Archaeologists are DNA testing some bones they've found to see if they might be the remains of Richard III. Are there any other members of the Royal Family....

[seeker]

where DNA testing might produce interesting results?

I am in heaven reading this thread.

What I still don't understand is how Henry V111 was so venerated?

He was a monster, yet Elizabeth 1 was proud to be his descendant, referred to it several times in her speeches to parliament, etc.

Good question KatieScarlett. I mean, he was appalling.

But imagine ... she grew up knowing her father had had her mother killed, and either it was true her mother had slept around with several people including her own brother, or it was true her dad had had the charges trumped up in order to kill her mother for not giving him boys.

I think it might almost be easier to fall back on deciding he was a hero and she'd always talk about him that way. Good propaganda, as well, but I think it would be fairly natural too, to do that to survive.

Isn't it because he established the CofE?

That must be a contributing factor, I think.

Although he did it entirely for his own ends, I think he's seen as liberating us from the Pope and Catholic Oppression.

Proud islanders and all that.

Great thread.

The most sympathetic portrayal of Henry V111 I have ever read was in Margaret George's (excellent) Bio of Henry V111. And even then his justification for executing Anne B was madness (she was a witch?).

Are there any other books I've missed that attempt to get inside the mind of Henry?

I think Elizabeth did that more than Henry, really, though. But I agree he's seen as the founder.

He was obviously immensely charismatic: I'm sure that helps too.

I think if you have a system based entirely on inherited power not a meritocracy, you're going to be quick to emphasise links to prove your legitimate right to power, whether your Dad was an vicious deranged old lunatic who chopped your mum's head off or not.

Can't believe no one has mentioned The Sunne in Splendour by Sharon Penman yet, that's my favourite of books about Richard III

Elizabeth was only 3 when her mother was executed, she then was old enough to know about a bewildering array of new "mothers". One died in childbirth, the next one was allegedly precontracted, the one after that (her cousin?) was executed and the last one was saved by the old tyrant dying. As was mentioned upthread, Henry had her declared a bastard and divorced her mother in addition to beheading her by dredging up the fact that he had an affinity with Anne via Mary Boleyn. Which he knew about beforehand, obviously.

And wasn't Henry essentially a catholic in his beliefs? He only split from Rome because Anne was upduffed and he wanted a legitimatemale heir. Had Clement been a bit more amenable (and less afraid of Catherines nephew) it would never have happened.

But no-one liked Anne Boleyn in the first place, so (as horrid as it is) most were glad she was gone.

I feel sorry for her poor brother and the other people executed at the same time.

I also hate the fact that is was okay for Henry to get his jollies with other people, yet when Anne was suspected (and it was never really proven, unlike with Katherine Howard) he was outraged.

katie - yes, he was essentially Catholic.

I wonder who he'd have married next, if he hadn't died.

Wan't Katherine Howard's problem that she admitted to sex before she even met Henry ?

Culpepper denied having had sex with her, although I have read somewhere he admitted he would have liked to...

There was no evidence against Anne, except Mark Smeatons dubious confession. The rest was hearsay made up by Cromwell.

LRD I think he would have had Katherine Parr executed for being a Lutheran and would have moved on to yet another poor victim.

Katherine Willoughby?

Clytaemnestra I think someone did mention Penman's "The Sunne in Splendour" somewhere upthread. I loved it too, as I do most of her work, although I have to say I struggled with her latest, "Lionheart". Too much telling, not enough story.

I see Phillipa Gregory has a book about Anne Neville just out. Has anyone read it yet? Any good?
On the topic of Richard I, I read Sharon Penman's Lionheart on my holiday this year. I loved it.

Funny xpost there!

...and he lost all the crown jewels and treasure in the Wash quicksand LaQueen. That's not gonna go down well, is it.

I find that really upsetting as well LaQueen :( I have a bit of a girl crush on Anne Boleyn. She wasn't perfect, by any stretch of the imagination. But what a woman.

Hi Themum, great minds, eh.
I just felt she was recouching the history book for pages on end rather than telling me a story.
I've got Kingmakers Daughter waiting for me on my bedside table for tonight. , Fresh sheets on the bed, glass of wine, new book, bliss.