Labour and Tory Government and there are restrictions and export control laws on which nations they can be sold to.

Beachcomber · 01/06/2017 19:05

horsemadmom, thanks for that explanation which I found as patronising as it was scaremongering as it was unpleasant.

I repeat, if posters really believe their safety is a risk then what are you doing other than posting on here about it? Call the authorities, get in touch with Mrs May.

Did you watch the leader's debate last night? If you did, you may have noticed that the only leader who attempted the "are Hamas your friends?" tactic with Corbyn was Paul Nuttel. You might want to reflect on that. All the other leaders, including Amber Rudd totally ignored Nuttel (as did the presenter).

Beachcomber · 01/06/2017 19:31

And I've already googled Corbyn on antisemitism and found his speech on the Chakrabarti report which sounds anything but antisemitic:

“The Labour Party is built on the values of solidarity, social justice, equality, internationalism and human rights. That is why I have devoted my life to it, and why nine months ago, I was honoured to be elected leader by over a quarter of a million people. That is, by the way, substantially more than the entire electorate that will have the right to pick the Conservative Prime Minister this Autumn.

“After the tumultuous events of the past week in Britain, including the vote in last week’s referendum to leave the European Union, the need for us to unite around these values, to practice what we preach, and be judged by the highest of standards, is perhaps as great as it has ever been.

“So although I asked Shami Chakrabarti to carry out her inquiry after some disturbing and damaging incidents earlier this year, I believe that its findings and recommendations are of even more importance for our party, country and wider world today.

“Whatever your views on the outcome of the referendum campaign – and two thirds of Labour supporters voted Remain – we need to reflect for a few moments on some of the hateful language used by some of the most prominent participants in it.

“Boris Johnson, current favourite to lead the Tory party, compared Hitler’s murderous tyranny with the European project created from its ashes and questioned Barack Obama’s motives because of his “part-Kenyan heritage”.

“That was no dog whistle. That was a fog horn - a classic racist trope – casting doubt on someone’s motivation because of their race.

“The Justice Secretary Michael Gove compared pro-Remain economists to Nazi collaborators, a startling example of the way in which the Nazi regime and the Holocaust can be minimized, trivialized or even forgotten by ill-judged comparisons.

“And Nigel Farage warned of mass sex attacks should the Remain Campaign win, calling it the “nuclear bomb” of the Brexit campaign. Is it only me who just doesn’t find him funny any more?

“These are hateful comments - no question. They are unworthy of the millions who voted to Leave, not out of xenophobia or racism, but often as a desperate response - yes to austerity, but also to years of being ignored and left behind by the Westminster elite.

“The people of Britain - and especially the young - need a strong, united, principled and kind Labour Party more than ever. They didn’t crash the banks, heat up the planet or start the wars of the past decade or so. But the risk is that they will have to work harder for longer, quite possibly for less pay, because of what the powerful have done in their name.

“Divide and rule is the oldest trick in the book - whether used by imperial powers abroad or hate-mongers at home. Turn people against each other. Use race or religion or anything else you can find and hope they will be too distracted or consumed to take on the great inequalities of wealth and power in the world.

“For over a hundred years, the Labour Party of Keir Hardie, Ellen Wilkinson and Manny Shinwell has existed to offer working people another way: solidarity instead of division, equality instead of injustice, inclusion instead of isolation, internationalism instead of narrow nationalism, and human rights for all.

“But we cannot do our duty, if we do not look at ourselves as well. Say what you like about me, but I’m no hypocrite. When I look in the mirror, it is less for sartorial elegance than to examine what’s in my own eye before pointing out the specks in others. I urge others in politics to do the same.

“This is why I asked Shami Chakrabarti and her colleagues to take on the vital work of looking into our own Party before we criticise others. That is what she and her team have done.

“And I’m here today to launch and recommend their work to our Party and to put my weight behind its immediate implementation.

“Under my leadership, the Labour Party will not allow hateful language or debate, in person, online or anywhere else. We will aim to set the gold standard, not just for anti-racism, but for a genuinely welcoming environment for all communities and for the right to disagreement as well.

“Racism is racism is racism. There is no hierarchy - no acceptable form of it. I have always fought it in all its forms and I always will. But while we respond to hate with universal principles we must also remember people’s particular experience, if we are too ensure that not one person feels vulnerable or excluded from their natural political home.

“The Jewish community has made an enormous contribution to our Party and our country – Jewish people have been at the heart of progressive and radical politics in Britain, as elsewhere, for well over a century.

“But they are also a minority amongst minorities and have had good cause to feel vulnerable and even threatened throughout history. This should never happen by accident or design in our Labour Party. Modern antisemitism may not always be about overt violence and persecution, though there is too much of that even to this day. We must also be vigilant against subtler and invidious manifestations of this nasty ancient hatred and avoid slipping into its traps by accident or intent.

“For the avoidance of doubt, I do not believe in name calling and I never have. “Zio” is a vile epithet that follows in a long line of earlier such terms that have no place in our Party. Nor should anyone indulge in the kind of stereotyping that can cause such hurt and harm.

“To assume that a Jewish friend or fellow member is wealthy, part of some kind of financial or media conspiracy, or takes a particular position on politics in general, or on Israel and Palestine in particular, is just wrong.

“Our Jewish friends are no more responsible for the actions of Israel or the Netanyahu Government than our Muslim friends are for those of various self-styled Islamic states or organisations. Nor should Muslims be regarded as sexist, antisemitic or otherwise suspect, as has become an ugly Islamophobic norm. We judge people on their individual values and actions, not en masse.

“No one should be expected either to condemn or defend the actions of foreign powers on account of their faith or race. At the same time, we should have the sensitivity to understand how upset many Labour party members and supporters are likely to feel about various human rights abuses around the world.

“Human rights language is so much more accurate and persuasive than the kind of language that was often resorted to in the Brexit debate. That is no doubt acceptable in other places and other parties, but it shouldn’t be here, on my watch, or in our name.

“I will continue - as Labour Leader - to pursue the causes of peace and justice in Israel-Palestine, the wider Middle East and all over the world. But those who claim to do so with hateful or inflammatory language do no service to anyone, especially dispossessed and oppressed people in need of better advocacy.

“Of course we as Labour Party members must all be free to criticise and oppose injustice and abuse wherever we find it. But as today’s Report recommends, can we please leave Hitler and Nazi metaphors alone (especially in the context of Israel). Why? Because the Shoah is still in people’s family experience. If every human rights atrocity is described as a Holocaust, Hitler’s attempted obliteration of the Jewish people is diminished or de-recognised in our history. Other human rights atrocities from African slavery to the killing fields of Cambodia, the Armenian and Rwandan Genocides are all of course to be remembered, but diluting their particularity or comparing degrees of evil does no good.

“Pursuing a more civil discourse does not in any way mean stifling free speech. I for one, will continue to meet, discuss and debate with all-comers in the cause of peace, progress, justice and human rights around the world. Though I acknowledge the need for the Party’s Leader to spread his or her time around a greater range of issues, I do not believe that anyone should be judged for the platforms they share or the human rights causes they take up, as long as they fight hate with every breath.

“And to those who have been afraid of so-called “witch-hunts” by the press in recent months, those who perhaps worry that debate and speech around difficult and important issues risks being shut down in our Party: I commend and endorse the Report’s recommendations about improving natural justice, transparency, consistency and accountability in the conduct of Party discipline.

“But not being racist and not being hateful is not enough for our Party to be the inclusive and vibrant political movement that Britain so sorely needs. If we are to unite and lead our country we must be the most welcoming and empowering place in which our diverse communities can prosper.

“I am very concerned about the Report’s findings on how too many black and minority ethnic members of our party have felt for too long. We must act against long term “special measures” placing local parties under limited democracy. I will also take action with colleagues to seek to improve the representation of black and minority people at every level of staffing and leadership within the Labour Party.

“We will work with our Trade Union affiliates and others to achieve the best programme of activist and leadership education possible. We will talk, read, learn and organise together. We will learn from each other’s personal experiences but also share each other’s considerable campaigning and political skills.

“The last year - with all of its highs and lows - has left me with every confidence that Labour is has the potential to be a powerful and transformatory movement, capable of winning the next General Election (whenever it comes), and many more elections after that.

“But my confidence and optimism are not naive. We all know that despite the overwhelming mandate I was given by Labour party members and supporters last year - we’ve all had a torrid few days.

“Whatever now takes place in our party, politics should be conducted in a decent manner. When I stood for the leadership last summer I called for a kinder, gentler politics, that’s still work in progress.

“Some people may equate “leadership” with nastiness. I disagree. Decency is no disqualification for leadership – in fact it should be a pre-requisite.

“Those loyal to my leadership, and to Labour’s core values, want to pursue the new politics with decency and civility, and see strength and not weakness in living those values.

“I ask Labour people to do as I do. To be kind and respectful to each other and our neighbours, and to be as courteous as we are courageous with our opponents.

“I believe that approach to be closer to the values of the British people than so much of what they have witnessed on the political stage over many recent years.

“I want to express huge thanks to Shami Chakrabarti, David Feldman and Jan Royall, as well as to Deok Joo Rhee and Godric Jolliffe – and all who submitted their views and took part in this comprehensive exercise.

“Britain deserves better - so let’s offer it. Come together as a party and then unite and lead our country through these incredibly challenging times. “

Charmageddon · 01/06/2017 20:29

horsemadmom, thanks for that explanation which I found as patronising as it was scaremongering as it was unpleasant.

And this, horsemadmom, is why you should never try to deploy reasoned discourse or debate with the Corbyn-converted.

If you're not 'in' the group, you're 'other' - cast in the role of scaremonger or liar.

They don't 'do personal' - unless it's against a legitimised group (i.e. anyone not 'in' the Corbyn-converted circle).

It's cult-like & it's scary.

OlennasWimple · 01/06/2017 20:46

JC may not be antisemitic himself, but he associates with antisemites and has been accused (repeatedly) of not doing enough to challenge and counter those in the Labour party who say or do something that is antisemitic.

For example, if Ken Livingston had made similar comments about Africans or Muslims or other minority groups (except perhaps women), can you really imagine the Labour leadership taking so long to take firm disciplinary action against him?

NoLotteryWinYet · 01/06/2017 21:17

Corbyn didn't do anywhere near enough to crack down on what Livingstone said. What happened with Coyne at Unite stank, what happened to the moderates in the PLP similarly stank. Corbyn is not a consensus politician, you need to be a consensus politician in order to lead - especially a coalition - there is no evidence that he can, he's surrounded himself with people who completely share his views.

Beachcomber · 01/06/2017 23:06

OlennasWimple, out of interest, do you know what Livingstone said?

OlennasWimple · 01/06/2017 23:17

Beach - amongst other things, he supported an antisemitic Facebook post shared by Naz Shah, who apologised for the post, stood down from her position as aide to (I think) the Shadow Chancellor and acknowledged that her words were harmful.

I think you were leading me to say that he said that Hitler was a Zionist...

Charmageddon · 01/06/2017 23:32

Amongst other things:

Jewish Journalist Oliver Feingold.
Asked Livingstone for a comment about a birthday party he was just leaving - Livingstone got angry and Feingold responded that he was ‘only doing his job’. Livingstone said that Feingold was "like a Nazi war criminal for using that defence".

The journalist told him that he was Jewish and he objected to that - Livingstone told the journalist that his paper was ‘was a load of scumbags and reactionary bigots’ and that it had a record of supporting Fascism.

Instead of just apologising after the event, Livingstone did what all the best regressive left do, and attempted to make the Jewish person the one at fault - for daring to suggest that Livingstone had been in the wrong.

He wrote an article in The Guardian which criticised the occupation of the West Bank and said:
"For far too long the accusation of antisemitism has been used against anyone who is critical of the policies of the Israeli government, as I have been"

In other words - I am the 'victim' in this. I am being persecuted unfairly by 'a Jew' purely because I am critical of Israel.
No mention at all of the fact that someone else had been personally offended by his shitty turn of phrase, and that he was sorry.

This is not the first time he has done this sort of thing, and wasn't the last either - Diane Abbott, John McDonnell & Jeremy Corbyn use the same tried & tested techniques to obfuscate any accusations levelled at them.

Anyone who is white is a colonialist, and therefore forever in the wrong (although they do include some BAME within the colonialist collusion umbrella too, if it fits with their narrative).

YouWhatMate · 02/06/2017 00:00

It would take you 5 minutes to google 'Corbyn antisemitism' and you will easily find his own words , both written and spoken, plus those of his associates. Please don't fall for the idea that Corbyn is some sort of peacemaker. He never speaks to the other side in any conflict. Just his FRIENDS.
I beg you to do some googling before you vote. My safety and that of my children is at risk if Corbyn wins

I'm googling, but I just can't find any direct quotes of anti-semitism from him.

Could you give us some links?

Beachcomber · 02/06/2017 00:01

OlennasWimple, thanks for replying. I wasn't trying to lead you into saying that. Honest.

I genuinely wondered what you thought he said. The reason I wondered was because I'm struggling to think of a similar comment / equivalent he could have made about Africans or Muslims.

I'm uncomfortable with Corbyn being called antisemitic due to something Livingstone said. Especially as there was quite a controversy over whether his comment was antisemitic, antizionist or neither.

horsemadmom · 02/06/2017 08:31

www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201617/cmselect/cmhaff/136/136.pdf

I just don't have time to dig up more. Corbyn and his friends are dangerous.

DJBaggySmalls · 02/06/2017 08:33

horsemadmom
Tory policies are killing people. Two people die of hunger or thirst every day in an NHS hospital, and they wont even keep figures on the numbers of disabled people that are dying after benefit sanctions of being forced to work.

horsemadmom · 02/06/2017 10:10

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/stop-the-war-linked-to-putin-puppets-s6fdwq968
<a class="break-all" href="https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/corbyn-is-security-risk-says-ex-minister-g5939tg9lhdwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/twitter-picture-flags-up-an-uncomfortable-link-to-syria-sqcw0h6xbwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/palestinian-lobby-group-paid-for-corbyn-to-meet-assad-in-syria-jv5hrsjflwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/hamas-supporter-gave-cash-to-corbyn-leadership-bid-jm7qvmpkcmhwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/corbyn-linked-to-lobbyists-behind-istanbul-bombers-hbb3hhdb6www.express.co.uk/news/politics/599327/Jeremy-Corbyn-Deir-Yassin-Remembered-holocaust-Paul-Eisenwww.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/20/jeremy-corbyns-10-year-association-group-denies-holocaust/hurryupharry.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/cpgbcorbyn-300x187.jpg" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.thetimes.co.uk/article/corbyn-is-security-risk-says-ex-minister-g5939tg9lhdwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/twitter-picture-flags-up-an-uncomfortable-link-to-syria-sqcw0h6xbwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/palestinian-lobby-group-paid-for-corbyn-to-meet-assad-in-syria-jv5hrsjflwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/hamas-supporter-gave-cash-to-corbyn-leadership-bid-jm7qvmpkcmhwww.thetimes.co.uk/article/corbyn-linked-to-lobbyists-behind-istanbul-bombers-hbb3hhdb6www.express.co.uk/news/politics/599327/Jeremy-Corbyn-Deir-Yassin-Remembered-holocaust-Paul-Eisenwww.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/20/jeremy-corbyns-10-year-association-group-denies-holocaust/hurryupharry.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/cpgbcorbyn-300x187.jpg

When Labour crashes the economy, you really will see people dying. I'm horrified that you could ignore Corbyn's 'friends'. Another country did that once- ignored the hatefulness of a politician who promised prosperity for all- it did not work out well.

BishopBrennansArse · 02/06/2017 10:17

Oh ok so disabled people dying aren't real people so don't count?

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