Refugee crisis: please take our survey to let us know where you stand

[SarahMumsnet]

Good afternoon, everyone.

Many of you will have seen the thread started by Theremustbesomething suggesting that Mumsnet consider campaigning for the government to change its policy towards asylum seekers fleeing from war zones.

Justine posted this morning to say that "we think that the best way forward is to poll all users to gauge support for this. While it's clear from this thread that many feel extremely passionately about the need to do more, we've had a look at other threads on the subject, and there are a range of views. As a rule we don't campaign for political change unless we're clear that it's something that a substantial majority of Mumsnetters support, so we'd need to be sure of that before committing to an 'official' campaign."

We've now set up the poll; you can fill it in here. We'd be grateful if as many of you as possible could take it, to let us know your views. We'll make sure this thread is prominently displayed across the site.

Thanks very much,
MNHQ

I don't think a few coffee slurping MNs are really going to help in such a complex situation which involves many areas of the Middle East.

As pps have said it isn't good to encourage families to make trips that risk their children's lives. And why wouldn't they go to local refugee camps or go to the camps in Hungary?

If Cameron is taking refugees from UN camps then that seems sensible IMO. I can't see what else can be done. Most vulnerable women and children will be in local camps. It is not sexist to say that fit young men with no dependents come further down the list.

Something clearly has to be done, but what is anyone's guess - including the supposed powers that be.

The quota system will be a joke. When you see trains of people chanting "Germany" they are not going to meekly head off to Bulgaria if that is where they are allocated.

a few coffee slurping MNs

Goodness.

Is that really what you think of the professors, caregivers, engineers, barristers, translators, first generation immigrants, doctors, vicars, school cleaners, astrophysicists, playwrights, entrepreneurs, nurses, archeologists, film producers, etc, etc, etc, who make up the MN community?

Fascinating.

That's quite a list - well done!

Wasn't having a bunfight Atticus, just made the mistake of commenting in the first place and then where does one stop?

Personally, I still don't understand the objection to MN adding it's name to all the voices out there. I hear objections, I hear comments like above - that it's pointless (words to the effect) - but what I don't hear is what harm it would actually do?

Peace out and all round.

I agree with most on here that the refugee crisis is appalling. I'm not convinced it's appropriate for MN to campaign. Like atticus said, what specifically is the campaign to be? More boats? From where to where? Open door immigration policy in the UK? Food and shelter? Where? For whom? Paid for by whom? Is MN going to lobby the EU for union-wide refugee quotas perhaps? Or lobby NATO to get rid of Isil so the refugees can all go home?

I get that it's upsetting that children are in danger, but children are in danger all over the world, all the time. Where's the MN campaign for children living in the DRC? This outcry for 'someone to do something' will be short-lived, is mostly about sentimentalism and pays little attention to the geopolitical issues that have created this crisis. I am unconvinced that it's an appropriate issue for MN.

why wouldn't they go to local refugee camps or go to the camps in Hungary?

Because Angela Merkel has promised them a new life in Germany! She's said Germany can take 800,000. So of course people are stampeding across Europe to get to Germany.

why wouldn't they go to local refugee camps or go to the camps in Hungary?

Because those are places of temporary accommodation where you can't start a life or really have a life. You are just breathing air until your country is restabilised and can go home. . . which isn't going to happen anytime in the next decade by the looks of things.

It's also pretty clear that the way to address the current crisis is 1) to agree refugee quotas across the EU and 2) suspend or abolish the principle of free movement across the 28 states. Otherwise all the refugees sent to cold and/or unfriendly countries will just hop straight on a train to somewhere warmer or less racist.

Personally I would be very happy for the UK to take in a huge quota of Syrian refugees in exchange for abolishing free movement in the EU. I think many people in many EU nations would too.

I've filled in the survey, I support this.

70% of Germans want them there and only 30% of Britains. Germansy is worried about its population numbers which are falling with UK likely to exceed Germany's so Germany needs more young people like all these young men and Britain doesn't so it's fairly simple.
Also plenty of them don't want to come here as one said on R4 this morning because of Britain's perceived policy in the Middle East.

Done, I can't look at my DS lovingly, cuddle him and care for him then ignore the suffering of other children just because mine is ok.

This reminds me of the controversy when the BBC refused to broadcast the DEC appeal for Gaza a few years back. IIRR the BBC came out of that looking cowardly and pathetic.

This is above politics, as was the DEC initiative to raise funds and supplies for the Gazan dispossessed.

I'm with HannaClotta and Theremustbesomething all the way.

(As an aside, there was a wonderful moment on the BBC news when enraged interviewee Tony Benn shouted over the anchor to repeatedly broadcast the address to viewers! It's on Youtube if anyone wants to see it.)

I wonder if this campaign goes ahead if mn hq will have the answer of how this is paid for.\in kent the SS have faced 6million pounds extra, they don't know if the government are going to foot the bill or the locals.
that kind of thing needs to be addressed

Exactly JanetBlyton. This is what the mainstream media isn't choosing to write about it - that Germany actually NEEDS migrants and that Angela Merkel isn't just making a kind, humanitarian gesture. She's a shrewd politician with strong support from her electorate doing what is right for the future of Germany (i.e. growing Germany's population to meet its future needs). That she's using it to gain the high moral ground and as a stick to beat other nations with different future needs is clever of her and unfortunate for us, because she's managing to make Britain, Spain, Hungary and any other nation that doesn't need extra people look cold and heartless.

Hello again

Just to address a couple of points some posters have raised (and thanks, genuinely, for all the feedback and comments - we are reading and digesting):

Open self-selecting surveys is how we do things on Mumsnet - it always has been. We don't hold complex demographic data on our users as individuals, nor do we keep a record of users' 'political' viewpoints, so it's difficult for us to do sampling in those senses - so offering a survey, so long as it's very widely promoted and open to all, seems to us to be the best way. For what it's worth, we've had over 2k responses to this one already, which is a pretty high response rate.

On the 'political lobby' point: MN started taking on campaigning activity because so many of our users asked us to. We take great care not to be aligned in terms of party politics, because we know that MNers' allegiances on that score are many and varied; we try to take up only issues that are supported by a great majority of our users (things like our rape myths campaigning, miscarriage care improvement, and trying to address issues faced by parents of children with disabilities and additional needs).

What we're trying to find out with this survey is whether the refugee issue has reached that non-party, above-politics point - and whether a substantial majority of users would like us to get involved. As with all these things, we started the survey because of the very emphatic response (in terms of both sentiment and numbers of posters) to the thread started by Theremustbesomething.

This is not a party political issue - and we should resist any attempts to brand it as such. This is a humanitarian crisis and many of us want our government to know, through as many channels as possible, that we want them to act in a humanitarian manner.

Help families, women and children yes, but not the 97% of healthy males who have abandoned their wives, daughters and babies to their fate.

It is the invisible who are off the social media radar who are too poor to pay people smugglers and may be are disabled, too young or too old who face far worse violence and danger than those who have escaped.

Why isn't there more attention on this?

Help families, women and children yes, but not the 97% of healthy males who have abandoned their wives, daughters and babies to their fate.

Interesting, do you have a source for this? All non party political sources I've seen have said that the women and children are left behind for very different reasons, one of them being that you can transport a man once, but you can prostitute a woman endlessly.

The UK needs migrants too, or at least it does if people want pensions, and I assume they do, given the amounts we pay in NI. The population of the UK is ageing. There aren't enough children being born to maintain the pension pot, we need these migrants to top it up for us and to use their undoubted self-starting skills to enliven our economy.

This thread has been interesting, but I'll probably hide it now. Seeing how much the media has turned human beings into automatons, happily spouting Murdoch approved rhetoric saddens me. I wonder how many would have been saying the same things in the 1930's, also guided by the newspapers? Or in the 50's when my grandmother was forced to run with my mother because my grandfather was incarcerated by a hostile regime? These things always seem to get split along certain lines, those that care and those that don't, I know which side I'd rather be on

If you do have a source for your claim, would you PM it to me please? Facts are always useful

Er, what exactly is the value to our country of a migrant with wife and children, needing housing, education, healthcare? Taking people for humanitarian reasons is an argument, but I don't think a family group is going to be a net contributor.

wot why do you assume that the healthy males have left their wives and babies to their fates? That assumed the worst of people as there are lots of other reasons why the man might go ahead and leave his family.

It seems pretty obvious to me that many families will decide to send the father ahead on the boat ride, which they must know is pretty dangerous, with the plan to find work and send for his family later on. Maybe they can only afford one ticket and this seems like the best option, perhaps they don't want to risk their children drowning, perhaps the father is the strongest swimmer and has the best chance of making it to a new country, and of earning money when he gets there.

They will hope that once he has found a safe place he will be able to bring his family safely and legally to live with him (although this isn't likely to be how things work out).

Done. Support 100%

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