bringing up 2nd child as a muslim

[allybongo66]

Hi,
Where do I start!!!
My eldest daughter (26) is pregnant with her second child - she split up with the father of her 1st child when her daughter was about 1 - she has been in a relationship with her muslim boyfriend for 5ish years and her daughter calls him daddy - she is basically not religious just does the normally xmas, easter etc. He is a practicing muslim though not devout but does the usual religious stuff - mosque on a friday etc. She has told me that the baby is going to be brought up a muslim and is going to have a muslim name aswell ( we are white british). I know it makes me sound racist but I'm defininately not. I have issues with her decision- how can you bring one child up basically atheist and another muslim? How will that play out with the older sister? Is she going to feel pushed out, different? I would prefer that its not brought up with any religion and for the child to make the choice when it's at an age where it can understand the cultural and religious differences and not be forced to follow one path or another. Is one child going to be allowed to eat what she wants and the other only Halal? One child eating pork the other not! It seems like its going to be a total minefield! Also in all the years she has been with him she has not met one member of his family - which I find strange but have been told that they are only introduced to the family when they plan to get married! I feel it's a bit of a kick in the teeth to us as her family that it won't be brought up like us but I suppose I'm just being selfish in that respect, but I do feel that she hasn't thought it through properly. Is there anyone else who's been through this dilemma? Advice and reassurance would be greatly appreciated!

Also sounds me like she does want to be married and his reluctance is making her defensive hence the I don't want to be married/too independent/fisty crap

Zzzz these families in the sense that they value marriage and it has huge significance. Not intentionally disrespectful. And if they want to be lax in their religion thats all good until they disgree on something ie circumcision or halal meat for example. the issues.of older children being left out I won't evem delve into. So horribly unkind

Zzzzz

I don't think feminism gets much of a look in any religion never mind Muslim households.

Maiden maybe you should speak to muslim women then decide how feminist or otherwise they are

I think people are making some pretty racist assumptions, so because he is Muslim he must have 'harems' of other women?!?
Yes it's weird she hasn't met the parents but I imagine this is more due to their old fashioned cultural beliefs than their son who is probably more modern in his outlook and doesn't subscribe to some of the more outdated views about interracial relationships. It's also common for Muslim men to live with their parents until marriage, I know men who have their own properties but still live with their parents and will do until they are in a serious relationship and there is nothing wrong with that. Do his parents/one of his parents perhaps not speak English? This is also common.
I know a few Muslim men and they are all 'moderate' in their views and live a life that is not dissimilar to ours as non religious people. Not eating pork is really not a big deal, and not all muslims even follow this rule nowadays. I know couples where a first child has been raised with no religion but subsequent children with a new partner are raised with some aspects of Islam and it works, because neither side is hardline in their views, but it is important that a mixed race child experiences the cultures and customs of both parents. You can't deny them the experiences that will help them make sense of who they are, mixed children often have a sense of not 'belonging' but exposing them to the cultures that they come from can help them make decisions about who they want to be.

Is the issue here that your DD is an atheist? Just because he would not be permitted to marry her under Islamic Law. She has to be a believer in God. I agree it sounds dodgy but you have to respect your DD's choices and like pp's have said be there to pick up the pieces if needed x

Doesn't sound like he is low key, attends Mosque etc. And many people observe Christian holidays without particularly being religious. I just wondered that if she is not raising her other DD within a religion or follows one herself maybe that may be the issue. Although he may be more moderate, some issues are completely non-negotiable to some Muslim men, such as marrying a "non-believer ". I suspect there is something more to this but I've just discussed this with my DH and he said that while he is free to marry who he wants, his parents would have had major issues with him marrying someone who doesn't believe in God.

I don't have any righteous judgement to proclaim of your daughter's living arrangements and relationship I'm afraid, happily you've already received plenty of those!
Re raising the DC as different religions, personally i would find that really difficult. I can't quite imagine how it would work. Although I'm sure you could make it work if you really wanted to.
We are loosely Christian, if one of the DC wanted to convert to something else I'd support them, but that's different to my mind to actively raising them as Muslim, Christian, Atheist etc.
Although of course, religion is the easiest thing to mould to suit yourself.

Depend what sort of Christian surely? Same with Islam really.
You can feel more comfortable with one belief system then another though. That is ok. I wouldn't really like my DC to convert to Islam, but i would feel more comfortable with Sufism then some of the others. I also wouldn't like them to become Mormon or Christadelphian tbh.

Some of the responses here stand testament to the banality of "choice feminism."

This young woman is allowing herself to be utterly used, and is even crawling around trying to flatter the guy by raising the child in his religion, presumably in an attempt to get the guy to commit (he won't, of course). But it's her choice, so it's totally empowering and who are we to judge?

Legally she can choose to do what she likes, but that doesn't make it a good idea.

*I know men who have their own properties but still live with their parents and will do until they are in a serious relationship and there is nothing wrong with that.! Her daughter calls him Daddy, she pregnant with his child. If that's not serious nothing will be.

If he was Christian would this be an issue?
If they'd been together5 years, he didn't really stop over, the step daughter called him Daddy and she was pregnant with his child yet she she'd never been introduced to his family? Yeah, it would still be a problem and my assumption would be the same - he's married and she's a secret

It's a fair point. If she hasn't met any of the relatives even once, how can she be 100% sure he isn't married already? Wedding rings can be removed.

Even if he isn't, I'd be astonished if the guy committed.

What is the financial setup here? Is the young woman working and supporting herself? As a single mother, I guess she is entitled to some assistance like subsidized childcare (I am not in the UK so I don't know the details of how this would work out). How does that work if you "sort of" have a male partner who is the father of a child and drops in sometimes but doesn't live there? Is he contributing financially to this household, and if so, how does that affect any benefits she may be getting?

Sorry, that should have been "Is he planning on contributing financially to this household"--if their child isn't born yet, I suppose he is not morally obliged to contribute to anything yet. But surely this will have to be worked out going forward.

It's so odd to think you can being a child up as any religion. Surely it's about what the child believes not her parents.

I think faith is the least of the problems in this relationships. People of different faiths marry and live happily and bring up children, if they are committed to each other.

However, this man doesn't even appear to be able to commit to sharing a bed for a whole night, never mind bringing up a child. Fine if your daughter plans to be a single mum, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

Not meeting the parents is a huge red flag. He is 27 and lives at home, but she has no part in his day to day life. How is the baby going to be brought up a Muslim? There is more to faith than diet and name. It sounds as though your daughter knows deep down that she relationship is questionable, but is trying to make the baby part if its father's life.

In the end your daughter will do what she wants to do. However, I'd focus less on her 'boyfriend's' faith and more on the fact that he is treating her like an idiot. Does he plan to support this child financially, or is that also something that, like meeting his family, is apparently 'against his religion?'.

This is a such a cliche. He's married op. I would just humour your daughter and support her. If she is not Muslim herself she will find it difficult to raise a Muslim child and will probably lose interest after a while. The child's father doesn't sounds like he will be very influential if he's not living there. Just go along with it until the reality sets in for her. I have seen this scenario many times, it never ends how your daughter is visualising it.

What is the difference to the child of the father being at work or at his parents house?

The difference would be that somebody who works is (ideally) working so that their child has food, clothes and shelter. Any commitment to provide round the clock care to elderly racist parents (and we have no reason to believe that his parents are either racist or particularly infirm as the OP appears to know nothing about his family) ends when you start bringing children into the world.

Thank you all for your comments. To be fair to him he is a good dad to her daughter and I am 100% sure that he isn't married, previous to them becoming a couple they worked together for a number of years. I know that his siblings are married to white people so the racist parents can't really be an issue. I have always said it isn't going to go anywhere if she's never going to meet his family, but she's a person that know's her own mind and what ever I say goes in one ear and out the other if she doesn't agree with me! Personally I think he is hoping that she doesn't make it to 12 weeks and then there won't be an issue and he won't have to tell his parent's but that's just my opinion.

If i was DD I'd be tempted to turn up on the door but then I'm a bad person.

Think like a few people have said UP just carry on being there and help clean up the mess x

Does he socialise with her family and friends on a regular basis