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Mumsnet webchats

WEBCHAT GUIDELINES: 1. One question per member plus one follow-up. 2. Keep your question brief. 3. Don't moan if your question doesn't get answered. 4. Do be civil/polite. 5. If one topic or question threatens to overwhelm the webchat, MNHQ will usually ask for people to stop repeating the same question or point.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

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MNHQ

Webchat with Jennifer Perry from Digital-Trust on digital abuse, Wednesday 16 September at 12pm

48 replies

BojanaMumsnet · 14/09/2015 16:57

Hello

We're pleased to announce a webchat with Jennifer Perry, the Director and CEO of Digital-Trust, following our webchat with Graham Cluley on computer security. We invited Jennifer after a few Mumsnetters asked for a webchat with her because of her particular expertise in advising on digital security issues in abusive relationships. Digital-Trust provides technical expertise to victims of digital abuse and organisations working with them. One example of the advice they provide is recognising the warning signs of a stalker.

Jennifer is a leading expert on digital abuse, cyber stalking and harassment. She has been campaigning for the last ten years on e-victim issues. She has over 20 years in the tech industry.

Jennifer produced the first UK-USA guidelines on cyber risks in domestic violence in 2009, and is the author of these guidelines on stalking and harassment. This guide has been adopted by ACPO and the UK police, stalking charities and domestic violence groups. She has trained hundreds of police officers, social workers, DV professionals and probation officers in issues related to stalking and digital abuse.

Please join us on Wednesday 16 September at 12pm for an hour-long webchat. If you can't make it, do leave a question on this thread in advance. As ever, please remember our webchat guidelines.

Thanks
MNHQ

Webchat with Jennifer Perry from Digital-Trust on digital abuse, Wednesday 16 September at 12pm

Girlwhowearsglasses · 14/09/2015 17:39

That's brilliant. Haven't thought of a question yet....

Girlwhowearsglasses · 15/09/2015 12:17

BUMP

lavenderdaisies · 15/09/2015 15:55

Hi,

I've had a look at the Digital-Trust's website. It's really helpful but I notice there is advice against seeking a restraining or protective order without considering the consequences. What are the consequences, what should people be aware of?

Thanks very much for this webchat.

cozietoesie · 15/09/2015 16:31

Thanks so much for the webchat, MNHQ and Jennifer. I haven't read all the guidelines yet, I'm afraid.

I have some particular concerns (following indirect experience - I wasn't myself the victim) with helping young people eg young teenagers who might think that they are 'in control' of their digital lives but are really wide open to manipulation and abuse mainly because they have limited life experience.

How do you go about helping them without limiting them or possibly destroying what trust they have in you? (I'm sorry if that question is very wide.)

Girlwhowearsglasses · 15/09/2015 20:40

I have watched scenarios play out on Mumsnet of women in abusive relationships where a poster's Dh/P is emotionally or financially abusive and controlling. How do you advise women ensure they access support online via sites link this whilst keeping their posting as unidentifying as possible. I've seen posts where the husband has seen a thread - and the consequences in RL for that woman could be dire. Do you have a checklist for using forums safely - for instance 'how to browse privately', 'how to delete cookies so that visited links aren't highlighted' etc etc.

I think many women's lives have changed for the better after getting help from the mumsnet community so it would be Great to make that as safe as possible.

Often the poster is very vulnerable and unsure of themselves, and may not be internet savvy

joycesmith18 · 15/09/2015 21:23

DontTellTheBride · 16/09/2015 10:06

Hi Jennifer,

I'm concerned about someone in my life at the moment - I haven't yet broached my worries with her, but I wondered whether you could give us your best advice for 1) women protecting themselves from partners online and 2) how/where to seek help if they do find themselves in a situation where they're being attacked/violated online?

Sorry for being vague - but I'd appreciate your advice before I talk to her.
Thanks

ImperialBlether · 16/09/2015 10:54

Hi Jennifer. Thanks so much for coming on here.

On the Relationships board you see many examples of men (usually) who know what their partners are doing. So they'll repeat parts of emails etc. I've always assumed the men have a keylogger on their partner's laptop. Is this legal if you could prove you bought the device? What should a person do if they suspect someone has a keylogger on their laptop?

Regarding other devices, sometimes men seem to know what's been written on phones and tablets. Apart from guessing/seeing the password and checking personally, are there other ways of doing this? How can you find out if that's what's going on?

On the other hand, if a woman was thinking of engaging in some of this herself, can you tell us what is legal, what would stand up in court etc?

Also CCTV - it's legal to have it in your own home, isn't it? Do all members of the household/people entering the house have to be told?

CuriousJones · 16/09/2015 11:25

Is there best practices for finding out whether people you meet online are real or are we all doomed to be Catfish'd ??

DuchessofGrumpyCat · 16/09/2015 11:26

Hi Jennifer,

Can you tell us a bit about your background and how you came to be involved with the Digital Trust?

Thank you.

caramelshortbreadnowplease · 16/09/2015 11:28

Hello

Are there things that internet service providers or big websites (like Facebook) could be doing to protect vulnerable users, or does it really all come down to us protecting ourselves? How much responsibility do you think website administrators and owners should take for abuse that takes place on their sites or platforms, especially if their site is enormous? (Thinking a bit about the problems Twitter has had with personal abuse, and accusations from some of its users that it's not doing enough)

MurielBing · 16/09/2015 11:41

Hi Jennifer,

Are there any apps you can download or any changes to settings on your smartphone that you would recommend?

ScotthasSFB · 16/09/2015 11:59

Hi Jennifer - currently being stalked by the ex here on Mumsnet and generally via the Internet! He's not hiding it - emaling me links to threads I've written - I've changed my name to put him off the scent so I will be reading this with interest later...
Oasis (womans refuge) gave me really good advice - but over the years I became a bit lax...I am so tempted to 'out' him by posting the emails and messages he has sent me but I know it's not worth it. Would feel good though as most of it is just vitriolic, spiteful diatribe...

Expert

JenniferPerry · 16/09/2015 12:00

I'm really pleased to be speaking to you about women's safety issues. As you would expect from Mumsnet we've already have great questions. So, lets get started.

Experts' posts:

Expert

JenniferPerry · 16/09/2015 12:04

@lavenderdaisies

Hi,

Thanks very much for this webchat.

The issues around Non-molestation or restraining orders is the enforcement. When it comes to domestic abuse we have to worry about "triggers" which can cause the abuser to react and possibly put someone in more danger. Restraining order can be a significance trigger.

So, it is important that if you take out one that you are aware of the possible trigger and increase safety.

The other issue is often these orders aren't enforced. When the police don't enforce an order it says to the abuser "you can do this and get away with it" It can empower the abuser and increase his confidence.

The benefit is if it is enforced you don't have to prove domestic abuse but can get an arrest based on a breach. If you have a proactive police force this can be very useful unfortunately not all police force will enforce or arrest a breach.

Experts' posts:

IdleDoughnut · 16/09/2015 12:07

Hello,

Do you have thoughts about trolls and anonymous online abuse from people who you don't know in real life? Are you a 'engage and argue' person or a 'block and ignore' person?

Expert

JenniferPerry · 16/09/2015 12:10

@cozietoesie

Thanks so much for the webchat, MNHQ and Jennifer. I haven't read all the guidelines yet, I'm afraid.

How do you go about helping them without limiting them or possibly destroying what trust they have in you? (I'm sorry if that question is very wide.)

Coercive control is the biggest form of domestic abuse but until recently there wasn't a law against it. The law on coercive control hasn't come into force which means they can't arrest using the new law. We expect that to come into force in November. But it will be a difficult case to prosecute until the police/CPS get some practise.

Coercive control can include making you share your passwords, forcing you to share your PIN, checking text messages, looking at your phone to see where it has been. this surveillance of your activity is abusive behaviour.

We have a guide on how to secure your phone and your online phone account but that won't stop it if they are physically threatening you. If they are you should go to the police. www.digital-trust.org/victims-advice/#/mobile-advice/

Experts' posts:

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/09/2015 12:12

MNHQ: can you sticky this thread in Active?

Expert

JenniferPerry · 16/09/2015 12:12

To add to the above the more confident you are in playing with your mobile the more you will be able to change your settings. Young people havea and advantage here. Also, using instant messaging can be safer than posting on social media like Facebook. Using an alias and making a seperate email account for social media are also good idea.

Experts' posts:

cozietoesie · 16/09/2015 12:13

You spoke about enforcement. I know a little about the US systems with regard to DV but I'm wondering whether you see any useful lessons that the UK and USA could learn from each other. (And that MN, in 'campaigning mode', could help others work towards?)

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/09/2015 12:15

Hi Jennifer,

Once our data is "out there" do we have any rights regarding eg asking sites to take it down?

Expert

JenniferPerry · 16/09/2015 12:15

@MurielBing

Hi Jennifer,

Are there any apps you can download or any changes to settings on your smartphone that you would recommend?

We have a lot of advice on mobile settings. There are a few apps that are useful. If you are afraid and someone is a threat PanicGuard is a good app because it has an alarm but more importantly if you trigger the alarm it calls crime stoppers. They can listen to what is happening and call the police and give them your current location. Also, there is an evidence app that I recommend that collects videos and secures them so they are able to be used as evidence. I can't remember it but will post it here later today.

Experts' posts:

ImperialBlether · 16/09/2015 12:16

Sorry for the second question, but if there's time I hope you can answer it.

There is a huge problem with voyeur websites, where men (usually) take photos of women without their knowledge or consent, sometimes even when they are asleep. Isn't this against the law? How come websites like this aren't closed down, given the material is illegal? I know another one would pop up but it's depressing to know certain sites have been open for years. Is it just that they're operating from a country which doesn't have the same laws? Would a British set-up be closed down?

MNHQ

RowanMumsnet · 16/09/2015 12:16

@ItsAllGoingToBeFine

MNHQ: can you sticky this thread in Active?

Apologies - we've stuck it to the top with extra glue now

ImperialBlether · 16/09/2015 12:18

So when would you use the PanicGuard app? After calling 999?

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